Can you squeeze 5&5 into an S10?

Gary Cosden · Post by **Gary Cosden** » 19 Sep 2014 9:47 am

I recently inquired about having an S10 built with 5 pedals and 5 knee levers and was told â€œno way â€“ it gets too crowded under thereâ€. I guess 4 pedals and 5 knee levers works but not 5 & 5. So Iâ€™m asking anyone who feels they have a reasonably qualified opinion if this really is asking too much? Obviously you can do it easily enough with an SD10 or 1 Â½ wide style so your views may well help me decide how to proceed since I really want to wind up with 5&5. What say You?

Richard Sinkler · Post by **Richard Sinkler** » 19 Sep 2014 10:07 am

It should fit. My first guitar was a ZB with 5 and 5. I'm sure there are many more out there. If a builder says he can't do it, look for one that can. This first guy obviously didn't want your business.

Lane Gray · Post by **Lane Gray** » 19 Sep 2014 10:36 am

Given that they'll make universal 12s with 8&7, I'd say that you CAN do it. I don't think too many makers would balk at 5&5.
If you wanted clustered knees (say 7 knees), then I could TOTALLY understand a builder saying "not on a single body", because the locations of the actual levers and brackets have to contend for space with pulls and bellcranks.

admin · Post by **b0b** » 19 Sep 2014 10:43 am

I play an S-8 with 5+5. It's smaller than any S-10 I've seen, but I wouldn't say that the undercarriage is crowded. I guess it depends on the builder.

Gary Cosden · Post by **Gary Cosden** » 19 Sep 2014 12:13 pm

All great replies. Thanks! I may well look for a used S10 and expand it to a 5&5 configuration and it just seems totally doable to me. Great point about 12 string universals, Lane, and b0b I had forgotten you have an s8 with 5&5. A Desert Rose if I remember correctly.

Fred Justice · Post by **Fred Justice** » 19 Sep 2014 12:31 pm

Gary I don't know who told you you can't
I just built Lenny Amaral an S~10 with 5 pedals and 6 knee levers. And there is only 5-3/4" to work with.
But it can be done. Here's proof.

Larry Allen · Post by **Larry Allen** » 19 Sep 2014 1:11 pm

Been playing ShoBuds and Excels with 6/5 for years..still room for more...Larry

Rich Peterson · Post by **Rich Peterson** » 19 Sep 2014 1:18 pm

It may depend on the builder and his hardware design. No problem on my old MSA Classic S-10, with knee levers fastened to the siderails. If they are attached to the body, it could get crowded.

John Billings · Post by **John Billings** » 19 Sep 2014 1:39 pm

My Davis/Coop S-10. There's still room! 3 and 6. You just gotta be clever!

Richard Sinkler · Post by **Richard Sinkler** » 19 Sep 2014 2:35 pm

Dang Fred. That is one fine looking undercarriage.

I've seen most brands of steel guitars, either in person or on here, and I don't think I have ever seen a guitar that couldn't handle a 5 & 5 setup on an S10.

Jim Hollingsworth · Post by **Jim Hollingsworth** » 19 Sep 2014 2:43 pm

It's a breeze! Call Gary Rittenberry..... He built me an s-10 with 7 pedals. And 5 levers. And it is a killer guitar.

Gary Cosden · Post by **Gary Cosden** » 19 Sep 2014 3:15 pm

Fred that is a fine looking piece of work indeed! Between Fred Justice, Rittenberry. Desert Rose, and others I have a lot to choose from but it does look like the budget is going to dictate a used guitar at his point.

Greg Cutshaw · Post by **Greg Cutshaw** » 19 Sep 2014 4:55 pm

A keyless guitar would have a bit less room underneath. I had Bill at Williams build me a D-10 keyless with 9+8. Looking at the undercarriage it was hard to believe he agreed to do it.

Darvin Willhoite · Post by **Darvin Willhoite** » 19 Sep 2014 6:55 pm

I put 7 and 7 on a compact, custom S12 once. It was tight, but I did it.

Lynn Stafford · Post by **Lynn Stafford** » 20 Sep 2014 9:59 am

Here is a photo of a left-handed MSA S-10 that I worked on a while back for Chris Gabriel, here in Portland. It was a bit challenging to say the least!

Here is a link for more photos:

http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopi ... highlight=

Lee Dassow · Post by **Lee Dassow** » 20 Sep 2014 2:36 pm

Wow Fred, That's really Nice work. What Type of wood is the guitar made out of. T.Lee

Larry Baker · Post by **Larry Baker** » 20 Sep 2014 3:01 pm

I think the Mullen Discovery S10 can be made with 5 and 5.

Mike Perlowin · Post by **Mike Perlowin** » 20 Sep 2014 3:24 pm

Here's an S 10 with 5 and 4 for sale

http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=270753

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 21 Sep 2014 11:55 am

Gary Cosden wrote:I recently inquired about having an S10 built with 5 pedals and 5 knee levers and was told â€œno way â€“ it gets too crowded under thereâ€.

That's absurd. Find another builder.

Richard Sinkler · Post by **Richard Sinkler** » 21 Sep 2014 12:50 pm

Right Donny. There isn't a builder in business today that can't pull that off, unless they just didn't want his business,

Bob Carlucci · Post by **Bob Carlucci** » 22 Sep 2014 1:32 am

5&5 is NO problem with most S10 pedal steels.. Certain S 10 models would be hard, the MSA SS comes to mind.. just too narrow. I have owned MSA, Carter[2], GFI Sho Bud, Fender 800, with 10 changes and never a problem.. Room for more actually. bob

mike nolan · Post by **mike nolan** » 22 Sep 2014 12:39 pm

I have 8 and 7 (7 being the lock lever)on a really small, keyless Williams S-12 Uni.

Jeff Scott Brown · Post by **Jeff Scott Brown** » 22 Sep 2014 6:58 pm

Gary Cosden wrote:I recently inquired about having an S10 built with 5 pedals and 5 knee levers and was told â€œno way â€“ it gets too crowded under thereâ€

I have a GFI Ultra S10 keyless with 5 pedals and 5 knees. When I bought it I asked for it to be built that way and they did. I had no reason to know that might be controversial. I don't know if the way the pedals and levers are configured is a factor but my copedent is described at http://tinyurl.com/jeffscopedent.

Tony Prior · Post by **Tony Prior** » 23 Sep 2014 2:17 am

I would certainly agree with everyone..An S12 is a 7+5 Steel...left to right it's the exact same size as an S10..I wonder why someone would tell you it can't be done ? Maybe they meant THEY can't do it...

The only thing that may be effected is placement of knee levers and the ability to move them an inch or so one direction or the other if desired.

Some nice looking Steels above...!

Gary Cosden · Post by **Gary Cosden** » 23 Sep 2014 8:51 am

I think Tony must be right. My first impression was that this would be easily doable and I think I must be right. I won't throw this person under the bus however. My feeling at this point is that he probably has reasons for not being able or wanting to and he unfortunately chose to blame it on not having room. Maybe thought I would be satisfied with that explanation and just go away? Whatever - next case. I'll be trying to sell some equipment soon to add to what I've saved for a new guitar fund and move on from there. Thanks to all who have chimed in.

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Can you squeeze 5&5 into an S10?

Can you squeeze 5&5 into an S10?

Yes, You Can

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How about a Left-Handed S-10 with 10x5?

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