C6th 1st string - ?
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- Roger Rettig
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C6th 1st string - ?
I know this is crazy, but every so-often, I feel like having the G on top. Not permanently - that D opens up so much - but when I hear something that was clearly done with the old ten-string tuning it tempts me.
IS there a gauge that might be capable of sounding halfway decent when tuned to either note?
I'm looking for a lazy solution!
IS there a gauge that might be capable of sounding halfway decent when tuned to either note?
I'm looking for a lazy solution!
Roger Rettig - Emmons D10
(8+9: 'Day' pedals) Williams SD-12 (D13th: 8+6), Quilter TT-12, B-bender Teles and several old Martins.
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(8+9: 'Day' pedals) Williams SD-12 (D13th: 8+6), Quilter TT-12, B-bender Teles and several old Martins.
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- Ricky Davis
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Yeah back when I played C6 Neck( two week notice neck...ha)
, just like George said I used the 12 also it went very nicely between the high G and down to a D no problems, matter of fact I think I did them both on this song 23 years ago LIVE in London>>>>
https://youtu.be/tcVeooHXId8?si=1U_6JQ996Zki5GFe
Ricky
, just like George said I used the 12 also it went very nicely between the high G and down to a D no problems, matter of fact I think I did them both on this song 23 years ago LIVE in London>>>>
https://youtu.be/tcVeooHXId8?si=1U_6JQ996Zki5GFe
Ricky
Ricky Davis
Email Ricky: sshawaiian2362@gmail.com
Email Ricky: sshawaiian2362@gmail.com
- Roger Rettig
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Thanks, guys.
I have never played that neck without a D on top. After seeing you mentioning the 'G#', I looked up some older setups.
It seems that it was standard to raise the 1st to G# on P5.
Why? It has no place in the 2/9th chord that is the main use of p5.
It's actually a flat-5th.
How might it have been used?
I have never played that neck without a D on top. After seeing you mentioning the 'G#', I looked up some older setups.
It seems that it was standard to raise the 1st to G# on P5.
Why? It has no place in the 2/9th chord that is the main use of p5.
It's actually a flat-5th.
How might it have been used?
Roger Rettig - Emmons D10
(8+9: 'Day' pedals) Williams SD-12 (D13th: 8+6), Quilter TT-12, B-bender Teles and several old Martins.
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(8+9: 'Day' pedals) Williams SD-12 (D13th: 8+6), Quilter TT-12, B-bender Teles and several old Martins.
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- Roger Rettig
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Tony
I have that raise and wouldn't sacrifice the D string for anything. Getting the high G three frets up is in my DNA.
There are two pieces in particular that seem to me require the G string: Mike Smith's splendid Jesus Loves Me and Russ Hicks' (Barefoot Jerry) Two Mile Pike.
Mike's tune is not too much of a problem with a D at 1, but Russ' tune depends open pull-offs and open strings.
(I cab almost find '..Pike' in D using the current tuning but it's not quite right. )
I have that raise and wouldn't sacrifice the D string for anything. Getting the high G three frets up is in my DNA.
There are two pieces in particular that seem to me require the G string: Mike Smith's splendid Jesus Loves Me and Russ Hicks' (Barefoot Jerry) Two Mile Pike.
Mike's tune is not too much of a problem with a D at 1, but Russ' tune depends open pull-offs and open strings.
(I cab almost find '..Pike' in D using the current tuning but it's not quite right. )
Roger Rettig - Emmons D10
(8+9: 'Day' pedals) Williams SD-12 (D13th: 8+6), Quilter TT-12, B-bender Teles and several old Martins.
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(8+9: 'Day' pedals) Williams SD-12 (D13th: 8+6), Quilter TT-12, B-bender Teles and several old Martins.
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When the G-G# change appears on P5, I don't think it is intended to be used with the other P5 changes - for instance, P5,6&7 will give a diminished chord on strings 1-4.
Make sleeping dogs tell the truth!
Homebuilt keyless U12 7x5, Excel keyless U12 8x8, Williams keyless U12 7x8, Telonics rack and 15" cabs
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I watched Jernigan tune between D and G in a few seconds while playing an Emmons Legrande at Seymour's store. He used the .012 gage string for it. I do use the C to C# change a bit to get the G note three frets up. Some of the Emmons black album tunes and much of Pete Drake's C6 tunes require the high G string.
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- Roger Rettig
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- Ricky Davis
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Roger that was the Border Line in London>What was the venue in London?
Here's the whole album>
https://youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5 ... zrkviivCvf
Ricky
Ricky Davis
Email Ricky: sshawaiian2362@gmail.com
Email Ricky: sshawaiian2362@gmail.com
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One solution, however requiring a complete re-working of the undercarriage, would be to omit the traditional 10th string and move the entire tuning one string to the left.
This would make the tuning an Fmaj6/9 chord, low to high being: F A C E G A C E G D, with string 1 being the re-entrant note (similar to the F# on the E9 tuning).
I've considered this in the past but felt I was too into the modern tuning (D on s.1) to change over. Of course I have 5 knee levers on that tuning, so the C-C# change is de rigeur.
This would make the tuning an Fmaj6/9 chord, low to high being: F A C E G A C E G D, with string 1 being the re-entrant note (similar to the F# on the E9 tuning).
I've considered this in the past but felt I was too into the modern tuning (D on s.1) to change over. Of course I have 5 knee levers on that tuning, so the C-C# change is de rigeur.
My rig: Infinity and Telonics.
Son, we live in a world with walls, and those walls have to be guarded by men with steel guitars. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Lt. Weinberg?
Son, we live in a world with walls, and those walls have to be guarded by men with steel guitars. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Lt. Weinberg?
- Roger Rettig
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Ah, The Borderline - that's where I played with the Big E! I'll listen to that at my next dialysis treatment; it'll make the time fly by.
Herb: You have a point and, with 12 strings, you can have it all. I love Rick Schmidt's D-12 set-up. He has the equivalent chromatic strings on C6th, mirroring those on E9.
I have to say that, at this point, the 10th string is my least-used on the back neck. Would I miss it? I'd dread the upheaval of changing all those pulls, though.
I just want to tinker occasionally with that high G so I doubt I'd make such a radical change at my age (said the man who's awaiting delivery of a new SD12 D13th!!!)
Herb: You have a point and, with 12 strings, you can have it all. I love Rick Schmidt's D-12 set-up. He has the equivalent chromatic strings on C6th, mirroring those on E9.
I have to say that, at this point, the 10th string is my least-used on the back neck. Would I miss it? I'd dread the upheaval of changing all those pulls, though.
I just want to tinker occasionally with that high G so I doubt I'd make such a radical change at my age (said the man who's awaiting delivery of a new SD12 D13th!!!)
Roger Rettig - Emmons D10
(8+9: 'Day' pedals) Williams SD-12 (D13th: 8+6), Quilter TT-12, B-bender Teles and several old Martins.
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(8+9: 'Day' pedals) Williams SD-12 (D13th: 8+6), Quilter TT-12, B-bender Teles and several old Martins.
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I briefly borrowed an S-12 and tuned it thusly:Roger Rettig wrote: Herb: You have a point and, with 12 strings, you can have it all. I love Rick Schmidt's D-12 set-up. He has the equivalent chromatic strings on C6th, mirroring those on E9.
I have to say that, at this point, the 10th string is my least-used on the back neck. Would I miss it? I'd dread the upheaval of changing all those pulls, though.
I just want to tinker occasionally with that high G so I doubt I'd make such a radical change at my age (said the man who's awaiting delivery of a new SD12.. !!!)
D F A C E G A C E G B D
without any pedal changes and in non-pedal mode, of which I am familiar anyway. I believe this is the tuning Reece used on his non-pedal S12 (the guitar I borrowed had E9Uni pedals and I don't mess with the pedals on guitars I don't own.)
I never pulled the trigger on that or any S-12, so far; I really didn't give the tuning a fair trial because I was gigging enough and I didn't want to commit to learning a new sight picture on the neck. But the chord possiblities are endless, even with no pedals.
Anyway, here and now I'm getting rid of stuff, not acquiring more, so I doubt I'll be living in S-12Land anytime soon. In the winter of my career, I'm just gonna pick my way into the Texas sunset on the ol' C6 with a D on top.
My rig: Infinity and Telonics.
Son, we live in a world with walls, and those walls have to be guarded by men with steel guitars. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Lt. Weinberg?
Son, we live in a world with walls, and those walls have to be guarded by men with steel guitars. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Lt. Weinberg?
- Greg Cutshaw
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My 12 string Excel with changeover lever had all the strings in C6 Mode:
F
D
G
E
C
A
G
E
C
A
https://www.gregcutshaw.com/Excel%2012% ... yless.html
and a low E and B on E9th to boot.
F
D
G
E
C
A
G
E
C
A
https://www.gregcutshaw.com/Excel%2012% ... yless.html
and a low E and B on E9th to boot.
The re-entrant pair of strings is a great idea, just like on E9. I shall live out my days in Uniland, but at least I have the equivalent of a high G. In B6 mode it goes
B E G# B D# F# G# B D# G# C# F#
B E G# B D# F# G# B D# G# C# F#
Make sleeping dogs tell the truth!
Homebuilt keyless U12 7x5, Excel keyless U12 8x8, Williams keyless U12 7x8, Telonics rack and 15" cabs
Homebuilt keyless U12 7x5, Excel keyless U12 8x8, Williams keyless U12 7x8, Telonics rack and 15" cabs
- Roger Rettig
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Herb:
If I wasn't prevented from taking show contracts by my dialysis schedule, I wouldn't dream of even monkeying around with pedal/KL changes on my standard Emmons D10, much less attempting this new D13th concept at 80 years old.
I'm more than a bit compulsive and, when I first looked at D13 (JC's), I jumped in an ordered a guitar! I've altered things a bit to accommodate my musical priorities but it's along his lines.
What I should have done was say to myself: 'That's clever - if I was starting now, that's what I'd have' and left it at that.
It's about to arrive! In my last 4.5 years of unemployed/medical retirement, I've probably done too much tinkering. Right now, I'm following Doug Jernigan's videos and pondering some of his extra pulls.
I'm viewing the new Williams D13th rather like a top-of-the-line Erector Set (Meccano in England) - I'll open the box and, metaphorically speaking, build a three-inch long wheelbarrow rather than the large-scale Queensborough Bridge of which it's capable.
Joking aside, I'm sure I'll enjoy it - at the very least, the thought of a P7 option on a 9th tuning (D9, of course; the left half of my new guitar) has always appealed to me. Jumping to 1 and 2 doesn't quite cut it.
I still wonder if I'd have done better to get a D12 but that ship has sailed.
Having said that, I have recently had a call to do a (fairly) local run of a show next Spring! My first instinct was to decline but I soon realized that I wanted to do it. I miss playing with others. I miss it all.
It may be six months away, but I bet I still take my Emmons D10.
If I wasn't prevented from taking show contracts by my dialysis schedule, I wouldn't dream of even monkeying around with pedal/KL changes on my standard Emmons D10, much less attempting this new D13th concept at 80 years old.
I'm more than a bit compulsive and, when I first looked at D13 (JC's), I jumped in an ordered a guitar! I've altered things a bit to accommodate my musical priorities but it's along his lines.
What I should have done was say to myself: 'That's clever - if I was starting now, that's what I'd have' and left it at that.
It's about to arrive! In my last 4.5 years of unemployed/medical retirement, I've probably done too much tinkering. Right now, I'm following Doug Jernigan's videos and pondering some of his extra pulls.
I'm viewing the new Williams D13th rather like a top-of-the-line Erector Set (Meccano in England) - I'll open the box and, metaphorically speaking, build a three-inch long wheelbarrow rather than the large-scale Queensborough Bridge of which it's capable.
Joking aside, I'm sure I'll enjoy it - at the very least, the thought of a P7 option on a 9th tuning (D9, of course; the left half of my new guitar) has always appealed to me. Jumping to 1 and 2 doesn't quite cut it.
I still wonder if I'd have done better to get a D12 but that ship has sailed.
Having said that, I have recently had a call to do a (fairly) local run of a show next Spring! My first instinct was to decline but I soon realized that I wanted to do it. I miss playing with others. I miss it all.
It may be six months away, but I bet I still take my Emmons D10.
Roger Rettig - Emmons D10
(8+9: 'Day' pedals) Williams SD-12 (D13th: 8+6), Quilter TT-12, B-bender Teles and several old Martins.
----------------------------------
(8+9: 'Day' pedals) Williams SD-12 (D13th: 8+6), Quilter TT-12, B-bender Teles and several old Martins.
----------------------------------
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I don't play a lot of straight C6 but that G to G# change on pedal 5 has intrigued me for a while. I've incorporated the equivalent into some different tuning set ups.
Its a beautifully useful #11...
C6 wise, at fret 11 w/ P5 its C#9(#11) which is a really nice G7, 5 chord sub. It resolves to C6 up one fret.
The Major7#11 use is great too...
P5 w/ Cs raised to C#.....Think "Moon River" on the 4 chord....'WIDER THAN A MILE' ....(maj7 #11)
Also great for a kind of 'F lever' effect playing 3rds with the E string....
I would think having both the G and D would be the ultimate. Hmm Bb6?
Its a beautifully useful #11...
C6 wise, at fret 11 w/ P5 its C#9(#11) which is a really nice G7, 5 chord sub. It resolves to C6 up one fret.
The Major7#11 use is great too...
P5 w/ Cs raised to C#.....Think "Moon River" on the 4 chord....'WIDER THAN A MILE' ....(maj7 #11)
Also great for a kind of 'F lever' effect playing 3rds with the E string....
I would think having both the G and D would be the ultimate. Hmm Bb6?
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