Instructors input desired regarding Ext. E9

[Robert W Wilson]

Greetings,

I have happily ordered a new Mullen RP E9 Extended and need to make final build decisions very soon. I live in the sticks and have never even touched a psg and there are no (known) instructors or players in my area. All my research is based on many hours of reading this fine forum, videos and several beginner psg music books. I've purchased multiple sizes of picks, 2 different tone bars and play imaginary psg on my desk (ain’t been busted yet).

I plan to utilize multiple books, video lessons, Skype sessions, and hopefully some seminars after gaining familiarity with the machine. I realized this guitar is way more than I need, but it's likely a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity so I want to have exploratory options for the future.

My music back ground is classically trained piano (some horns, no guitar). I read music (weak on chords but studying) and am constantly translating the tabulature in these books to piano keyboard in my head.

I stopped considering the U12 because of added complexity and limited availability of written instruction. Another important consideration is ease of tuning, I want to spend my time practicing. If utilizing a strobe, are 3 string changes much harder to tune?

With that in mind, I would greatly appreciate input on the following copedents, especially from any extended E9 instructors. The first copedent, 3 pedals/4 knees, is the Mullen factory standard for E9 ext. The second copedent, 4 pedals/5 knees (+1 string on C ped), is what I think I'd like based on research throughout the forum. Perhaps the 11th/12th strings could use a little something more? Note that my musical taste is broad.

Thanks in advance!

Robert W Wilson

[Paul Sutherland]

Wow. You are really plunging into the deep end of the pool. You will have levers and pedals that you probably won't touch on a regular basis for at least several years.

But you are ordering a top shelf steel that will give you every opportunity to succeed. Also, the Mullen should be relatively easy to make changes to your copedent, so when the time comes you can experiment without too much trouble.

You really can't go wrong with either tuning you have suggested. I like lowering the Bs to Bbs on the vertical. That's a change you will probably use within the first year or two of playing. The pedal 4 add-on is simply the Franklin pedal. Some people love it. I have it on my Williams and I almost never use it. It's definitely not a pedal a beginner should be worrying about, but it won't hurt anything to have it on the instrument.

Good luck.

[Chris Brooks]

I suggest that instead of raising your lowest E to an F, lower it to a C#.

That way it is the root instead of the major third of the C# chord that results from raising the other 2 Es to F.

It also scares guitar players when they get too uppity.

[Chris Reesor]

I would agree with Chris B. about getting that low C# on string 12. I would also raise 12 to F# on the C pedal rather than string 8. As for the Franklin pedal, I would split it, i.e. only lower 5 & 10, since you already have the string 6 whole tone lower, or even do something different altogether.

You should contact John McClung about skype lessons; he has a great rep as a teacher and he is an ext E9 guy to boot.
Happy trails!

[Robert W Wilson]

Thanks for the input Paul, Chris and Chris. I will definitely do the C# lower on the 12th string as suggested, makes sense and is noted in many old forum posts. I also like the idea of raising the 12th to F# vs. the 8th string to utilize the lower tone and splitting the Franklin. I plan to study this thing like the piano, practice scales and arpeggios in every key.

Yes I do tend to jump into the deep end in everything I do, but haven't drowned yet! Love the mechanical character of these things and this is one machine that can't kill me (sold a race bike to fund it). Lunch is over, getting back to work. Thanks again!

[Earnest Bovine]

I will definitely do the C# lower on the 12th string

FWIW I came to the opposite conclusion and I prefer raising 12 to E# on LKL.
Raising 12 to F# is good to have for F#m7 chords etc. So I would add that to your RKR.

[Chris Reesor]

That is interesting, Earnest. You could get a really firm feel stop on string two that way, I think.
If I was setting up ext E9 for me, that string 12 drop would likely wind up on a 0 pedal with a sixth string raise to A#.
This is all purely hypothetical for me, as if (when?) I get another steel, I'd very much like to try b0b's latest 10 string D6.

[Earnest Bovine]

You could get a really firm feel stop on string two that way, I think.

Yes, the string 12 raise helps provide a firmer feel stop for string 2 at D natural. (Also I lower string 7 a half step, and a whole step on this same lever)

[Earnest Bovine]

string 12 drop would likely wind up on a 0 pedal with a sixth string raise to A#.

Right; string 6 up to A# is my favorite "0 pedal".

On the C pedal, I like to lower string 12, low E, to D natural.

[Fred Treece]

If utilizing a strobe, are 3 string changes much harder to tune?

This is a good question that I have often wondered too, since my guitar doesn't have a 3 string change.

I would think not, since you would probably want to tune every same pitch to the same frequency offset. For example, setting all A's at 439.5hz, all F#'s at 441, or whatever. Your tuning process will be more complicated, but not really harder.

[John Alexander]

My music back ground is classically trained piano (some horns, no guitar). I read music (weak on chords but studying) and am constantly translating the tabulature in these books to piano keyboard in my head.

I have no comments on your copedent. However I am struck by the statement of your background in music - I would guess that the combination of classical music training, notation literacy and absence of guitar playing makes a very unusual starting point by comparison to the majority of steel guitarists. I will be interested in reading about your development over the coming months, should you care to post about it.

[Greg Cutshaw]

My 2 cents:

http://www.gregcutshaw.com/Williams%201 ... yless.html

The low C# seems logical but I rarely used it. For me raising string 7 a whole tone offers a lot more useful changes than lowering string 6 a whole tone. Lowering the B to A gives and awesome root tone and some great rhythm vamps.

Here's a few examples of using the 7th string whole tone raise:

http://www.gregcutshaw.com/Tab/E9%201st ... 20Tab.html

[Robert W Wilson]

very unusual starting point by comparison to the majority of steel guitarists.

Exactly John, I'm a misfit! Frustrated my piano teachers because although I supposedly had a "gift" I never fell in love with the rigidity of the instrument or music. Little Bobby in suit and tie walking across the squeaky wood floor to play for blue hairs is my nightmare. If I had grown up near Nashville would have been different (love that piano). I can sight read anything on keyboards but not improvise. I played organ like the roller rink guy (hate that music). Needed a Curtis Loew in my life.

This is a bucket list item I will continue until my fingers won't work, and then add the ebow. Got my coon hound and she's everything I imagined, only much louder!

If I can achieve "not bad" that will be enough.

Peace and God Bless.

[Jay Jessup]

I definitely think you should go ahead an order that guitar with a 4'th pedal with three string pulls on it which will give you lots of flexibility in the future and you've already had some good advice as to what those could be.
I'll throw my quite simple suggestion into the mix and that is to lower all three G# to G. While I can honestly say I almost never use the 3'rd string G# to G lower I find the other two extremely useful for various minor inversions. As a bonus the lower on the 11'th string can wind up being part of some good Tele style guitar lick simulations.

Good Luck on your new adventure!!

[Fred Treece]

*Not an instructor*
But as a PSG novice, I can say that I love having the F# > G raise on 1 and 7 with RKL, for both scale runs and chord voicings.

Also, I have spent probably 75% of my first year on right hand technique, and I am a guitar finger picker of 45 years.

At first, it was a lot of fun messing around with all the mechanical variety available on my 3x4. It took several months to realize how much musical expression is right there just with 10 strings and a bar, never mind pedals and levers.

[Frederick Krubel]

I have a zero pedal that lowers 12 to C# and 9 to C#.
My RKL raises 1 and 7 from F# to G#.
Mashing the zero and A pedal, while engaging the RKL lever results in a 10 string OPEN C#m voicing. Adding the LKL lever that raises strings 8 and 4 makes a C# Major chord. Sounds killer with distortion and palm muting!

Also, makes a very good ROOT postion for C# blues licks, if you understand how to utilize minor pentatonic's whole step bends via the A pedal and RKL (F#<G#). Respectively, those are b7 to Root, and 4 to 5 bends. You can use slides to get those sounds. The LKL will raise your minor thirds to major thirds. You can also use blue notes and not completely engage the LKL.

I transcribed and arranged Dierks Bentley's "What Was I Thinking," which is Open G dobro GBDGBD, for 12 string Ext E9. I should upload it to the forum. It definitely used these scalar concepts, took advantage of the whole 12 string range, and I use those big chord voicings at the end of my band's arrangement.