Effects !! Are they necessary?

John O Keeffe · Post by **John O Keeffe** » 21 Oct 2001 4:19 pm

Tonight I played my Tele straight through the amp without any pedals.
I must say I had the Twangiest sound that anyone could ever ask for.All I was using was the reverb on the amp.

I am just wondering all these effects that people use for the steel are they really necessary?

I normally use a Boss DD5 delay pedal for the steel and thats it!

I would like to hear what people use and why??

JOHN.........

Pete Burak · Post by **Pete Burak** » 21 Oct 2001 5:15 pm

I'm currently using a Boss RV-3 (reverb/delay) because it sounds good (IMHO) and fits in my steel seat (eliminating the 4-space rack I was carrying around).
Like alot of folks, I've had my share of fun plugging the steel into any effects device available just to see what it would sound like.
Necessary?...
'Tis in the ear of the behearer!

-pb

Bobby Lee · Post by **Bobby Lee** » 21 Oct 2001 8:24 pm

This really belongs in Electronics, so I'll move it.

I rarely use effects for country gigs. I'll take my Boogie, Webb or both depending on the size of the gig, and just turn up the reverb a bit for the slow songs.

For rock gigs, I have a rack with a Lexicon MPX-100 and a Mesa V-Twin preamp. The echo, phase and rotary effects really add a lot to the overall sound of the band, and the distortion from the V-Twin blows away any 'fuzz box' I've ever heard.

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<img align=right src="http://b0b.com/b0b.gif" width="64" height="64">Bobby Lee - email: quasar@b0b.com - gigs - CDs
Sierra Session 12 (E9), Williams 400X (E7, D6), Sierra Olympic 12 (F Diatonic)
Sierra Laptop 8 (D13), Fender Stringmaster (E13, A6)

Ernie Renn · Post by **Ernie Renn** » 21 Oct 2001 9:10 pm

Effects are optional. They are meant to enhance your sound, nothing more. They aren't really necessary.

I'm reminded of a story I heart about guitarist Bucky Barrett: Bucky was trying to find a unique sound for doing some sessions. Everything had seemingly been done. Then it occurred to him to try plugging his guitar directly into the amp. From what I heard it was almost a month before he told anyone his secret. He didn't even tell people who asked him directly. He wanted to keep the rare sound for himself. Go figure...

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My best,
Ernie

The Official Buddy Emmons Website
www.buddyemmons.com

Jack Stoner · Post by **Jack Stoner** » 22 Oct 2001 2:27 am

This same question comes up periodically.

My answer is yes. However I'll qualify that. I normally use some reverb and a little delay and probably what I use 98% of the time. But there are special occasions that some type of effect can tastefully be used.

The worst case scenario is the guy that gets on a kick and uses an effect all night.

Bill C. Buntin · Post by **Bill C. Buntin** » 22 Oct 2001 4:05 am

I made the early mistake of relying on effects to give me a good tone. Later I learned that you should have good tone with just the guitar, amp and your hands. With the exception of always using reverb. It took a while but now I can get an acceptable tone with just the amp and reverb. But I prefer the outboard effects to shape the signal to fit the room.

Larry Bell · Post by **Larry Bell** » 22 Oct 2001 8:23 am

Play the effect . . . don't let the effect play you. Just like choosing which notes to play: sometimes NO NOTE is the best choice. Same goes for Fx.

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Larry Bell - email: larry@larrybell.org - gigs - Home Page
2000 Fessenden S-12 8x8, 1969 Emmons S-12 6x6, 1971 Emmons D-10 9x9, 1971 Dobro

Jerry Roller · Post by **Jerry Roller** » 22 Oct 2001 8:58 am

Here is my strange story. I have felt that I had to have some reverb and a touch of delay. Last Saturday night, I was using my Matchbro on a song and I was using a rack and I switched the effects bypass so the dobro sound would be more realistic. After that song I switched the Matchbro off and somehow was distracted and failed to turn the effects back on. I was using a ProFex II which I have programmed a program with nothing in it so it serves as a bypass. Anyway, I played about 4 songs before I realized I had absolutely nothing but raw amp and I was completely satisfied with it until I noticed that the effects was (were) off. Maybe our mind thinks we need them more than our ears do.
Jerry

John O Keeffe · Post by **John O Keeffe** » 22 Oct 2001 9:38 am

Interesting replies!

Wasn't there a period of time in the 70's when "Chorus" effect was used a lot on steel recordings??

I use it on the Tele but not on the Steel but after last night I'm thinking I might ditch that pedal too and simply use just the DD5 for both steel and Tele!

I remember a few years ago I heard a guy playing in a band ,apparently he was just filling in for the night on lead guitar.
He had an awsome sound with real punch !

I spoke to him later and found he was playing about the cheapest guitar you could get through a Peavey Bandit with no effects.

At the time I was playing Tele through a multi effects unit......LOL I got rid of that effects unit soon after...

....John [This message was edited by John O Keeffe on 22 October 2001 at 10:39 AM.]

Ernie Renn · Post by **Ernie Renn** » 22 Oct 2001 1:42 pm

After getting some advice from Buddy, I'm only using delay. Reverb detracts from the sound, but delay adds to it. It's been about a year and only use reverb when I play one or two tunes on guitar. I don't really miss it either.

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My best,
Ernie

The Official Buddy Emmons Website
www.buddyemmons.com

Anders Brundell · Post by **Anders Brundell** » 22 Oct 2001 1:44 pm

I prefer a moderate amount of chorus. It sounds a little thin without it. Doesn´t many people say that p/p Emmons sounds like having a chorus even when they´re played straight thru?

chas smith · Post by **chas smith** » 22 Oct 2001 3:15 pm

I played 3 sets last night of standards from the 30s and 40s. I'm using a Standel amp and I brought along a tube spring reverb to wet it up a bit. The reverb was DOA so it took a few tunes to get used to the sound and when all was said and done, it sounded pretty good for that genre. Normally I prefer a taste of spring reverb and if I'm nervous enough to where I can hear it in my playing I'll take out a short delay to 'cover' it up.

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 22 Oct 2001 6:34 pm

John, most of the replies here go along with my own thinking. Effects are OK if not overdone, or used all the time. Used sparingly, they add a little variety. Used constantly, they provoke boredom and sameness. I've used 'em all, but prefer just a little reverb for the most part. But I have heard some amateur players who just "pile on" effects to make up for deficiencies in sound and technique. This may fool John Q. Public, but not a real musician.

"Bad cakes usually have a lot of icing."

Lee Baucum · Post by **Lee Baucum** » 22 Oct 2001 7:42 pm

I was fooling around with a friend's Peavey Session 2000 and I noticed that most of the settings that I thought sounded really good had a blend of reverb, delay, and chorus. I think that just a tad (a small tad, at that) of chorus really adds a lot to the overall sound.

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Lee, from South Texas

ebb · Post by **ebb** » 23 Oct 2001 1:52 am

effects give me hearing fatigue. when i listen back to my isgc 2001 tapes it is tom morrell's sound (dry into a walter woods) that is most appealing to me. another dry player who was effective was jimmy day.

Smiley Roberts · Post by **Smiley Roberts** » 23 Oct 2001 6:44 am

I use lotza effects. Makes up for lack o' talent! "If ya can't amaze 'em with talent,baffle 'em with bulls__t!"

John O Keeffe · Post by **John O Keeffe** » 23 Oct 2001 12:18 pm

Some great replies everybody.....!

Well said Donny I like the Icing on the Cake bit .....how true that is!

Smiley is it true that you can get those effects even when the strings are off your guitar.............WOW........!!!

John......

Matt Farrow · Post by **Matt Farrow** » 23 Oct 2001 2:58 pm

Not directly steel-related, but a good antectdote:

I went to see a band a few years back, can't remember their name, but it was a standard 4-piece blues outfit, rhythm guitar and lead vocals, bass, drums, and lead guitar. Apparently they were waiting on their lead guitar player to show up (you know guitar players,) and finally this guy who looks kind of like Bill Gates comes in. He's got a guitar case under one arm and a little Vibro-Champ or maybe just a regular Champ amp. He put that amp on a chair, pulled his Strat out of the case, and plugged in. That's all he had, a guitar, amp, and cord. I have never ever been blown away by anybody's tone like that! Goes to show sometimes less is more.

Matt Farrow

PS I use the reverb and tremolo in my amp, and a custom-made Boss Tone type fuzz on my steel.

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Matt Farrow
Marlen 9-string 6+2
Kustom K150

http://www.skybolt6.com/pharaohamps

Steven Knapper · Post by **Steven Knapper** » 23 Oct 2001 6:24 pm

Red Rhodes used a lot of chours at times and Leslie. You can hear that stuff in most of the work he did with Michael Nezmith, BUT he was a, lot of the time the lead guitar on that stuff, and it was great. But the chours was very subtle most of the time, but not always.
So, trying to be a Red clone, in my own style, I use the same stuff at times.

Dennis Detweiler · Post by **Dennis Detweiler** » 23 Oct 2001 8:37 pm

All opinion of course? Some people like mex or chinese food and some don't.
I use tone changing effects occasionally. Digital delay and reverb all of the time. Add a notch more delay on slow tunes.
Witch's Brew wouldn't be the same without the envelope filter (wah) and added delay.
Dennis

Glenn Suchan · Post by **Glenn Suchan** » 24 Oct 2001 7:05 am

Playing "dry" with just the guitar, volume pedal and amp is a true "reality check" on your playing skills. It's a great way to hone up left and right hand playing skills as well as playing in tune.

For a true acid test try a gig with just the guitar and an amp. No volume pedal. This is guarranteed to clean-up sloppy playing in a hurry! I did this recently. I was upset with the sound man at a gig. He kept canceling out my signal to the mains when I would swell the volume with the volume pedal. I told him to set the volume for my "peaks" and don't worry when the level drops. It's supposed to be that way. Instead, he kept chasing my volume pedal with his line level. When he got tired of that he'd just backed the line level way off. So, I disconnected the volume pedal for the rest of the gig. I sure developed a sense of picking dynamics in a hurry. A good experience, tho.

As far as playing with effects is concerned. In my opinion, they are like seasoning in food. A little goes a long way and all seasonings don't work in all foods. I generally play with a slight mix of reverb and delay (about 375ms delay) on slower songs. On fast songs just a slight mix of reverb. Occasionally (maybe two or three songs a gig), I'll play with flanging, or MXR envelope filtering, or Boss Tone fuzz tone. On those songs the effects settings are not overbearing and may only be used during a small portion of the song.

I think a rule of thumb for effects would be: If a song can be enhanced by the use of an effect then it may be desirable to add it sparingly. If a stomp box is luring the player with "cool" sounds that "just gotta be used" then it can be a deterement to the song and the sound of the steel.

Keep on pickin'!
Glenn

John O Keeffe · Post by **John O Keeffe** » 24 Oct 2001 10:05 am

How true! Like everybody says a little of anything isn't too bad if it enhances the sound!
I omitted to say on the orginal post that my tele has a "Hotrails" pickup at the bridge and I played on this particular pickup without the effects.

However when switching to steel normal I find to get a good punch from the steel I have to press the "Pushbright" button in the amp!

John...