For Mickey, Troy and others making lesson videos

[Olli Haavisto]

First of all, you are doing a wonderful job, thanks!

I have a suggestion to consider. I have a few students and I`ve found that looking at the teacher`s instrument from the front sometimes confuses the student as to what fret the teacher is on. So, we`ve found that if the student sits beside me, it`s much clearer.
Would it be possible to position the camera overhead so that you`d see the players point of view of the fretboard?
Just an idea, keep up the good work....

[Olli Haavisto]

I turned my lap top upside down for one of Mickeys videos and yes, it does seem easier to see what`s going on. I wonder if there`s a way to flip a youtube video upsidedown on the screen?

[Carl Kilmer]

If you have a program called "Free Flip and Rotate" you can
do whatever you like with the videos. Rotate, or turn upside
and even do a mirror image to reverse the whole image.
I convert the YouTube files to mpg files so I can record
them to DVD's. Sometimes I either turn them upside down,
or do a mirror image, and then split the whole thing into
short pieces and save each piece as a chapter. Then I can
work on each piece one at a time until I figure it out.

[Mike Neer]

When I was making my first video for Four Wheel Drive, I had a similar request from some folks and after exploring my options I figured out how to flip the video using my editing software. The camera was actually in front of the steel in this shot:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HglNakyxTw0

[Franklin]

When I was making my first video for Four Wheel Drive, I had a similar request from some folks and after exploring my options I figured out how to flip the video using my editing software. The camera was actually in front of the steel in this shot:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HglNakyxTw0

Is this an optical illusion due to the software flipping image? Visually, the bar is consistently placed behind the fret. If the software does this, its important beginning students understand this is not a good visual of bar positioning.

Paul

[Stuart Legg]

There is no doubt that these folks are good players and the videos are great.
I don’t mean to sound negative about doing something different with the viewing angle.
Here is the big “buts” .
These same folks will tell you not to learn songs by tab and I see no difference in tab and showing someone note for note on a video.
So the videos alone seem to be a contradiction and in that light it seems ludicrous to spend time changing the angle of view.

[Bo Legg]

Stuart was typing while Paul was posting and he didn’t see Paul’s post until after he enter his.
So this was not a response to Paul.
I’m just a witness here.
However I do think Stuart makes a valid point.

[b0b]

These same folks will tell you not to learn songs by tab and I see no difference in tab and showing someone note for note on a video.

You don't need a high-tech gadget to read tab.

[Olli Haavisto]

Stuart, whether videos are are a valid or a good way of learning is not the point here. People use them anyway, so why not make it easier ? There`s nothing ludicrous about that, I think.
If you don`t need them, don`t use them. I`m speaking from the experience I`ve had teaching steel and dobro.

[Mike Neer]

Is this an optical illusion due to the software flipping image? Visually, the bar is consistently placed behind the fret. If the software does this, its important beginning students understand this is not a good visual of bar positioning.

Paul

I really don't know how to answer that. It's a wide angle lens--maybe the camera was positioned toward the bridge end a bit, I don't know.

But I will say: it's not every day you get called out by Paul Franklin! I'm OK with that.

[Stuart Legg]

Wow! You want to learn to play and you spend in excess of a $1000 on a PSG and you won’t make the effort to learn what fret the bar is on or the hand position looking at the steel from the front.

If you can’t tell from the front my guess is you can’t tell from the rear, overhead or underneath.

Don't waste your time trying to figure out a way to teach stupid folks to play PSG.

[Olli Haavisto]

whatever

Stupid people?

[Frederick Hogaboom]

I have no idea if this is possible but is there any way to include tab on the screen along with showing the instructors playing? Or at least provide tab for what is being played.

I would also suggest for beginner dvd's, videos use familiar songs for the initial exercise. this way at least the melody would be familiar.

I know for the "veterans" this may seem unnecessary. Well, maybe you have the ability to hear a "tune" once and play it. Not every one does.

[Bo Legg]

Now you did it Frederick!
I can pay and go see Paul or anyone else play and I will be in the crowd looking at the front of the steel.
There is not much chance unless I’m playing in the band (fat chance of that) with them that I’m ever going to see the steel looking over their shoulder.
So it seems to me you could learn some important things by being able to visualize the PSG from the front.

[Alan Tanner]

And we wonder why we can't attract "new" players ???

[CrowBear Schmitt]

how bout a little white ball bouncing on the tabs fer play along like karaokey dokey ?

[Franklin]

I really don't know how to answer that. It's a wide angle lens--maybe the camera was positioned toward the bridge end a bit, I don't know.

But I will say: it's not every day you get called out by Paul Franklin! I'm OK with that.

Mike,

I really like your video examples...My intention was not to call you out on that clip. You play too good to not have the bar positioned correctly which is why I was curious as to why the camera shows the bar out of position....Just wondering if you knew what happened?

PF

[Stephan Franck]

It's a question of parallax. It would take the camera, the bar and the fret being vertically alligned at all times for the bar to appear above the fret. For instance, Close one eye, and hold up your hand so that your thumb hides your index finger, then close that eye and open the other, and you'll see your fingers don't seem aligned anymore.

The closer the hand from your eye, the bigger the effect, which means that a wider lens amplifies it.

[Bo Legg]

The tendency to become closed or open minded is intimately tied to one’s epistemic motivations, that is, to the implicit or explicit goals one possess with respect to knowledge.

Over time we seem to side with consensus of selective closed or open mindedness here.
“Monkey see Monkey do” seems to be welcomed here with an open mind while the mind is completely closed to tab.

Any criticism here regarding this “monkey see monkey do” topic and you have to deal with the consequences of consensus.
In contrast the closed minded consensus regarding my tab topics was/is to crap on it with piling on encouraged by all.

As for the Frederick reference, the last time someone suggested one of those guys should add tab to their video he met with a hostile beat down and the guy almost turned in his membership.

[Olli Haavisto]

All I did was suggest a new camera angle...

And with that I`m wasting my time teaching stupid people to play.

This Forum is really hilarious at times....

[Olli Haavisto]

b0b, please close this.
I`ve made my suggestion and the newbies have been insulted enough.
Thanks.

[Stuart Legg]

Here is the solution number the frets like this and they will look the same in any direction
1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 11 10 9 8 7 6 5 4 3 2 1

[Olli Haavisto]

Sad, really.

[Bo Legg]

Olli this has nothing to do with you. This is "Monkey see Monkey do" verses "paint by numbers"

[Stuart Legg]

For what it’s worth I have access to that kind of technology and I think it is a good idea to use it if it helps the teacher get his or her point across.

I think you’ll find that Bo and I have contributed a lot to newbie’s.

Lighten up, you gotta admit my fret numbering thing was funny.