The Steel Guitar Forum

To Jack Stoner. Bob Hoffnar said something about stale donuts. Well Jack,if you are ever coming through Ozark, Missouri on your way to Kansas City, let me know. I will run out to the day old bakery and get us some delicious day old donuts.

Steven Finley wrote:I wonder what Mike Brown has to say now ?

i wouldn't get snarky with mike! he's been nothing but a great friend and supporter of the steel guitar community. because of him we've had honest communication with dealing with our amps, problems and repairs.
it's largely due to him that i've based my opinion of pv on. it would be interesting to hear what he has to say about this, but i certainly wouldn't involve him in the disaster. i imagine he is as disappointed as the rest of us.

Chris,
My question is an honest forthright inquiry.
It is your reply that sounds snarky.
Is this not a forum where one can ask a valid question, or is it only a platform for certain individuals to lambaste
everyone else over every post? That sounds snarky to me!

After all, Mike is the one who, in the past, has
always answered the questions--not Mr. PV.

Steven, my take in my previous post:

So I think Mike should be left out of this and he shouldn't be peppered with any questions related to the show. He is not responsible for anything that happened and could just as easily be put out on the street as any of the other employees.

I don't believe Mike should have to answer any questions or post any opinion about the show, his job would be on the line. At least that would be my belief.

My 2 cents, YMMV.

An interesting tid bit from the beginning of the show was Hartley talking about getting fired from all his early bands after fixing all their equipment. From what I saw, I doubt I'd want to spend any time around the guy, he just seems unpleasant. (This is not meant as a personal attack BTW, he may be a really nice guy in person, I don't know him)

That said, I don't require my equipment vendor to be a nice person, I look for good products that take a beating, and Peavey has delivered that at a reasonable price. I don't use a lot of Peavey products anymore, they don't deliver the sound I'm looking for, but I wouldn't have gotten this far without hammering away at some Peavey amps and guitars along the way.

This show may be a bit of a black eye for them, but at the end of the day, they need to stay in business and stay profitable. I've been through a few downsizing/offshoring events in my life, it never came as a surprise when the pink slips were handed out. I have sympathy for the Peavey employees that are affected, but in a situation like that I suspect that anyone with any get up and go, got up a left a while back.

Who knows, maybe they'll sell out to Behringer!

I agree that Mike should be left out of this controversy. But I DO think that Hartley, and his upper management, would be VERY well advised to look for help from some of PV's incredible employees. Those employees ARE the company and they know how to improve things much better than he does!

It's so very sad so see how upper management can become so disconnected from the people that make the company successful.

Steven Finley wrote:Chris,
My question is an honest forthright inquiry.
It is your reply that sounds snarky.

it was the way you worded it, and you know it!
i freely admit to my daily snarkism.

It just got worse:

http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/ ... story.html

At one time Peavey had over 2,000 employees. Clearly something is wrong if they are now down to 300. For a long time Peavey was the driving force in the industry. All of the blame can not be put on cost of production within the United States, when compaired to cost of production in China. I always liked Hartley. When I first started building electronics Hartley gave me advise, and tried to help me. Everything blew up between me and Hartley when I told him he had a big ego. I do think deep down Hartley is a good person. Any company can over extent, and get off on the wrong road. If you read this Hartley, I would still like to be your friend, but I still think you have a big ego. By the way, I am your same age, and I don't dye my hair--it is natural and white.

Keith Hilton wrote: By the way, I am your same age, and I don't dye my hair

That should help to patch up your friendship.

...I don't care what color my hair turns, as long as it don't turn loose....

Thanks for keeping the discussion civil and non-political guys!

The original link doesn't work outside of the US.
This YouTube one does, at least in Canada:

http://youtu.be/4UDDG8sGdtk

Theresa said that maybe the layoff might be a good thing, as she feels she deserves better [than Peavey].

Gray said "At the end of the day it's something that is for the greater good of the business."

So there's a gap here.

I played thru a great 18" Peavey bass amp once. Too bad.

our leaders should do better to help Americans

stay in business by lowering taxs on American

companies

Americans should try to support Americans

by asking for American made products

I like Peavey.. always have had great service

from them but I don't see me buying any China

made Peavey amps ......

Earnest,I tried several times over the years, through Mike Brown, to patch things up with Heartly.
At the time, when I told Heartly he had a big ego, I said it thinking it would help him. I actually have a soft spot in my heart for Heartly, because he tried to help me in the beginning. But-Earnest I gave up trying to patch things up a few years back.

its funny (to me, anyway) - no one has a problem buying amps full of Chinese parts that are assembled in the USA. Peavey has been doing that for decades.

But as soon as the amps themselves are made overseas theres a problem

Amps made with US made parts are astronomically expensive. I should know... thats what I do and I still operate at a loss (before paying any taxes)

Tim you are right about the china parts

and I don't like that either....

I have a great respect for you and others building

the amps you build I hope your business gets

bigger and I think it will

mike

Tim that might be because at least it was American jobs assembling those amps, not so with them going overseas.

I'm sorry to hear you're operating at a loss, and I would assume you only have a couple of ways to go. Cheaper parts or raising prices, neither alternative is probably attractive. Best wishes for you and Milkman.

My 2 cents, YMMV.

There are some parts that are no longer made in the USA, even though they have an American Company name on them. e.g T.I. chips are made in many different countries (and have been for many years, not something recent).

As far as Peavey, now moving production to overseas. They have been producing many products overseas for some time. Its not something that just happened. Just that now, apparently, everything will be produced overseas.

Just another story in the long line of American decline to benefit the 1% of money mongers that forget America gave them all they have. Manufacturing in America is dying.

Thanks, Joey. It also works in the UK. Felt too lazy to check my other virtual locations.

John Booth said:

Just another story in the long line of American decline to benefit the 1% of money mongers that forget America gave them all they have. Manufacturing in America is dying.

...we all know who is responsible for that don't we. That's as close a political statement as I intend to make.

Tim, I wholeheartedly agree regarding many of the parts already coming from China. Although I already knew that, it's been tough nonetheless to personally tolerate the thoughts of that concept and fact. I greatly admire and appreciate those that procure, whenever possible, those parts necessary and then build amps and effects in the USA. You (Milkman), along with Scot Buffington (Evans), Brad Sarno (SMS), Phil Bradbury (Little Walter), Keith Hilton, just to name a few, are to be commended (I realize there are many, many more). If necessary, I would rather wait a while longer, save a little more, whatever is necessary to pay a premium rather than to ever see any of the before mentioned products either discontinued or manufactured in China.
On a separate note....Mike Brown should also be commended as he is the reason that I've supported Peavey in the past and have a room full of several Peavey amps from the 70's & 80's.

I must give a shout out to Dave Beaty of the Arizona-based Telonics. Aside from his primary business activities, Dave has invested in many key products for the modern steel player. These include a volume pedal that is second to none, incredible amplification and speaker systems, and pickups for 10 and 12 string instruments. Being a player, he knows just what the market place needs and what needs to be modernised. I have a feeling that Telonics will be supporting the steel guitarist for many years to come, but Dave would be the first to admit that the steel guitar market will never make him a rich man. However that is not the key point for him. He just wants to produce quality products that are reliable and high end in the technology that they utilise.

Praise too to Tommy Bradshaw, who has invested a load of money into our industry over the years, with many ventures costing him a bunch of money with no profit. His foray into the world of electronic equipment culminated in the modernisation of the magnificent Webb 614E combo amp.

These two guys have kept their resources in the USA, and credit to them for doing so.

I was taking up for them until I saw the show last night! WOW! For years they were the line of products to have if you were a retailer… They made a "good" product for a price that the working musician could afford. I went to their place in Mississippi three times for training back in the 80s, it was a different company then.. Hartley always had an ego but in those days his employees seemed to love him.. It appears that Melia, Hartley's first wife, was really the back bone on the business side because things started to change after her death… Looks like the MI music business is in turmoil with Guitar Center at the door of bankruptcy, Fender selling direct, Peavey killing itself, and many other factors we are seeing… The good news is that the mom and pop shops that have survived may be able to make some money after the smoke clears… It is total arrogance that Courtland wouldn't take the advise of a friend of mine knowing his background of having 10 years in the retail music business, a PHD in Marketing and now nearly 30 years of experience consulting and teaching… I knew I didn't like him 2 minuets into the show… What a spoiled brat!