string breakage.....

Connie Mack · Post by **Connie Mack** » 5 Feb 2007 6:27 pm

hi all,

i might have fixed the problem already by ordering strings from the forum itself but i digress....

i have not played in ten years or so and dragged my old emmons from the closet and started putting brand new(d'addario) strings on it. i kept breaking the 13's and the 11's on the e9th neck. i kept putting on new ones then i tried buffing out the hole in the tuner head and buffed out the bridge finger unit to make sure there were no burrs that might have been causing this to happen. i tried substituting larger and smaller guages too. twang! happened until i ran out of extras. so i strung up the rest and then ordered some strings through the forum hoping that they will not break. back in the day, when i was gigging alot this used to happen on an infrequent basis. i was thinking that maybe they just don't make them the way they used to and from now on i will have to make sure to have these special steel strings on hand. anyone have the same problems? or thoughts on the subject. thanks(it's given me a chance to work on my c6th memory anyway)

Jerry L Miller · Post by **Jerry L Miller** » 5 Feb 2007 7:26 pm

Cobra strings are very good , i switched to jagwire strings about three months ago just to see if what i was reading on the forum was right i havent broken a string YET,

i usually try to play at least 15 minutes every night . so now the 3d will break on me. any way its time to change them
jerry

Jim Bob Sedgwick · Post by **Jim Bob Sedgwick** » 5 Feb 2007 7:37 pm

Connie, you stated you buffed out the fingers? If so, Now polish them with Mother's Mag and Aluminum polish. Available at Wal-Mart in automotive. It will make them slicker than deer guts on a door knob and give you a minimum of 40% less string breakage. I haven't broken a string in two years. (PS: This is the last time I will post this remedy) Believe me, it works.

Connie Mack · Post by **Connie Mack** » 6 Feb 2007 4:59 am

hey there, thanks jimbob and jerry. i ordered some jagwire and ghs heavy duty jobies. i will try some polish on those surfaces too. much appreciated.

Charlie McDonald · Post by **Charlie McDonald** » 6 Feb 2007 5:20 am

Connie (or others); what did you use to buff out the finger tops?
This is something I have to do when I get around to new strings.

Jim Sliff · Post by **Jim Sliff** » 6 Feb 2007 6:02 am

It's definitely as mechanical situation - burr, chip, nib, something.

It has nothing to do with the strings themselves. Plain steel wire is what it is, no matter who you get it from. There are actually very few string factories on the planet; most "brands" are packaging, not manufacturing. And plain strings, except for coated brands, are essentially the same except for the ball attachment system. There may be a few slight differences in alloys, but they are miniscule.

There is no such thing as "pedal steel guitar strings" as far as manufacturing goes - only in packaging. And if you dig around, you'll likely find the "pedal steel guitar" string brands are made by someone else.

Lee Baucum · Post by **Lee Baucum** » 6 Feb 2007 10:16 am

Where are the strings breaking? Are they always breaking at the changer finger, or up close to the tuning key? At the roller nut?

Curt Langston · Post by **Curt Langston** » 6 Feb 2007 11:56 am

Oh no! I can feel a slight twinge of this thread morphing into a keyed versus keyless thread! I better go wash my face in cold water before I go into a rant!................

Curt Langston · Post by **Curt Langston** » 6 Feb 2007 11:57 am

Or not........................................

A. J. Schobert · Post by **A. J. Schobert** » 6 Feb 2007 12:07 pm

Connie how old is your guitar? You may have groves in it and no buffing can help out, also did you oil? try a 3 in 1 oil hopefully you can remove the roller nut off and clean it very good to where it would roll free, oil the heck out of the changer as well.

Jim Sliff · Post by **Jim Sliff** » 6 Feb 2007 1:23 pm

I'd suggest NOT using oil, as it eventually gums up the works and attracts dirt. I like Teflon lube - it uses a solvent for penetration but then creates a dry lube that really smooths out mechanics. I use it on rollers, changers - everything that moves!

In this case it sounds like the instrument may have built up a small amount of corrosion from being stored for so long, and a thorough cleaning/buffing of all string-contact surfaces is required, along with lubrication.

Connie Mack · Post by **Connie Mack** » 6 Feb 2007 1:50 pm

boy, where do i start. it's an old machine(early 80's) but when i bought it, it had just been overhauled so the wear and tear is minimal. the breakage occoured at both ends. not at the rollers. i used super super fine emory paper(not sure if it's actually emory paper but you know the black paper i'm talking about, i didn't check the grit classification before i sat at the computer.) the tuner post had groves around the hole where the end of the string goes so thats what i concentrated on. they're gone but it was still breaking there. as soon as i get the new strings, i'll try some polish over the papered areas. there are no grooves at the finger mech. anybody else, please feel free to chime in....(still thinking that they don't make em like they used to deal but i'm keeping an open mind) connie mack

A. J. Schobert · Post by **A. J. Schobert** » 6 Feb 2007 3:04 pm

Connie use 3 in 1 oil you will be fine as long as it isn't graphite based, They sell it at home depot.try to use shimie chrome(check my spelling) to polish your changer this may help, however use very little, go to your local motorcycle dealler they carry it. Also if you should have groves in it the best solution is to replace the changer fingers, but make sure you lube everything really good. and don't use wd-40 oil. Connie the best manteniance is not letting your guitar sit, I would think you may have to just work it out a little.

Jackie Anderson · Post by **Jackie Anderson** » 6 Feb 2007 4:22 pm

The steel may be the same in all of them, but there definitely are strings that are better on PSGs than run-of-the-mill guitar strings: they have a shorter twist next to the ball end, and break far less often on a PSG, than "regular" guitar strings.

Tony Prior · Post by **Tony Prior** » 7 Feb 2007 2:51 am

remove the strings , take your fingernail or a piece of cotton and run it across the bridge..all polish does it make the BURR shine and look better.

Are the rollers turning or are they stuck ?

Did you removve the entire roller bridge and clean it up before you restrung your axe ?

And whatever you do don't buy into this Keyless nonsense..

All Guitars break strings at some point..None of them break strings like you are discussing.

You have a great Instrument but it has an issue that you have not uncovered yet.

The rapid and repetitive string breakage is not the problem, it's a symptom of the problem.

good luck. You are welocme to come to my house in NC and we can fix it up together if you like.

t

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 7 Feb 2007 5:24 am

If they're breaking at the tuning key, you're probably not using enough wraps. I make sure I have at least 7-10 wraps around the tuning key before the string comes up to pitch. Also, make sure you're not having the last few wraps pull across the hole in the tuning key, and make sure there are no burrs or real sharp edges around the hole.

Ted Solesky · Post by **Ted Solesky** » 7 Feb 2007 7:19 am

Guys, Zane Beck told me, years ago, never use WD-40 as mentioned here. He suggested using the lightest oil possible like the oil used for horns. And use only what it takes. Too much oil does attract dirt. Bud Carter told me the same story. Bud did recommend Zoom Spout oil that you can buy in the hardware store for about $2.50. Again, use very little and only about once a yr.

Bob Merritt · Post by **Bob Merritt** » 7 Feb 2007 11:34 am

Quote: There are actually very few string factories on the planet; most "brands" are packaging, not manufacturing.

This raises some questions, at least in my head. How much difference then does it make which brand of strings we use? How many factories are there? Do factories manufacture to the specs of the different brands? How many strings are REALLY different from the rest?

BTW, new member as of 15 Jan. The collective knowledge here is phenomenal and I feel privileged to be able to be a part of it. Learning and hope to contribute in future.

Connie Mack · Post by **Connie Mack** » 7 Feb 2007 5:03 pm

string breakage update....

ahhhhhhhh! you guessed it. it happened again. although i should point out that the f# went on fine and didn't break this time. but after the second g# broke, i took off the tuner and buffed and polished it. but darn if the next two broke. i was pulling my hair out at this point and spent most of the afternoon trying to figure out what was happening. i was thinking that maybe there was a nick in the roller that was the culprit that was causing the string to be stressed as it was being tuned at some point between the tuner and the roller....here's where the story gets interesting....but before i do, let me just say this about strings. as soon as i took these jagwire and ghs strings out of their paper, i could tell the difference from the d'adarrios...they were much more supple and bent easier, so to say that there is hardly any difference between strings just isn't so in my book, but hey, each to his own right?
back to the story. i went to play some irish music with my son last night but after a few notes, i realized we needed some tuning up so i brought out the tuner for my fiddle. strange, it was in tune but his whistle wasn't(are you seeing the picture yet?) well, he told me that something had gotten stuck in it a few days before, so befuddeled, i just tuned to him, end of story.
i put on the two low strings i was waiting on for the c6th neck and then realized that i have a tuner with adjustable calibration. it was set to 479hz(my son). so there you go. i had tuned everything about a step and a half too high. if i had been replacing a string i would have caught it. but since it was in the closet so long, i just didn't have a true reference point to go on to realizing that i was tuning everything too high.(the good strings almost made though while the others were breaking at a much lower tuning) well, that's the story. hopefully, it will be a lesson to someone out there besides myself. thanks for all the advice. connie mack

A. J. Schobert · Post by **A. J. Schobert** » 7 Feb 2007 9:41 pm

Good to hear your pick'in that was going to be my 2nd guess!

Marc Weller · Post by **Marc Weller** » 7 Feb 2007 10:49 pm

You are not the first person to make that mistake !!!! As for string choice, several years ago I posted a question about 3rd string breakage. One of the respondents was Jerry Fessenden who insisted on sending me an entire box of SIT .011's. I play a Williams and a Sho Bud and those strings absolutely never break (I play one gig a week and practice every night). I change strings about once a month or when my guitar starts to sound bad. I also do the Blitz cloth thing which certainly prolongs string life and tone. It also make the strings feel great on my Telecaster's neck.

MW

Tony Prior · Post by **Tony Prior** » 8 Feb 2007 2:39 am

yipes 479 !!! ??

My little Boss tuner doesn't even go that high !

So much for all the other theory's !

the good news is that because of this little exercise you did re-visit checking the mechanicals which is all important now and then, and the rest of us can use this as a "Don't be so quick" to draw conclusions .

I suspect that if you were actually with another player the tuner would have been the first thing noticed, we probably all just take 440 or 441 for granted, like breathing.

Glad you got this behind you, glad you posted the episode. We can all learn from it.

t

A. J. Schobert · Post by **A. J. Schobert** » 8 Feb 2007 4:27 am

I feel bad I was telling connie to get the thing overhaulled! Well a complete overhaull would have fixed the problem, but I really think what connie did is far more cost effective.

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