The Steel Guitar Forum

On a side note, I was playing at Billy Bobs with Johnny Duncan years ago and noticed a Peavey monitor mixer stage left next to me. It had a big piece of tape over the logo. Someone in black marker had written, Midas… I said something about it to the sound guy and he laughed and said, when an artist rider ask for a specific monitor mixer we just give them what they want….

The thing with Peavey to me is the same situation with Walmart. People want US products and this and that but they don't want to pay for them. There are US made products out there. Yes they're going to have alot of foreign parts (especially in the electronics world) but they're still being built and sold by someone here. You're just going to pay for them. I can name dozens of guitar amp manufacturers making amps here but your catalogs are full of peavey's, fender's, vox's, etc. that are made in China. Unfortunately for Peavey he wanted to have his cake and eat it too. He wanted to have a company that had both Walmart prices and US products.

My favorite story about Hartley was that he may seem like he cares about no one but its not true. There is one guy who he admired greatly. Someone that could do no wrong in his eyes and that he would do anything to make happy. The ending of the story of course is that that guy is Hartley.

I don't remember selling any pedals to China, but I have sold many--many--many pedals to Japan, Taiwan,and Thailand. In the last 18 years of building pedals I have sold pedals all over the world, but never sold a pedal in Mexico. Which is strange to me. Think of it--a Hillbilly--in the Ozark Mountains building and selling pedals in Japan, Taiwan, and Thailand. I am waiting on my first order from China and Mexico.

People want US products and this and that but they don't want to pay for them. There are US made products out there.

This is not completely true. Lot's of people are also facing cutbacks and layoffs at their jobs. All musicians don't have an unlimited amount of money at their disposal. I am on Social Security disability. There is no way I, and many others, can afford American made products. I wish I could, but in today's economy, that's just not feasible. This problem with shipping jobs over seas, and companies setting up shop over there has been going on for decades. We should have stopped the mad rush to move production overseas a long time ago.

@ Keith Hilton

re:but never sold a pedal in Mexico.

They are probably afraid that your pedal is using the Bourns Trimpot Product line that's made in Mexico

Richard Sinkler wrote:

People want US products and this and that but they don't want to pay for them. There are US made products out there.

This is not completely true. Lot's of people are also facing cutbacks and layoffs at their jobs. All musicians don't have an unlimited amount of money at their disposal. I am on Social Security disability. There is no way I, and many others, can afford American made products. I wish I could, but in today's economy, that's just not feasible. This problem with shipping jobs over seas, and companies setting up shop over there has been going on for decades. We should have stopped the mad rush to move production overseas a long time ago.

Your conflating issues. Your specific situation doesn't translate to accurate generalities about the economy and migration of manufacturing. You say you wish you could but in today's economy its not feasible. The economy has no bearing over your situation with soc. security disability. I think the viewpoint here at SGF can get skewed given the age of alot of players and the generally small sample group. If you go over to someplace like thegearpage or other 6 string forums you'll find lots of guys buying lots of american made gear. Tons of it. At stupid prices. $5000 amp heads. $5000 guitars. Pedalboards with 10+ $200-$400 pedals. Sevenstring.org is mostly a heavy music/metal crowd and they buy tons of custom american made guitars. Alot from Carvin too, an american manufacturer.

$5000 for a US made steel guitar is not unheard of either

every dollar we spend is a vote. If everybody realized that they were voting with their dollars, manufacturing would have never disappeared. Somewhere along the line americans elected to have disposable, inexpensive electronics made overseas.

Its never too late to make the change back - but it will never work unless a LOT of people get on board with it

Re:Its never too late to make the change back

Parallax is an example of a company that did allot of their manufacturing in China for many years and brought it back to the USA over a 8 year period and went on to become recognized as a Manufacturing Champion at the first ever California Champions of Manufacturing Summit.

"We’re very proud of our manufacturing team and our ability to say that many of our products are Made in the USA. Over the years we’ve brought products back from China and now manufacture them in our Rocklin facility. The team loves what they do and takes great pride in building products that ship around the world."

http://www.parallax.com/news/2014-06-18 ... ives-award

I heard this on Jeopardy last night. Now this is not where I get most of my information but they are pretty particular in what they do and say. Granted this comment supposedly came from the "Economists" who pretend to know and I also doubt that because I have 18 hours of credits in economics for my masters degree and the more economics I took the less I understood so I switched to an MBA. Anyway, here's their comment:
"We could create 200,000 jobs if we all spent $64 a year on items with these 3 words" I'll let you guess the 3 words....

Bob, when are you going to teach me how to program some of the PIC chips? Design me a simple audio delay with a PIC chip. Parallax made a lot of money selling the Basic Stamp to schools all over the world. Schools get tax money. By the way Bob, I thought you would have frozen to death up there in the far reaches of the north country. When is the last time you saw the ground?

Tim Marcus wrote:$5000 for a US made steel guitar is not unheard of either

Thats something that always baffled me. Guitar or bass players will play a $500-$700 instrument through multi-thousand dollar amps. Steel players put a $3000+ steel into a $700 peavey.

Hi Keith,

Nice to hear from you.

re: Bob, when are you going to teach me how to program some of the PIC chips?

re:Design me a simple audio delay with a PIC chip
I was going to make you one but the project got delayed

Sorry Keith but I haven`t programmed Pic`s for 5 or 6 years and have changed to the Propeller chip. It has 8, 32 bit cores (called Cog`s) that run in Parallel. It`s also fun to program. I use assembly language and a programing language called Spin. You can also program it in C or Forth(I haven`t tried either) Which language do you want to learn?

You can check out the diagram here:
http://elmicro.com/files/parallax/prope ... et-v12.pdf

This guitar effects processor was made with the Propeller chip

http://howleraudio.com/frontpage/

re: By the way Bob, I thought you would have frozen to death up there in the far reaches of the north country. When is the last time you saw the ground?

LOL yes, we have plenty of snow . It`s getting hard to find room to stack it now. I lucked in because a few months ago my neighbor had some serious malware problems on his computer. I was able to help him out and he`s been over with his snow blower cleaning up the mess after each storm. I only have to shovel my steps. Can`t wait for spring though

What nobody wants to talk about in the manufacturing jobs sector, is the ability to buy a machine to do the the job that it used to take a person. No longer is it necessary to pay someone big bucks to do a semi-skilled job. 1 person can oversee several machines that require no other human manipulation. We are moving past the "good old days" when many humans were necessary to build a product!
I think we need to seriously look at what the future generation will need to do, to be employable in the future workforce. Manufacturing will always go to the lowest cost labor,(worldwide!) How many managers will they need? Skills, to repair the machines will always be in demand, as well as people to invent new ones. I don't know what the next generation will be doing for a living.
I don't blame Hartley for moving manufacturing to China, but it saddens me!

so...kinda real question here - does this mean we all need to get our old peavey amps serviced before they get rid of everyone? that has always been one of the reasons i liked them. always took care of service, no matter what you sent them.

Well, to be totally fair in this regard, it isn't just on Peavey (but again it was more the way Hartley and Courtland came across to me).

Companies that were the "big dogs" when I was growing up are now just shells of themselves. Sears, Kmart, JC Penney, Radio Shack (which now is gone for all practical purposes), even the "big three" auto companies aren't what they used to be. General Motors use to be the "it" corporation, not so much now.

All the above just my opinion, YMMV.

If you buy an new guitar amp for under $400.00, I'll guarantee it isn't made in the USA.
A US manufacturer can't expect to pay any less than about $20.00/hour for labor. Contrast that with China.
I notice even Ebay now is flooded with Far East folks selling things for about a third less than a US seller has a similar item going for.

Here is a suggestion and not meant to be political...American products leave this country due to EPA, OSHA and many other strict policies...can't build a factory due to the nesting place of the red eyed worm...so, we relocate to China, prob our biggest threat in the world...meantime our southern border is over ran with illegals....solution you ask, give tax breaks to American companies that relocate to Mexico..Mexico is not an enemy...closer to the U.S. means lower shipping costs..All the illegals would stay in their own country if they had a decent wage for their location...everyone wins...illegal problem goes away, Mexico becomes a better friend and China has to find another way to fund their military....just my three cents.....and it all started with watching the downfall of Peavey....maybe Peavey should not have put so much quality into their amps, my 1985 Austin 400 works like a charm.....

I heartily agree with Mr. Brosius.......Do not put too much stock in these types of television programs; they are not designed for anything except sensationalism for the sake of dollars, pure and simple.....they are about as 'real' as an episode of ' Petticoat Junction '. Let's not judge too harshly too soon....as my Dad used to say, 'Hide and Watch' what develops.