More Than One Pedal on a Bell Crank?
Moderator: Shoshanah Marohn
-
- Posts: 32
- Joined: 30 Nov 2012 10:15 am
- Location: New York, USA
More Than One Pedal on a Bell Crank?
I noticed that on my Sho-Bud Super Pro that some of the bell cranks have 2 different strings attached to it. Is this OK, or should this be avoided?
- Henry Matthews
- Posts: 3974
- Joined: 7 Mar 2002 1:01 am
- Location: Texarkana, Ark USA
I sometime set up a guitar to have like C pedal pulling 4 & 5 on one bell crank. I'd rather use two but sometimes it's a space issue or no extra bell cranks so I just use one. Also, it's according to type of bell crank whether it will work good or not.
To answer your question, I think it's perfectly acceptable to do that if it pulls smooth and doesn't get in way of other rods or cranks.
To answer your question, I think it's perfectly acceptable to do that if it pulls smooth and doesn't get in way of other rods or cranks.
Henry Matthews
D-10 Magnum, 8 &5, dark rose color
D-10 1974 Emmons cut tail, fat back,rosewood, 8&5
Nashville 112 amp, Fishman Loudbox Performer amp, Hilton pedal, Goodrich pedal,BJS bar, Kyser picks, Live steel Strings. No effects, doodads or stomp boxes.
D-10 Magnum, 8 &5, dark rose color
D-10 1974 Emmons cut tail, fat back,rosewood, 8&5
Nashville 112 amp, Fishman Loudbox Performer amp, Hilton pedal, Goodrich pedal,BJS bar, Kyser picks, Live steel Strings. No effects, doodads or stomp boxes.
One bell crank pulling two different strings? I've never seen that, but I can imagine it with adjacent string pulls like the C pedal on E9th or P7 on C6th. If the leverages required for the 2 pulls are different, it should work.
Hmmm.. there's an idea!
Hmmm.. there's an idea!
-𝕓𝕆𝕓- (admin) - Robert P. Lee - Recordings - Breathe - D6th - Video
-
- Posts: 32
- Joined: 30 Nov 2012 10:15 am
- Location: New York, USA
So far it has worked OK. I bought the guitar used and that was how it was set up. I recently started checking pedal and knee lever travel just to make sure everything is set up correctly and that's when I noticed it. There's 3 of them like that throughout the guitar. I thought about adding more bell cranks but there isn't much room. I guess if its working well I shouldn't worry too much.
- Henry Matthews
- Posts: 3974
- Joined: 7 Mar 2002 1:01 am
- Location: Texarkana, Ark USA
Look at Justice pro light Under pedal steel section. It has one bell crank on C pedal. If Fred does it, it's got to be ok, especially with good sturdy bell cranks. It wouldn't work in a Fessy or Zum type bell crank, the comb type. Works great on Emmons and several othe guitars I've seen. You have to be able to put pulls on different side of bell crank to get them straight.
Henry Matthews
D-10 Magnum, 8 &5, dark rose color
D-10 1974 Emmons cut tail, fat back,rosewood, 8&5
Nashville 112 amp, Fishman Loudbox Performer amp, Hilton pedal, Goodrich pedal,BJS bar, Kyser picks, Live steel Strings. No effects, doodads or stomp boxes.
D-10 Magnum, 8 &5, dark rose color
D-10 1974 Emmons cut tail, fat back,rosewood, 8&5
Nashville 112 amp, Fishman Loudbox Performer amp, Hilton pedal, Goodrich pedal,BJS bar, Kyser picks, Live steel Strings. No effects, doodads or stomp boxes.
- Richard Sinkler
- Posts: 17067
- Joined: 15 Aug 1998 12:01 am
- Location: aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana
- Dan Beller-McKenna
- Posts: 2979
- Joined: 3 Apr 2005 1:01 am
- Location: Durham, New Hampshire, USA
- Contact:
- Richard Sinkler
- Posts: 17067
- Joined: 15 Aug 1998 12:01 am
- Location: aka: Rusty Strings -- Missoula, Montana
I guess it could. I have never had a bellcrank break on the Super-Pro I had, but I didn't have any that were pulling 2 strings, that I remember. Might be worth buying one from Michael Yahl (if he makes them) just to be safe.Dan Beller-McKenna wrote:I might just try this on my super pro. My only concern is the pot metal in those parts: would the stress of a second pull run the risk of breaking the bellcrank?
-
- Posts: 1973
- Joined: 24 Feb 2006 1:01 am
- Location: Old Glory,Texas, USA 79540
-
- Posts: 891
- Joined: 4 Aug 1998 11:00 pm
- Location: Oro Valley, Arizona (deceased)
-
- Posts: 32
- Joined: 30 Nov 2012 10:15 am
- Location: New York, USA
- Tony Prior
- Posts: 14522
- Joined: 17 Oct 2001 12:01 am
- Location: Charlotte NC
- Contact:
I pull 1 and 2 on my Pro 1 which is late 70's, 5 hole cast pullers, also termed the Super Pro system. no issues..
Emmons L-II , Fender Telecasters, B-Benders
Pro Tools 8 and Pro Tools 12
jobless- but not homeless- now retired 8 years
CURRENT MUSIC TRACKS AT > https://tprior2241.wixsite.com/website
Pro Tools 8 and Pro Tools 12
jobless- but not homeless- now retired 8 years
CURRENT MUSIC TRACKS AT > https://tprior2241.wixsite.com/website
- Dan Beller-McKenna
- Posts: 2979
- Joined: 3 Apr 2005 1:01 am
- Location: Durham, New Hampshire, USA
- Contact:
- chris ivey
- Posts: 12703
- Joined: 8 Nov 1998 1:01 am
- Location: california (deceased)
is that what you meant b0b, or did you mean if the leverage required is the same?b0b wrote:One bell crank pulling two different strings? I've never seen that, but I can imagine it with adjacent string pulls like the C pedal on E9th or P7 on C6th. If the leverages required for the 2 pulls are different, it should work.
i'm just trying to picture it all.
Sort of a matter of semantics. Two rods on one bellcrank will occupy different holes. If the two strings require equal leverage, you can't achieve that at the bellcrank. You would have to compensate via changer hole choice. So the ideal situation would be two strings that require just the difference that two different bellcrank holes would give you.
If 100% synchronicity is not totally essential, you can get away with a little more slack in one rod or the other so I wouldn't make a blanket statement that the two strings have to need different leverages....or need the same leverage.
If one obsesses over perfect timing, you might have some trouble getting this timed exactly right.
If 100% synchronicity is not totally essential, you can get away with a little more slack in one rod or the other so I wouldn't make a blanket statement that the two strings have to need different leverages....or need the same leverage.
If one obsesses over perfect timing, you might have some trouble getting this timed exactly right.
I meant what I said. The two pulls need to have different leverages because they are using different holes in the bell crank. If they had the same leverage, they wouldn't be well timed.
-𝕓𝕆𝕓- (admin) - Robert P. Lee - Recordings - Breathe - D6th - Video
- chris ivey
- Posts: 12703
- Joined: 8 Nov 1998 1:01 am
- Location: california (deceased)
- Peter den Hartogh
- Posts: 1001
- Joined: 27 Mar 2010 12:49 pm
- Location: Cape Town, South Africa
- Contact:
- Peter den Hartogh
- Posts: 1001
- Joined: 27 Mar 2010 12:49 pm
- Location: Cape Town, South Africa
- Contact:
-
- Posts: 887
- Joined: 19 Sep 1998 12:01 am
- Location: Austin, Texas
My Sierra is an older model with double-raise/double-lower changers. Since it's a S12U guitar, I'm raising my E string (#4) with three changes: two knees and one pedal. I raise that string to F# with my RKL--not with pedal C as most guitars do. I raise it with pedal 6 for the split that raises the string from Eb back to E when it's also lowered to Eb. It's a standard universal change.
That leaves the E to F change for string #4. It's raised via LKL that pulls a reverse-mounted bell crank on the same axle as the E to F# change. It has a stop that just pulls it a half tone. Simple, but it works. The only drawback is the hex tuning nut is under the guitar--I have to feel around for it. It's a minor inconvenience as it rarely needs to be tuned.
That leaves the E to F change for string #4. It's raised via LKL that pulls a reverse-mounted bell crank on the same axle as the E to F# change. It has a stop that just pulls it a half tone. Simple, but it works. The only drawback is the hex tuning nut is under the guitar--I have to feel around for it. It's a minor inconvenience as it rarely needs to be tuned.