Who is this guy?

Rick Nicklas · Post by **Rick Nicklas** » 27 Jul 2007 9:14 am

Well, I got up this morning, ate a big breakfast and got out in the fresh air (if you call a barn full of horses "fresh air"). I came back in the house and once again watched the first video (The other two are too taxing on my brain to decifer because of the out of sinc video/audio). I personally think this 1st video is legit. I can get the same sound and sustain with the old fuzztone and he seems definately playing the right blues licks (slides and positions and pedal rods flexing) on the steel. They are not hard moves, just tastey and emotional. If it is fake then I won't be embarrassed because he must have spent more time practicing faking than the guy whom some think is really playing it.

Michael Johnstone · Post by **Michael Johnstone** » 27 Jul 2007 10:00 am

The tracks in question are not something that guy EVER played.If they were he'd be able to fake it convincingly.Wrong bar positions,picking the wrong strings,sliding up instead of down are all things an experienced E9 player who could have actually played the track would spot in a second. No - someone else played that track - trust me. This is not a condemnation of newcomers or inexperienced steel players - just informed observation.I know that as a newcomer for the first couple years I played steel I was totally in love with its mechanical gadgetry and glorious sound. There was a veil of mystery that made any player and anything they played seem amazing and that kind of enthusiasm is what kept me going for 30+ years. Now though,I know a lot more about the instrument and what it takes to play it. In a way that ruins everything because once you know the trick,the magician is not so amazing anymore. I think Doug shares that view and he's trying to shine a little light on the proceedings.It can get frustrating though when the empirical facts one presents are labled as merely one opinion among many.
I too learned a lot from this thread and that is what a tower of bable of miscommunication this forum can be from time to time. The fake steel player and mediocre track were just catalysts for people to trot out all these various argumentative subtexts. Strange.........

Rick Nicklas · Post by **Rick Nicklas** » 27 Jul 2007 10:59 am

This is my last post on this... I once again analyzed the first video only after reading Michaels post above. I looked at it 3 times. Each time I covered everything except the parts I wanted to see. The first time I looked at only the picking hand; the second time only the bar hand and the third time just the pedal bars for flexing. Everything is accounted for. The only questionable items I had were when notes were fluctuating up and down without a bar movement and the flexing of the pedals confirmed that it was an actual real move. This is a piece that you would expect to hear on a Strat or the like but very E9th friendly without any single note fast chromatic runs. I don't know if this guy set his delay to start without sound when he picks (which you can do but it with throw your rythym off) or its just a audio/video sync problem but I would love to see it done after corrected. That's enough from me.... You guys are the greatest!!!

p.s. Doug I was just browsing your website being nosy from your profile and ordered the 60 songs tab. I was very impressed with the straight forward basic melody and the way it was presented from your samples. Can't wait to get it. It is very, very user friendly. No air guitar for me!!! I want the real thing...

Rick Nicklas

P Gleespen · Post by **P Gleespen** » 27 Jul 2007 12:35 pm

I still don't get why anyone would bother to fake this. It simply boggles the mind.

That guy must have an amazing amount of time on his hands. He'd be better advised to spend his time learning to actually play, rather than making fake videos.

It's just so weird. Why would he do something so stupid? It's not like he's going to get any chicks out of the steel guitar, even if he DID really play it!

P Gleespen · Post by **P Gleespen** » 27 Jul 2007 12:57 pm

Oh, I forgot...SOMEBODY out there must know who actually played that stuff.

I'd say the "country" one is pretty run of the mill, but you don't hear many guys playing ye olde fashioned Gary Moore style on steel. I'm sure one of you guys can ID it.

C'mon! I know you're out there. You WANT to tell us. What are you, chicken?

...and I've got to say it's pretty funny to see Ben Jones get pigeonholed as a "country only" kind of guy. That one made me chuckle!

Ben Jones · Post by **Ben Jones** » 27 Jul 2007 1:37 pm

well his name is Red (or possibly Guido) and he's from Switzerland.

Here's what he has to say about the videos:

hi,sorry the sound with play is not conformed,video was compressed,the next video will be given letter,see you¨!

Like Patrick and I are saying, it just wouldnt make any sense at all for someone to fake this kind of thing. Its not that the playing is bad (I flat out suck in comparision), its just not fantastic or original enough to bother making a fake of (and even if it were it still would make no sense to make a fake steel video of ANY sort). Besides the guy obviously plays steel, he owns a purple Emmons (thats a pretty rare and expensive prop for a fake youtube vid), and he makes "moves" with his hands and feet that are familiar to steel players.

so what we have here (IMHO, since no one but Red can know for sure)is a decent player playing a fairly mundane cover tune to backing tracks with a wildly compressed offtime video...and a forum full of people getting worked up over nothing.

Occams razor my friends. The very least logical explanation would be the video is fake...that would just make zero sense.

Red , if your out there reading this, cheers and have a nice laugh at our expense, we deserve it.

P Gleespen · Post by **P Gleespen** » 27 Jul 2007 2:05 pm

Ben Jones wrote:
Like Patrick and I are saying, it just wouldnt make any sense at all for someone to fake this kind of thing.

Well, that IS what I said...and it's true, it doesn't make sense at all...

...but I actually DO think he's fakin' it.

It's pretty clearly way off on the countryish tune, and I don't mean out of sync.

Ben Jones · Post by **Ben Jones** » 27 Jul 2007 2:12 pm

Patrick, the video is compressed, the sound file is not... the video is therefor going slightly faster than the sound file....so you see him start to pick at the beginning before you hear any sound, and he finishes playing and gets up long before the song ends. The compression is additive over time so by the end of the song he is WAY off. I dont beleive it's fake at all...just a highly compressed video. If it WERE a fake, wouldnt he at least have the sense to sit down and continue fake playing until the music stopped?

But hell, Ive been wrong once or twice before, maybe Im wrong again. someone should just email Red and ask him whats up.

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 27 Jul 2007 2:15 pm

Once again, the major attention here seems to be on everything but the music. I even let myself get suckered into the "debate".

Okay, for the last time...

I think the guy's a player, and I think that if it's a fake job, he's faking his own work. If it makes some of you feel better to deride me for my opinion, so be it.

What I hear (and that's all I really care about) is plain, simple, and fairly smooth steel work. I could care less who's playing it. Neither the playing nor the song are what I would consider particularly notewortrhy, but it's certainly listenable stuff of a type that you don't hear on steel very often.

Brint Hannay · Post by **Brint Hannay** » 27 Jul 2007 2:36 pm

Patrick, the video is compressed, the sound file is not... the video is therefor going slightly faster than the sound file....so you see him start to pick at the beginning before you hear any sound, and he finishes playing and gets up long before the song ends. The compression is additive over time so by the end of the song he is WAY off. I dont beleive it's fake at all...just a highly compressed video. If it WERE a fake, wouldnt he at least have the sense to sit down and continue fake playing until the music stopped?

And, for that matter, why would he start fake playing before the music starts? I mean, faking it while there's something to fake is one thing...

Occam's razor, indeed. Ben's theory makes the most sense to me.

I've watched this thing (sadly) enough times that I have it completely in my head (at this point I'll probably hear the freakin' thing over and over in my dreams!), and when I watch the video with the sound off I see his motions match the music all the way through. (BTW, FWIW, I've been playing steel for 24 years.) However, I recorded the audio track using a small portable tape recorder in front of a speaker, and tried to play the tape while watching the video with the sound off, timed so that the picking motion started simultaneously with the playing. The tape was on pitch with the audio from the computer, so I didn’t have a tape speed issue. I was unsuccessful in getting the two starts truly simultaneous (I used the beep as a reference), but I got it pretty close a couple of times, and the movements—both hands and left foot—matched up with the music quite well for a few bars, but they diverged gradually, pretty quickly, the video running ahead, till it became impossible to keep track. Which fits with the compression theory.

Gary Lee Gimble · Post by **Gary Lee Gimble** » 27 Jul 2007 2:40 pm

Donny my friend, I'm looking forward to some noteworthyness this Sunday...

Brint, your invite is still open, never heard from ya

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 27 Jul 2007 3:45 pm

Gary, you do know you'll be quite unamazed at anything I do, don't you?

David Higginbotham · Post by **David Higginbotham** » 27 Jul 2007 3:57 pm

I totally agree with Donny Hinson in his post a couple of frames above! I think he was the player on both clips.

If in someone's opinion that my 12 years of playing make me a very inexperienced player since I believe this way, then so be it!

Ben Jones · Post by **Ben Jones** » 27 Jul 2007 4:01 pm

On a side note, I didnt know Emmons made a Stevie Ray Vaughn model? check out the sig on the far right of his emmons. thats awesome. i want a Van Halen signature model....

Jim Sliff · Post by **Jim Sliff** » 27 Jul 2007 4:51 pm

And, for that matter, why would he start fake playing before the music starts? I mean, faking it while there's something to fake is one thing...

I don't think that part was necessarily intentional.
I've seen flash videos that were so weirdly out of sync, with parts somewhat in sync, nothing surprises my on Youtube. It's possible he could have also been wearing wireless cans that were hearing the track at a different point than the one picked up by the ambient mic.

If it WERE a fake, wouldnt he at least have the sense to sit down and continue fake playing until the music stopped?

Not if what he was hearing was differently time-shifted than the videotape sound.

Ben, please try to understand I was NOT trying to say YOU were locked into ANY particular type of music, and if it came off that way I apologize. However, I DO think calling it "mundane" and insulting the song, style etc. is biased, unfounded criticism of "style" - apparently you DO NOT like the song, you don't like "pedestrian urban blues" ( and I think many would say that description shows not only disrespect but a narrowminded viewpoint) - and then calling it "BORING" (caps being yours) are slamming the player, the song, and pretty much everyone who's ever played it. And where you get your "stone age" BS comment from is unfathomable.

I'm aware you like wide variety of music. Why not try NOT insulting songs you don't care for. Just say *you* don't care for it?

I find it really fascinating that you don't care at all what the record buying public (which implies audiences in general) likes, and then you insult THEM. Maybe you could hop down off the pedestal and join the rest of the peasants...if it wouldn't sully your reputation as being above it all too much.

I'm really kind of half joking here, Ben, in hopes you really aren't taking yourself as seriously as you seem to be. You don't really have a complete disregard for the audience or disrespect for music you just don't happen to like - do you?

There are all sorts of technical weirdness that could have caused the varying sync - to me the one thing that's for sure is he's not playing it "live".

Michael Johnstone · Post by **Michael Johnstone** » 27 Jul 2007 4:53 pm

As a professional video editor since 1978 with a background in music video - both live and sideline(lipsync),I spend a good deal of time dealing with and resolving audio/video sync differentials. I could write a book on that subject. Plus I've played E9 longer than that so I have a unique perspective. He ain't playin.
Take that to the dog track and bet on it.

scott murray · Post by **scott murray** » 27 Jul 2007 5:09 pm

he is the player. geez.

if you don't like his playing, criticize that. if you don't like the song, criticize that. but don't criticize this guy for being a con artist, when you really don't know for sure.

he obviously loves American music. the guy plays an Emmons and has Stevie Ray Vaughn's autograph pasted to the front of it. pretty hardcore if you ask me.

my hat's off to Guido! i might just invite him to this thread to stick up for himself.

Dean Parks · Post by **Dean Parks** » 27 Jul 2007 5:22 pm

I've split the audio from the video and synched them. He's playing it. And he sounds good doing it too.

scott murray · Post by **scott murray** » 27 Jul 2007 5:34 pm

thanks Dean. 'nuff said.

you are truly one of my guitar heroes, Mr. Parks. mostly for your work with Steely Dan, but I'm sure there are hundreds of other things I love that you played on too. can you pick a favorite track or two that you've done in your illustrious career?

can I find any recordings of you playing steel?
are you playing mainly E9, C6, universal, or some alternate tuning(s)?

it's great to have you here!

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 27 Jul 2007 6:08 pm

Explain to me why the sound of his footsteps as he walks across the floor at the end of the video are in perfect sync, while the music is not in sync with his fingers. Explain that to me please.

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 27 Jul 2007 6:14 pm

PS Rick, thank you for ordering my song book, I appreciate it!

Dean Parks · Post by **Dean Parks** » 27 Jul 2007 6:17 pm

Doug, to make it clear, I'm talking about this clip.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rF0X-OH6BjI

At the end, we can't actually see his feet, so approximate reads as "in sync". With the fingers, we can see the contact, and hear something different (in this case, video is ahead of audio).

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 27 Jul 2007 6:32 pm

Dean,

I am referring to this clip ---> CLICK

Someone please Explain to me why the sound of his footsteps as he walks across the floor at the end of the video are in perfect sync, while the music is not in sync with his fingers.

The answer is very simple. The video and the audio Are in perfect sync, and this guy is not playing the steel guitar that we hear. The room noises at the end of the clip clearly prove that. There is no issue of sync/out of sync in this clip.

If anyone can explain why the room noises are in perfect sync, while the steel sounds are out of sync with his fingers... I'd like to hear it.

scott murray · Post by **scott murray** » 27 Jul 2007 6:43 pm

I explained it already. the sound you think is his shoe is actually his bar when he puts it down.

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 27 Jul 2007 6:54 pm

When gets up from his chair and walks, his footsteps can be heard while the steel track is still playing. When he picks up something from his steel guitar at the end, the sound is perfectly matched. When he places that object on the steel guitar in beginning the audio matches. His final footsteps are perfectly matched.

I watched the video again, and I hear patterns moving from fret to fret while he stays on the same fret. Chords change, he doesn't. Sound goes up, he goes down. Sound goes down, he goes up. This is so far off, it's a joke. Delay has nothing to do with it. Much of what he's doing does not match the sound at Any point in the video.

Can anyone explain the ending of this clip? The room sounds do match exactly what he is doing, but the steel sounds almost never match his fingers.