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Topic: Stainless strings with a stainless bar? |
John McGuire
From:
Swansea,Illinois, USA
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Posted 1 Mar 2007 12:13 pm |
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| I thought I read somewhere that if you use the stainless steel strings that you should not use a stainless steel bar. Is this true? And if so why? Thanks |
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Erv Niehaus
From:
Litchfield, MN, USA
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Posted 1 Mar 2007 12:25 pm
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It won't be as smooth.
A nickel bar with nickel strings is as smooth as it can get.  |
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Fred Justice
From:
Mesa, Arizona
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Posted 1 Mar 2007 12:34 pm
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Erv I personally think its an old myth myself.
Kinda like, don't plant your onions next to your potatoes, the onions will get in the potatoes eye's and make them cry. 
_________________
Email: azpedalman@gmail.com
Phone: 480-235-8797 |
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Erv Niehaus
From:
Litchfield, MN, USA
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Posted 1 Mar 2007 1:38 pm
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Fred,
Those are fighting words where I come from. You're lucky you're not where I come from. 
(You know I'm kidding)  |
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Ron Randall
From:
Dallas, Texas, USA
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Posted 1 Mar 2007 2:32 pm
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The best way to know is to try it yourself.
IMHO. Stainless strings and a stainless bar are kinda scratchy feeling and sound scratchy.
A chrome bar will sound better on Stainless strings. |
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David Doggett
From:
Bawl'mer, MD (formerly of MS, Nawluns, Gnashville, Knocksville, Lost Angeles, Bahsten. and Philly)
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Posted 1 Mar 2007 2:33 pm
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| Well, the unwound strings are all stainless steel, so that rule of thumb would have no one playing with a steel bar - would it still be a steel guitar? Obviously I think it's a myth. Theoretically, same on same metal has more friction. Chrome plated bars are the smoothest by far on either steel or nickel strings, but I think that is just because chrome is slicker. Unfortunately, chrome chips off the bar and doesn't last. SS bars are the longest lasting, and I have not noticed any difference in friction on the wound strings whether they are ss or nicklel, although the nickel strings are quieter, but also mellower and not as long lasting. |
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Mike Wheeler
From:
Delaware, Ohio, USA
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Posted 1 Mar 2007 3:33 pm
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My old BJS bar has never chipped...and aren't they chrome? I've had other, cheaper, chrome bars chip, though.
_________________
Best regards,
Mike |
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Michael Dene
From:
Gippsland,Victoria, Australia
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Posted 1 Mar 2007 4:06 pm
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| Mike Wheeler wrote: |
| My old BJS bar has never chipped...and aren't they chrome? |
Not just chrome Mike, ...they're BJS chrome!!!! ... and feel better, sound better and last better than anything else I've found.
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Donny Hinson
From:
Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.
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Posted 1 Mar 2007 4:38 pm
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| David Doggett wrote: |
| Well, the unwound strings are all stainless steel, so that rule of thumb would have no one playing with a steel bar |
Uhh, sorry. The unwound (plain) strings, as well as the cores of the wound strings, are all made of music wire, not stainless steel.
Yes, these's a noticeable (barely noticeable) increase in friction when you use a stainless bar on the wound strings of stainless steel string sets, but I don't think it would affect your playing much, if at all. There may be a little more noise, but that's insignificant for the most part, too (IMHO).
Much of this "bar selection science and preference" is overblown to me, and I just feel there's far more significant things to concentrate on and worry about than what kind of bar you use. |
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Delvin Morgan
From:
Lindstrom, Minnesota, USA
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Posted 1 Mar 2007 5:00 pm
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Stainless steel will gall really easy, especially stainless on stainless. Because it and other metals ( aluminum ) are very sticky and will want to gall. I am sure to a lesser degree that is what what is meant with SS bar and strings.
I work in the Aero-Space business, and we use SS bolts and nuts all the time. We use an anti-sieze compound to lessen the galling Maybe some kind of lubricant could be used on the strings of the PSG when using SS bar on SS strings. |
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Dave Mudgett
From:
Central Pennsylvania and Gallatin, Tennessee
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Posted 1 Mar 2007 6:16 pm
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Well, here's what Dr. Seymour said several years back - click here - not quite halfway down the page.
For blues and rock or other sliding styles using some distortion, I like a little more friction. But I use my BJS bars if I want to glide over the strings with as little noise as possible. As far as chipping goes, the chrome plating on these is tough as nails. Takes a licking and keeps on ticking.
And Donny is right - plain strings are not stainless. |
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John De Maille
From:
On a Mountain in Upstate Halcottsville, N.Y.
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Posted 1 Mar 2007 8:02 pm
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| I bought into the "chrome bar" for stainless strings a couple of years ago, when I changed to stainless strings. I had been using a stainless bar for 25 years ( a great bar BTW ) and I really found hardly any difference. Just a slight more drag and a little "whooshing" sound. Different strokes for different folks, I guess. For some strange reason, the chrome bar does warm up in my hand faster, though. |
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Mitch Ellis
From:
Collins, Mississippi USA
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Posted 1 Mar 2007 10:15 pm
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I have been using the same 7/8 BJS bar for about 9 years, and it still looks like it did the day I bought it. Here's the dumb question:). How can you tell the difference between chrome and polished stainless steel? Also, are chrome bars solid chrome or chrome plated? thank you.
Mitch |
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David Doggett
From:
Bawl'mer, MD (formerly of MS, Nawluns, Gnashville, Knocksville, Lost Angeles, Bahsten. and Philly)
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Posted 2 Mar 2007 12:45 am
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Okay, technically the unwound strings are made of "music wire," and a Google search indicated that is high carbon steel alloy. So it is not stainless, but it is steel. And Cobra strings are cobalt steel. Now stainless steel is an alloy with 13-26% chromium. There are different types, some containing nickel, molybenum or vanadium. So music wire, stainless steel, and Cobra strings are all steel alloys. Over on Wikipedia, galling between stainless steel parts seems to refer to stationary parts that have time to exchange composition over time. And I have no idea what happens between like-like and like-unlike metals in Bobbe's airplane engines, which interact at high speed and high temperatures, but also sit stationary at ambient temperatures. Somehow I wonder if any of this applies to steel guitar bars sliding lightly over strings at hand temperatures.
Yes, a chrome plated bar feels slicker on all types of string: music wire, stainless steel wounds and nickel wounds. Is that because it is not the same metal, or simply because it is harder? And yes, to me a stainless steel bar has slightly more drag than chrome, but on all types of strings. I don't notice much difference between a stainless steel bar on nickel, stainless, or Cobra Coil wound strings.
Hundreds of us use steel bars on all types of strings. According to Bobbe, we are doing something that can't be done, and we are all making a big mistake, because we are amateurs who can't feel the difference. Well for what it's worth, I feel the difference between a chrome plated bar on all types of strings, and a stainless steel bar on all types of strings. But it is a small difference. There are other factors that can overide the small difference. I like a double bullet bar, because the bottom end rides smoothly on and off of the low strings of my uni. But they are only made in stainless steel. I also use a chromeplated Shubb-Pearse grooved bar. And I use stainless steel strings, because they last longer and the wound strings are brighter with better string seperation. For blues and rock I use the chrome SP bar. But for country, jazz and classical, I reach for my stainless double bullet bar. The chrome bar is a little slicker feeling. But the stainless double bullet bar is completely usable. If they sold a chromeplated double bullet bar, I would buy it. But they don't, and I'm still getting good use out of the stainless double bullet on stainless steel strings.
So I guess I agree that problems with bar-on-like-strings is not a complete myth. But I think it is a myth that it is a big deal. But what do I know. I'm not a fulltime pro, or a metalurgist...um...or a steel guitar accessories dealer.  |
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John Roche
From:
England
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Posted 2 Mar 2007 1:15 am
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| A stainless steel tone bar will wear stainless steel strings flat, I know because it has happened to me. |
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Bill Moore
From:
Manchester, Michigan
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Posted 2 Mar 2007 5:28 am
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| It seems to me the difference is that the chrome plated bars have a smoother surface than some stainless bars. Before plating, the steel bar has to be highly polished, the layer of chrome is very thin, in enhances the polished surface below it. Some makers do a better job polishing the stainless bars. If a stainless bar feels like it drags on the strings, you can improve it by polishing it yourself. You will notice the difference. All that being said, I use nickel strings, and usually use a stainless bar. |
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