A CD is not necessarilly a CD

erik · Post by **erik** » 14 Jul 2005 5:07 pm

I feel the need to post this and no doubt will receive flack but I am now in possession of perhaps 3 steel CDs that will not play in my fairly new GE alarm clock. They do however play in my other players. There is a clear visual difference between these CDs and others. When you view the playing surface you can see shading on the burn tracks in contrast to the unused portion. I have concluded that this means they were burned using a particular standard inferior to industry. Does this mean I wouldn't have purchased these CDs? Not necessarilly. But it might be considered when pricing the product. And the buyer should be informed. When you get a test copy why not go to Wal-Mart and try it out on various quality players to see if it plays?

I brought this issue up to a forum member once before and his opinion was "I throw away players that skip". Okay, but that doesn't explain why some CDs do and most don't. I guess if I buy any new players I can use these discs for the product demo.

erik · Post by **erik** » 14 Jul 2005 5:09 pm

forgot to add my signature.

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-johnson

basilh · Post by **basilh** » 14 Jul 2005 5:16 pm

Why not use the terminologies.. Replicated and Duplicated to describe the difference between Burned CD-R and Pressed CD made from Glass Masters.
Basil

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Steel players do it without fretting

http://www.waikiki-islanders.com

erik · Post by **erik** » 14 Jul 2005 5:51 pm

I don't know the terminologies. But if you're saying there is only CD and CD-R than these are not marked correctly as CD-Rs.

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-johnson

basilh · Post by **basilh** » 14 Jul 2005 6:18 pm

Eric.. 0,45 seconds using Google returned this
Replicated http://www.bullseyedisc.com/rep_r.htm

Replicating discs by pressing CDs from a glass master is the industry standard for mass-produced Compact Discs, (as opposed to CD Duplication)

Dave Grafe · Post by **Dave Grafe** » 14 Jul 2005 9:51 pm

Many short-run products are "duplicated", i.e. burned onto CD-R blanks, but not necessarily marketed as "CD-R" product. A few, usually older, players are incapable of reading them. They are not inferior in any other way than that they are incompatible with these older machines.

It's just not cost-effective to manufacture small (under about 5,000) quantities any other way.

Klaus Caprani · Post by **Klaus Caprani** » 15 Jul 2005 1:45 am

CD-R's burned as audio CD's at more than 1x speed will most definetely have increased error content which makes them incompatible with a lot of consumer CD-players.

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Klaus Caprani

MCI RangeXpander S-10 3x4
www.klauscaprani.com

Steinar Gregertsen · Post by **Steinar Gregertsen** » 15 Jul 2005 1:57 am

If these CD's are 'home productions' then it may be that the masters have not been encoded according to the industry Redbook standard.
A not unknown mistake among 'home producers'....

Steinar

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www.gregertsen.com

Wayne Carver · Post by **Wayne Carver** » 15 Jul 2005 5:45 am

I have an early JVC dvd player that want play cd-r's. The only store bought cd that it want play is "Lonesome Prison Blues" Deadman #014 by Jerry Garcia. There are certain dvd's that it want play also.

Ray Minich · Post by **Ray Minich** » 15 Jul 2005 6:42 am

My Silverado's CD player is the test. I have purchased a number of PSG related CD's in the past year that won't play in the truck's player. Typically these CD's have been made using a CD burner in a PC or duplicator. What I've had to do is use my computer & Roxio to "reproduce" the CD. Using a burning speed of 4X I've duplicated each one successfully. The "slow cooked" CD's play everywhere OK.

Steve Hinson · Post by **Steve Hinson** » 15 Jul 2005 10:29 am

Wonder what a fair price would be for a CD-R steel guitar album?Just wondering...

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http://home.comcast.net/~stevehinson

Stephen LeBlanc · Post by **Stephen LeBlanc** » 15 Jul 2005 12:53 pm

my 2 cents...

older CD players don't play right no matter what the CD is...the error correction is artificial and definitly lowers the overall sound quality, er, in otherwords, the music won't sound like it's supposed to in an older CD player no matter how the CD was burned/manufactured

so, IMHO, if you care about the music you'll throw that old crappy CD player in the trash and buy something new, CD players are cheap[This message was edited by Stephen LeBlanc on 15 July 2005 at 01:56 PM.]

erik · Post by **erik** » 15 Jul 2005 1:45 pm

Steve H. wrote:

Wonder what a fair price would be for a CD-R steel guitar album?Just wondering...

Just proper advertising is fair enough.

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-johnson

erik · Post by **erik** » 15 Jul 2005 1:49 pm

Stephen L wrote:

IMHO, if you care about the music you'll throw that old crappy CD player in the trash and buy something new..

Who said it was old? I didn't. I bought it last summer and it's still being sold. It's my alarm clock that cost me $30. Wanna buy it?

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-johnson

[This message was edited by erik on 15 July 2005 at 02:50 PM.]

Steinar Gregertsen · Post by **Steinar Gregertsen** » 15 Jul 2005 5:01 pm

Actually, in the case of faulty or missing Redbook encoding, a high-end CD player will be more critical than a cheap 'consumer' player.

Steinar

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www.gregertsen.com

erik · Post by **erik** » 20 Jul 2005 9:05 am

I want to clear up a possible misinterpretation of my original post: I didn't intend to imply that mislabled product was done so intentially, but by lack of thorough consideration, and possibly lack of knowledge. I do believe it would be proper to let potential buyers know that what is being sold is in fact a CD-R and not an industry standard CD(this includes forum CDs). That being said I today found a solution to my problem which in the end is a great improvement, I went to Wal-Mart and purchased the el-cheapo Durabrand theater system for $25 and hooked it up to my DVD player(which plays CD-Rs). Now I have better sound(fuller, louder) and it can also double as my computer speakers. For the price I'm very impressed because it comes with two sets of inputs that can be controlled by the remote, which also has a handy mute button. So now, for ME it makes no difference if I buy CD or CD-R. Seeing how I listen to most of my music in my bedroom it also improves pedal steel exposure as now the sound is easier for neighbors to hear.

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-johnson

Stephen LeBlanc · Post by **Stephen LeBlanc** » 20 Jul 2005 9:10 am

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Stephen L wrote:
quote:
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IMHO, if you care about the music you'll throw that old crappy CD player in the trash and buy something new..
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Who said it was old? I didn't. I bought it last summer and it's still being sold. It's my alarm clock that cost me $30. Wanna buy it?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

sorry about making the assumption...I didn't think they still made CD players that have trouble reading CDRs...my mistake

I was just trying to inform those who don't know that there is a difference in sound quality between cheap CD players and more expensive models...in general

sorry if any of my posts come off as 'uppity'...not my intention at all, I just post quickly, not really spending too much time crafting my words

Smokey Fennell · Post by **Smokey Fennell** » 20 Jul 2005 11:03 am

There are two main types of recordable CDs.
CD-R and CD+R
All CD players do not read all formats even brand new ones. There is no way to tell by looking which type of CD was burned.

Steve Hinson · Post by **Steve Hinson** » 20 Jul 2005 2:48 pm

erik,I was actually asking"how much should a CD-R sell for?"...I am curious...I know that most steel guitar albums on CD sell for around $15-whether they are the commercially-manufactured ones or CD-Rs...should CD-Rs be priced at$10 or$12?Just wondering-I might want to make a record sometime...anybody?

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http://home.comcast.net/~stevehinson

John Daugherty · Post by **John Daugherty** » 20 Jul 2005 3:16 pm

Just because cd player is in a new system, does not make it a recently manufactured cd player. Nor does it make it a good cd player.
Read the topic in "computers" about recording CDs. All my CD players will play a CD-R recorded at 32x. Some players will not. In the topic I referred to, a CD recorded at 8x was considered playable in any common CD player.

Jeff Agnew · Post by **Jeff Agnew** » 21 Jul 2005 4:17 am

Smokey,

The two types of consumer-burnable CD media are CD-R and CD-RW (for rewritable). The plus and minus designations only apply to DVDs.

John Daugherty · Post by **John Daugherty** » 21 Jul 2005 4:36 am

Jeff, you are absolutely correct. There is no plus designation for CDs. No one is selling CDs in the RW format. They are all CD-R.

Dave Ristrim · Post by **Dave Ristrim** » 21 Jul 2005 4:37 am

Hey Steve. I would rather have a "pressed" Cd than a burned one, so... I think $10 or $12 for a CD-R is cool. But if people are willing to pay $15 or $17 for a pressed Cd with decent artwork, I say have a Cd plant press the Cd's to get a more professional product and look and sell it the higher price to make up for the initial cost.
I am getting close to starting my next project, do you want to collaborate?
Dave Ristrim

erik · Post by **erik** » 21 Jul 2005 1:43 pm

Steve H., I don't care what a person wants to sell their CD-R for as long as the buyer knows what it is. That's MY point. I have solved my problem, but what is wrong with telling people you are selling a CD-R? I think it's been stated by audiophiles above that a high quality CD player will not play a CD-R. Why not say on the web page, "This is a CD-R, most players will play a CD-R, if your's does not please be advised"?

BTW, I currently own 15 CDs/CD-Rs that I bought either from the forum or directly from the artist. I have a bunch of steel cassette tapes and other steel CDs from various sources, all new.

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-johnson

[This message was edited by erik on 21 July 2005 at 02:52 PM.]