eBay guy parting out complete lap steels

[George Rothenberger]

This guy has 702 parts on eBay and appears to be parting out and selling lap steel parts separately. michael_atw. 702 parts listed. Stringmaster triple T8body, stringmaster single body, the cases for the same, the parts for the same. Wonder if anyone else is as offended and disgusted as I am?

[Herb Steiner]

Perhaps this guy is the spawn of Satan, I don't know. But I didn't see any complete guitars parted out. I saw a few bodies but only one trapezoid pickup, no Stringmaster pickups, a couple bridgeplates from trapezoid guitars, no SM tailpiece plates, no Fender tuning machine pans.

Hey, the guy is a parts dealer for a lot of Fender guitars, mostly standard Spanish guitars. For all we know, he could be buying previously trashed or already parted out guitars and bags of parts. Like I said, the vast majority of his stuff is for standard Fender electric guitars, anyway. I didn't see enough stuff to assemble a complete Fender steel there, perhaps you did.

Lighten up. You might be offended by this guy, but maybe someone here who IS restoring a vintage Fender steel feels very fortunate that they found just the part that they needed to complete THEIR guitar. I don't necessarily see him as a villain destroying complete guitars, I see him as a possible and very probable asset to help OTHER people complete their own guitars.

Anyway, it's his stuff and it's his right to sell what he has. But if you WANT to stay agitated, by all means it's your right to do so. Just sayin'...

[Jeff Mead]

As far as I can see, there are no tuner pans up for sale. These are the bits that often go wrong and are hardest to fix.

It may be that these bits are what's left after instruments had been cannibalised to restore other instruments to their former glory.

Admittedy, the 6 stringers that are all there apart from the pickups had the pickups harvested to go into Telecasters.

These parts are next to impossible to find (especially these one for Dual Pros and Custom Triples that are far rarer than Stringmasters) and if you have a guitar that needs a new pickup cover or control plate, this is the only way you'll get one.

I found a replacement plate for my Custom Triple a few years back and couldn't believe my luck (mine had been modified with an extra switch).

The sad reality is that Stringmasters for sure and possibly other instruments are worth more in parts than as complete instruments.

I made up the quad in my avatar from a collection of parts and effectively devalued those bits by making them into a playable instrument.

If someone is selling something, you can't blame them for wanting to get as much as they can for it and unless the prices of instruments rises above the level of components, you will continue to see this more and more.

[b0b]

This happened to me once. I sold a sweet little Fender 8 and next thing I knew, the guy was selling it off in pieces. Nothing illegal, but it was disgusting because the guitar was so beautiful.

[Loren Tilley]

I am totally disgusted by this guy. I sold an all original fender triple neck trapezoid pickup guitar that was fantastic. He was the high bidder, then waited to contact me only to first complain to me about shipping charges (I'm in Hawaii), which were clearly posted on the auction. So he was rude to begin with, and then I look online and start seeing the bits and pieces for sale. I felt terrible--would much rather have forgone the money and kept the guitar, or even just given it away to someone who would have enjoyed it. I understand parting out guitars with serious damage or problems, but this was a great guitar to start. I have to say that I would much rather have had it go to someone on the forum, but the last time I linked to an Ebay auction on the for sale page, there were people who gave me a hard time about it as though I was doing something wrong by auctioning it.

[Nathan Laudenbach]

I agree that it sucks that some people don't share the same affection we do for vintage steel guitars. But I can't blame them for not having an emotional connection to a material object. Moral of the story, DON'T SELL YOUR FENDER STEELS!!! If you want to get rid of them, give them to someone you know will cherish them and play them, like me!

[Matt Berg]

A local dealer, who is otherwise a nice guy, parted an ultratone on gbase recently. I don't know how to point out to him that his behavior is odious even though I like the guy. Probably see him in valley forge at the show this weekend if anyone has any polite suggestions....

[Michael Lester]

...c'mon everyone...it's clear that steel guitars do not have the investment cache' of standard guitars. It seems to me that nursing along 60 year old electronics for the sake of 'authenticity' with the prospect of financial gain is dreaming - there is no big money to be made selling steel guitars. A completely authentic 60 year old Stringmaster sells for about the same price as a revamped Stringmaster with all new pickups, pots and switches -- and the original will sizzle and pop and fade every time it's plugged in.

Just last year one of Leon's personal quads sold for just a few thousand dollars on ebay...a like year Tele would have gone for 10s of thousands.

I suspect that people who buy parts like those described in this thread are people who are rebuilding guitars that need some help - and they turn them back into players. Good for them.

[Michael Lester]

I wanted to add that Jeff Mead is a perfect example...I watched with genuine interest his journey to rebuild his quad... could not have happened without parts.

[Tom Pettingill]

.... people who buy parts like those described in this thread are people who are rebuilding guitars that need some help - and they turn them back into players. ...

Like others, I hate seeing steels getting parted out, but if there is any silver lining at all, its as Michael points out.

[Doug Beaumier]

This topic has come up a couple of times here on the Forum. My opinion... I have no problem with parting out a steel guitar that is already missing hard-to-find parts. For example, a triple neck steel with a couple of missing pickups, a broken tuner pan, and no legs, etc. That's basically a parts guitar, and the good parts can be used in other guitars. Of course, some players may prefer to rebuild the guitar with new or used parts.

But... tearing apart a complete, working vintage steel just to sell the parts and make a few dollars is despicable IMO and shows no respect for the steel guitar. I've stated that in the past here on the Forum and a couple of members blasted me, saying that an owner has the right to do anything he chooses to do with his property. True, but a cynical point of view IMO.

[Herb Steiner]

This topic has come up a couple of times here on the Forum. My opinion... I have no problem with parting out a steel guitar that is already missing hard-to-find parts. For example, a triple neck steel with a couple of missing pickups, a broken tuner pan, and no legs, etc. That's basically a parts guitar, and the good parts can be used in other guitars. Of course, some players may prefer to rebuild the guitar with new or used parts.

But... tearing apart a complete, working vintage steel just to sell the parts and make a few dollars is despicable IMO and shows no respect for the steel guitar. I've stated that in the past here on the Forum and a couple of members blasted me, saying that an owner has the right to do anything he chooses to do with his property. True, but a cynical point of view IMO.

This discussion could be filed in the "We Can Rant But Can't Do A Damn Thing About It" section in the Forum, if b0b would only start one.

Matter of fact, I think I'll request one.

That said, of course we all know the sellers of parts have the absolute right to do whatever they want to do with their property. And the outraged others have the absolute right to voice their opinions about parts sellers being lower than gutter scum. We all know that as well. Neither of the camps need to be reminded of their inalienable right to fruitless Sancho Panza-like assaults on the opinions of the others.

Personally, as a buyer/seller/refurbisher of steel guitars, I think dismantling a perfectly functional steel guitar for parts is a perfect example of a fool's errand. Reason: every sale of anything, regardless of size, is a hassle and risk for the seller, and consumes time and money. So do you want one quick deal that gets a lump sum of cash easily, or do you want 25-50 individual sales that probably won't get the same money (because of smaller steel market), takes a huge amount of time, and takes a functioning instrument out of the marketplace? It doesn't make sense, unless the seller knows nothing of the steel market. It's not only unconscionable, it's ignorant.

But allow me to pose, OTOH, a situational conundrum; be honest. Let's say you find a beautiful Fender Champ from 1954 in great shape at a garage sale for $50. It happens all the time. Or even at a pawn shop for $300. Then a vintage Telecaster owner comes to you and offers you $1000 for it, and you know it's just to take the pickup out and put it and the knobs in his Tele.

So you've got 3 choices: you could 1) tell him no, you're keeping the guitar, or 2) offer the pickup for the 1K and replace it with a very obtainable Tele-style aftermarket pickup and knobs available at any music store or online for $100 or much less and still keeping a functioning but less original guitar, or 3) take his offer and pocket the bucks.

What, dear reader, would you do?

[Doug Beaumier]

What, dear reader, would you do?

I would tell him No, I'm keeping the guitar ...because in 5 more years that tele pickup will be worth $1500! Seriously though, I would turn down the offer, at this point in my life. Maybe in my younger daze I would have taken it.

[Jack Hanson]

I suspect that people who buy parts like those described in this thread are people who are rebuilding guitars that need some help - and they turn them back into players.

Over the course of the last few years I have won four separate guitar bodies -- stripped of all their original electronics and most other fittings -- at auction on eBay: a '54 Gibson Century v2b; a '56 Gibson Century Deluxe; a '57 Gibson Ultratone v4; and a '59 Fender Studio Deluxe.

I was able to transform each carcass into a wonderful, fully functional instrument using modern electronics and fittings without exhorbitant expense. These instruments, without exception, sound every bit as good, if not better, than others in my collection that are completely original.

Both the Century Deluxe and the Ultratone v4 (the model originally fitted with a PAF humbucker) are truly scarce pieces, with an estimated 20 and 30 instruments built respectively.

Although in theory I disdain the practice of cannibalizing classic instruments chiefly for financial gain, I will be the first to admit that the debatable ethics of others has worked out okay for me. It has also helped prove to me without question that modern boutique pickup makers such as Jerry Sentell in California and Pete Bilthoff in Hawaii turn out a product that is at least the equal, and likely superior, to the classics from Fullerton and Kalamazoo.

[Martin Curnan]

I think most of us in the forum would not part out any of our steels.
However if it was not for those parted out steels a lot of Fender steels would be in service.
Obviously there a market for the parts and I thank those who make them available.

[Tony Lombardo]

I notice most of the rage here is directed at the supply side of the equation: the man selling these parts. What about the demand side? If there were no music enthusiasts and lovers of steel guitars out there to buy his parts, he wouldn't partake in this practice. It seems like they deserve their share of the blame as well.

[Larry Carlson]

I think most of us in the forum would not part out any of our steels.
However if it was not for those parted out steels a lot of Fender steels would be in service.
Obviously there a market for the parts and I thank those who make them available.

I agree with this.
I wouldn't even think of selling any of mine piece by piece.
However, I have an old Rickenbacher and an Electromuse that would not be playable if I couldn't have found
replacement parts for them since I wanted to keep them as original as possible.
The Rickenbacher is worth 3 times what I payed for it but only because I got it for a
ridiculously low price. It will never be any more valuable than it is now which in truth isn't much.
The Electromuse wasn't worth anything before, it's not worth anything now but it plays and
it has all the proper parts and I love that old thing.
It was made the year I was born. We both have some dents and dings.

[George Rothenberger]

Well I can see both sides of it. It looks like someone has had dealings with him and he may have parted out a working guitar. That I do not condone.
Flip side, if the seller has a non-working instrument that has been used to obtain parts for retrofit of another guitar, then it's ok obviously to make the rest of the parts availlable for us all in our repair and retrofit projects. This guy may be doing a bit of both. We can discourage the parting of good working units, and encourage the latter.
Analogous to the junk yard cars we need to keep our classic cars on the road. Case a, my old 63 Bel Air was sold for scrap and was cubed (2 owners hence after me) and I was so crestfallen. Case b, there are a couple of 63 and 64 Bel Air/ Malibus I return to in this junk yard for various parts and each time they get picked cleaner and look more skeletal- being put to good use.
ciao.

[Mike Neer]

I've told the story before, but it bears repeating.

I was selling a nice Gibson EH-150 with a CC pickup on ebay years ago. The winner had posted about wanting to take a CC pickup out of a steel to put in his archtop on a forum that I was a member of, and there was a link to my auction. I contacted him and asked if that was his intention and I ended up canceling the deal. He swore to me that it wasn't the case, and he seemed like a nice dude, but I couldn't let it happen.

[Mike Hultin]

I am totally disgusted by this guy. I sold an all original fender triple neck trapezoid pickup guitar that was fantastic. He was the high bidder, then waited to contact me only to first complain to me about shipping charges (I'm in Hawaii), which were clearly posted on the auction. So he was rude to begin with, and then I look online and start seeing the bits and pieces for sale. I felt terrible--would much rather have forgone the money and kept the guitar, or even just given it away to someone who would have enjoyed it. I understand parting out guitars with serious damage or problems, but this was a great guitar to start. I have to say that I would much rather have had it go to someone on the forum, but the last time I linked to an Ebay auction on the for sale page, there were people who gave me a hard time about it as though I was doing something wrong by auctioning it.

The complaint was gross overcharge of shipping by about 2x-3x the cost. Ebay actually enforces policies to remove listings that do that.

[Mike Hultin]

I notice most of the rage here is directed at the supply side of the equation: the man selling these parts. What about the demand side? If there were no music enthusiasts and lovers of steel guitars out there to buy his parts, he wouldn't partake in this practice. It seems like they deserve their share of the blame as well.

There isn't any because some (perhaps many) people commenting on these very forums are buying parts from resellers. These hit-piece (and for some reason, allowed) threads about specific people (some defamatory) are funny to read, anyways.

[John Dahms]

I have commented on my distain for parting out viable instruments several times already.
Over the years I have taken a loss several times on "undesireable" models of amps and guitars rather than stripping them of saleable parts to make a profit in the belief that if it has lasted this long in one piece it deserves to be passed along in complete form.
What will likely happen at some point is that the high prices and low demand will eventually catch up with him and he will be stuck with a large stock of parts and will take them to his grave. He will saturate the parts market and be drowned by his own actions.

[Mike Hultin]

I have commented on my distain for parting out viable instruments several times already.
Over the years I have taken a loss several times on "undesireable" models of amps and guitars rather than stripping them of saleable parts to make a profit in the belief that if it has lasted this long in one piece it deserves to be passed along in complete form.
What will likely happen at some point is that the high prices and low demand will eventually catch up with him and he will be stuck with a large stock of parts and will take them to his grave. He will saturate the parts market and be drowned by his own actions.

That's not how it works.

[Charlie McDonald]

I sold a sweet little Fender 8 and next thing I knew, the guy was selling it off in pieces.

Maybe he is the spawn of satan (as Herb suggests).

So I wonder, how does it work? Presumably, value is added in labor, used in the process of deconstruction; to be added again in reconstruction....
One wonders....

[K Maul]

I've dealt with him and due to a mistake on MY part( not his, but he cut me no slack) it didn't end well. He's not Mr Nice Guy and doesn't give a damn what we think so let's get over it.