Difficulty of pedal steel vs other instruments.

[John Palumbo]

Not sure if this is on subject but anyway:

A long time ago when I was a young man going to a Catholic Grade school, I wanted so much to learn to play (6-string) guitar but the nun teaching the class kept pushing me to learn piano, saying that guitar was too difficult, needless to say I took her advise and to this day every time I pick up a 6-string guitar, when changing chords with my left hand with any kind of speed I always did and still find it so hard to do.

Needless to say a long time later I discovered pedal steel where did not have to worry about fingering chords but now a whole bunch of other things. Although I have a long way to go with the pedal steel at least I'm enjoying it.

[Joe Goldmark]

Theory. The same reason that it's so hard to read music on the steel, makes it probably the hardest instrument to master. And that is, on piano there's only one middle C, on violin maybe two, on the pedal steel 5 or 6, and so forth. So just finding and mastering all the positions makes the theory difficult.

Next is the basic technique. Every level that you manage to get to, makes you realize how poor your technique really is in relation to the folks who truly make the instrument sing. This comes from your touch and your volume control, and of course your ear. Watch Curley Chalker, who had incredible technique, along with amazing musicianship: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b75msHFynvU

Joe

[Bill McCloskey]

The same reason that it's so hard to read music on the steel, makes it probably the hardest instrument to master

I would slightly disagree with this. While there may be as many places to play C as you have strings, only one or two spots are going to make sense within the context of the harmony. I read music for lap steel and it isn't really that hard. The choices aren't as unlimited as first appears.

[Joe Goldmark]

Hey Bill,

You are correct in that when you're reading, you'll be thinking open or closed positions primarily. But not so when you're improvising. Also, I mentioned 5-6 positions for middle C, but really with pedals, it's probably double that amount.

[Doug Beaumier]

Well, without using any pedals or levers on E9 tuning, there are 9 places to play a high C note (on strings 1 through 9.. all the way up to fret 22).
Lowering and raising the two E strings will give you 4 more "locations" for high C. That's 13 positions. The A & B pedals will give you 4 more. That's 17. And pedal C, string 4 raise, adds one more. That's 18. Then you've got the string 1 raise and the string 2 lower... So a basic setup has 20 or more locations to play a high C note.

In practical use though, I think most players choose an area of the fretboard, within a span of 4 or 5 frets, and play the notes in that position.

[Lee Dassow]

I'd put it right up there with the piano which is the hardest IMO Tenn.Lee

[Dave Mudgett]

Agreeing with Susan Alcorn's comment: 1) yes it definitely takes time to play any serious instrument at a high level; and 2) I would say it like this - the activation energy - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Activation_energy - necessary to get 'over the hump' to a decent (i.e., "not sound terrible") level is relatively high for instruments like steel-family, violin-family, double-reed family, and so on, as compared to something like guitar or piano.

For example, piano (which I started playing in 1960 in first or second grade), you hit middle C, play a simple do-re-mi type of melody, hit a simple chord, whatever - and in a few weeks it sorta sounds like piano. Guitar, you learn 3 cowboy chords and in a few days, you can play Kumbaya at summer camp - that was my experience anyway. Pretty similar with a lot of the popular 'folk instruments'. This is not to say that it's easy to get really good at these - obviously, that takes years to decades of hard work, and most players never really get there. But for real torture, listen to beginning violin students for a couple of hours. Like chalk screeching on the blackboard. In most instances, for quite a period of time, like years.

I started pedal steel in my mid-late 40s after playing piano for 7-8 years, then largely moved to guitar for 30+; added banjo 6-7, and studied bass in college for a year or two. The instrument made sense to me (complexity doesn't bother me - I'm an applied mathematician/scientist/engineer by trade), and I had lots of musical experience. But getting it to sound decent eluded me for quite a while. A guy I knew lost his lap steel player and asked me to play a gig with his band just a few weeks after I started playing. I'm sure it was terrible, but he felt it added something on some of his material. So sitting behind the steel with a Tele over my shoulder, I joined his band. I practiced constantly for several months - I mean, I did little else except do my gigs. I was lucky - my guitar store's biz partner had just come back off the road and was ready to take up the slack.

Considering that the only instruction I had was the Tim McCasland video (which I think was a pretty good place to start), I think I made reasonable progress. But some of that stuff got recorded, and some of my playing was absolutely cringeworthy. But there were flashes where it was OK. I owe Kris for his extreme patience! He had Cindy Cashdollar do mostly lap steel and dobro on that first record, but he wanted pedal steel on one tune, so I did it and it was sorta' OK. But make no mistake - it sounds like someone in the early stages of learning pedal steel.

I also agree witih Joe Goldmark that the things that make reading harder (I believe it is much harder than reading for voice or piano) also make steel harder, conceptually. But I really think the biggest issue is the extremely physical aspect of playing pedal steel. You're either all-in or you're all-out. I think if you're reasonably musical and you can hang in there long enough to really woodshed for an extended period, it can work. But IMO, this instrument is not a good choice for dabblers and dilettantes.

Ha - this is a bit long, but I'm stuck at home with covid again, and I guess I have time on my hands,

[Henry Matthews]

I kicked several songs off on steel after been playing 2 weeks. Try that on fiddle.
The songs I kicked off were shall we say at most, recognizable.

[Tony Prior]

I began playing Steel maybe 1973 or 1974. No lessons, just a Sho Bud Maverick and a Sho Bud "licks on a record" course. I had been playing guitar for probably 10 years. A friend came over and showed me a couple of things with the knee lever but that was it. I figured out the AB pedals in the most simple way, from the Sho Bud LICKS record, I was on my way !

NOT

I told some local friends that I was now playing Pedal Steel and of course I got a call to play with an established band. Well I learned rather quickly that the Sho Bud LICKS record was missing a few things... I got fired the 1st night of a two night gig.

Its not that the instrument is difficult to play in a very basic form, it actually isn't that difficult and wasn't for me, its that like ANY Instrument, as Susan stated above, getting to a PERFORMING "state" requires time, dedication and knowing what it is we are studying. Learning to play a song is not learning the instrument, two totally different scenario's .

There is no doubt that the Pedal Steel has some very unique characteristics which seem different than other instruments, but they are mechanical , not musical. Playing guitar with 3 fingers is not the same as playing guitar with 4 fingers. How we approach the guitar fretboard with fingering can make our playing very simplistic or advanced. Playing right hand piano with one finger left hand is not the same as left and right hand piano playing.

I recall I walked into Bobbee Seymore's store one day and he yelled out--- "Here comes Tony Prior, he always wanted to play Steel Guitar in the worst way, and now he does " He didn't know how right he was !

Study, proper practice and learn the instrument , the songs will follow. The musical language on the Pedal Steel is no different than other instruments, they all speak the same language.

In mathematical efficiency terms its rather common to go from 0 to 70 % , harder to go from 70% to 80% , real hard to go from 80% to 90% , extremally difficult to go from 90% to 95% and in all probability never go from 95% to 100%

[Bill McCloskey]

After 20 some years of playing lap steel and dobro, a few weeks ago I finally picked up my first pedal steel.

1. First, already playing lap steel gives you a big leg up. Not having to learn how to use a bar and play a fretless instrument and already being used to fingerpicks (in my case, 4 picks) makes learning the instrument easier. However..

2. The biggest challenge (for me anyway) is coordinating the pedals, volume pedal and the knee levers. Pressing the AB pedals makes me also want to press the volume pedal, so isolating both feet to do different things at the same time is a challenge I haven't had to face before and is non trivial.

3. 2nd biggest challenge is providing enough pressure to pedals to actually play cleanly and in tune. Rocking my foot, especially with disabled ankles like I have, was a real issue until I got some shoes designed for Organists to use when playing pedals. It actually helped quite a bit.

4. So far I'm just noodling and can't really play a tune yet. I go back to my lap steel to actually play and jam along with a tune . That said, I've never played an instrument that was as much fun and had me as obsessed. I'm hooked.

5. An added bonus: It seems the pedal work and rocking the AB pedals is actually HELPING my ankle. It hurts less and seems stronger and less painful when I walk. I guess it is all the exercise it is suddenly getting. It is actually therapeutic

[Michael Johnstone]

I started out on rock & roll guitar like most guys and I made a living for a number of years doing that in the 60s and early 70s. When I had a guitar repair shop in the back of a music store in Norfolk, I was called on to set up a Fender 400, a D-10 ZB and an Emmons PP - none of which I had ever laid hands or eyes on and met 3 steel players in the process. But I was raised helping my dad rebuild car engines so I was mechanically inclined. I could look at the mechanics of a steel and see how it worked immediately. I was fascinated by the sound and started wondering if I too,should be playing one. I ended up with the Fender 400 and in a few weeks ran up against its E9 limitations and bought a 72 MSA S10 Classic w/5+4,a couple mail order courses,found a couple experienced local steel pickers,followed them around picking their brains,practiced day and night over the summer and then started telling people I was a steel player. Inside of 18 months I'd moved to LA and was gigging steady playing gutbucket cheatin' & drinkin' country steel and just jumped into the deep end of the pool and started swimming. Back then there were a hundred country bars with live music in SoCal within an hours drive,famous monster pickers everywhere and I lived 6 blocks from the Palomino. What I found easy was how I could take all the work I'd been doing with only 2 hands on guitar, divide and distribute it to 2 hands, 2 feet and 2 knees. More stuff to do but it was easy stuff. You didn't actually have to form your fingers into a shape and then go fetch a chord - you just stepped on pedals and related chords just melted into each other on one fret. I felt like I was getting away with murder. Plus I got to sit down. The hardest part was clean fingerpicking - that took 5 years. Many years later I got a Stringmaster just for the challenge and found it much more difficult and tricky to get to things. Back to fetching water. I had to think in smaller musical chunks. Less strings to work with,slants,shell voicings and all that. And whenever I was asked to pick up a guitar on a gig, I found it to be rather static and 2 dimensional. Pedal steel was my magic unicorn and I'm still ridin' it.

[Chris Brooks]

Another aspect barely touched upon here is repertoire. We have talked about the physical tasks of playing--getting sounds out of the instrument, but on the bandstand we are expected to know the repertoire too.

My first gig as "steelman" was in Fairbanks in 1975, with experienced CW musicians. Sure, I could play decently, but I didn't yet know the tunes, even the country standards. And when a tune is called, the band looks over at the steel player to kick it off, right?

After a couple of months there at the Flame Lounge I had built a foundation, at least.

[Arty Passes]

The thing about pedal steel is that when you get good enough to just play chords, it sounds good. Many years ago I tried banjo but the sound of me practicing was like nails on a blackboard. Not to mention what I was doing to my neighbors. I imagine fiddle would be similar. I learned the basic chords on a guitar but I have no natural left hand chord making skills above 1st position, so pedal steel is perfect. I spent a lot of my day job career as a live TV director (and a lot of other things) so the complexity did not intimidate me. Once you get the trick and know what to do without thinking about it, it's sometimes like cheating, compared to non-pedal steel

[chuck lemasters]

Pedal steel is a difficult instrument for sure, but there are some passages, movements, whatever that naturally come easier on steel than on some other instruments. As an example, an accomplished rock guitar player friend recently visited and while we were sitting around, he picked up a guitar and ripped off Eric Johnson’s Cliffs of Dover. I could never get through that on six string, but a couple of days later, I sat at the steel and picked out the head of the tune fairly quickly. The finger twisting descending lines and arpeggiated runs lay much better on steel than on six string, I am at best a hack on either instrument, but I was rather surprised how well that tune fit on steel…..not the intro, of course, nor the ending, only the main body of the song…..BUT, if ever I am sitting in with a band and the front man turns and peers at me from under his cowboy hat, and says, “Hey, Pard, do ya know any Eric Johnson?”….I can say, “Well, Bub, just a little”. Perhaps that will make up for my inability to add anything to the Orange Blossom Special.

[Christopher Woitach]

This is an interesting thread, and everyone has made great points, both towards “hard” or “not hard”.

I’ll add a particular situation that happened yesterday -

I got a call for a recording session to play pedal steel, guitar, and ukulele (client’s axe, soprano uke, so a 4th higher than the guitar). I got there early as always, but the session was running behind, so they decided to do the steel and then the other stuff later. I set up, and realized that I had forgotten to change to the shoes I usually use, these were a bit big, but I figured I could just deal with it. He puts a 4 page chart of an original jazz type tune, with single lines that needed to be played in chord melody fashion. I took a second to figure them out, then it was time to record… yeah, I did fine, client very happy, so all good, but - it would’ve been 1000 times easier on the guitar, so my vote is that steel is much harder to play, for me, for some stuff. If I’d had advance copies of the chart, if I’d had the right shoes, if if if, I’m sure it would’ve been better, but again, on guitar, I wouldn’t have even broken a sweat, and I definitely was sweating this one.

[Landon Johnson]

For most instruments I would agree. But if you've ever played a double reed instrument like the Uilleann Pipes, there is a significant inherent difficulty with the instrument itself and its sensitivity to humidity.

Played bassoon for many years - fingering was just a suggestion. All the intonation came from the embouchure.

[Mitch Ellis]

For me, learning to play the swinette was much more difficult than learning to play a pedal steel guitar.

Jack,
What is the swinette? Please tell us!

Mitch

[Jim Arnold]

Be careful what you ask for!

[Rich Upright]

Playing pedal steel is like driving a stick shift, or like riding a motorcycle.
Just not as risky!

[Thornton Lewis]

I'm more of a psg operator than a musician but I will chime in.
I think the psg at a basic level is easy. Hold the bar straight, play three adjacent strings, boom,triad. Push 2 pedals, 4 chord Push one pedal and a lever, 5 chord. Push one pedal 6, one lever 3. Etc.
Whenever my friends come over with kids over 10 or so I put them in front of my steel and show them three chords and put their foot on the volume pedal (after hiding my fingerpicks.) I have never had one say how hard it was to play or express frustration. They usually screw around for 15 minutes and come back with a big smile on their face. You will not get that handing them a clarinet.
Obviously playing professionally is a different story, but I don't know anything about that.
Those two top strings do lead to questions from guitarists, piano players, and most rational people however.

[Andrew Frost]

In many ways its the limitations of an instrument that make it a challenge...

The things that make an instrument complex and appear 'difficult' are actually there to make it easier to play the music at hand...

This applies to steel guitar in a major way.

An ironic thing is that the complexities of pedal steel guitar often appear overwhelming to a non steel player but these things - pedals, levers, numerous strings - these things are all in place to make it less challenging to make music with.

[Tim Harr]

The "hardest instrument to play" - - I think you have to take a couple contexts into consideration. There are two operational definitions of "playing" pedal steel.

<1> playing the pedal steel ...by only knowing that "this sound" happens when I press these pedals and then this knee lever... Not associating any music theory or knowledge or chord construction, etc.. In this context, the steel guitar comes off more like a country music sound effects machine. The music is performed by only knowing how to duplicate cliche sounds. The player can't explain what they are doing .. they just know how to do it.

<2> playing the pedal steel as a musical instrument in any music situation .. any genre .. not relying on the idea of stringing together "licks" you learned by ear off of records. You can sit behind a chord chart for a song, with either chord symbols ..standard musical notation, or both and perform the music using the pedal steel guitar as the means of producing the music. Sitting in a broadway theater pit or on the set of American Idol, reading charts and using the pedal steel as a musical instrument..playing string parts or horn hits. The player can explain what is musically happening and what they are playing.

Both are valid definitions of "playing " and both are very, very difficult to execute.

[Rick Campbell]

I kicked several songs off on steel after been playing 2 weeks. Try that on fiddle.
The songs I kicked off were shall we say at most, recognizable.

I know where you're coming from. Fiddle is not very forgiving. There's an old saying that "you have to be a pretty good fiddler to keep from sounding awful". With steel, if you have the right combination of bar position, pedal position, and string selection, you can make a recognizable effort at playing a song pretty quickly. With fiddle, until you know how to pull tone, it doesn't matter how many notes you can play in any order. You know what I mean when I say you and the fiddle have to kind of become one and you can feel all the moves as you go. It's a wonderful feeling when it's working, and a stressful feeling when it's not.

I can't say that any of the instruments are easy for me, and I'm sure my playing shows that I've got a long way to go.

RC

[Ian Rae]

Much depends on what you bring with you from elsewhere.
I have plenty of theory, and from trombone I'm used to rapid coarse and fine adjustments, so the bar's easy.
Mastering finger picks has been my big hurdle, and it's still my right hand that demands all my attention.

[Fred Treece]

I agree, Ian.

If you’re coming from nowhere with no musical or mechanical background, I think pedal steel would be up there with the most difficult instruments on which to learn music. I would definitely not suggest it to an absolute beginner. Just about everybody here came to psg from another instrument. Do we know anybody who started on it? Even the greats who never played anything else started on lap steel. Not to demean lap steel - when taken to the Nth degree like some well known players (and not-quite-as-famous forum members like Mike Neer and Bill Hatcher) do, it is a quite complex instrument to master. But straight out of the chute, there is nothing I have personally attempted that was initially as baffling as pedal steel. And I had 45 years of guitar and theory behind me.