Clip-on tuner with pedal steels...anyone use one?

Benjamin Wolfram · Post by **Benjamin Wolfram** » 1 Nov 2015 6:43 pm

Just curious if anyone has tried using a clip-on tuner with a pedal steel and if it worked? They usually clip on to the headstock on regular guitars but I thought maybe the vibrations (or whatever they use to tune) could be detected if you clipped on a tuner to the pedal steel cabinet itself.

Has anyone tried this? I thought it'd be ideal for tuning a pedal steel since you just mute the guitar via your volume pedal and the clip-on tuner will detect the notes still, and nothing extra gets added to the signal chain.

Thoughts?

Richard Sinkler · Post by **Richard Sinkler** » 1 Nov 2015 7:42 pm

It might work. Just as an aside, I use a Petersen Stroboflip. Sometimes I don't have the neck select switch to the E9 neck (I tune C6 first) when I am tuning. So with the tuner set to E9, but the neck switch on C6, the tuner tunes using the vibrations from the guitar. When I notice the neck switch, I change it to the E9 neck, and the tuned strings are not tuned correctly to pitch, some strings far off. The clip-on might work great, but I am thinking that maybe the body vibrations of a PSG and the neck of a regular guitar might be different.

The clip-ons are cheap enough to just get one and try it.

Lane Gray · Post by **Lane Gray** » 1 Nov 2015 9:37 pm

I've known folks who use them. My Zum doesn't excite the body enough to trigger one.

Howard Steinberg · Post by **Howard Steinberg** » 2 Nov 2015 3:23 am

I've used a Snark, clipped to the key head side of the rear apron. I do this when changing strings. Once the strings seem stable, I'll tune with offsets on a strobe tuner. This has worked fine on Mullen, Carter and Justice guitars.

Jeff Mead · Post by **Jeff Mead** » 2 Nov 2015 3:49 am

Richard Sinkler wrote:It might work. Just as an aside, I use a Petersen Stroboflip. Sometimes I don't have the neck select switch to the E9 neck (I tune C6 first) when I am tuning. So with the tuner set to E9, but the neck switch on C6, the tuner tunes using the vibrations from the guitar. When I notice the neck switch, I change it to the E9 neck, and the tuned strings are not tuned correctly to pitch, some strings far off.

When you have the selecter for the wrong neck, the tuner is not acting like a clip on tuner at all and is not using the vibrations from the body of the guitar.

In the situation you describe, the tuner is picking up the signal from the pickup on the other neck, meaning that it is getting the sound of whatever strings are ringing (quietly) in sympathy with whatever you are playing on the other neck. Try plugging through an amplifier and plucking strings on the neck that isn't activated. That ghostly "reverby" sound is what you are giving the tuner to work with, so it's no wonder it doesn't do a very good job.

The clip on tuners would have a much better chance of getting it right in this scenario as they are picking up the vibrations from the instrument itself, not via the pickup.

Someone on another thread somewhere said they used a clip on tuner on their Stringmaster (non-pedal) steel. They reckoned it worked attaching it to the protruding jack plug or on one of the tuners itself and it worked fine with even the furthest neck (can't remember if it was a triple or a quad).

Bill A. Moore · Post by **Bill A. Moore** » 2 Nov 2015 7:57 am

I haven't tried one on my Sho-Bud, but my Snark won't work with my Gretsch lap steel.

Lane Gray · Post by **Lane Gray** » 2 Nov 2015 8:07 am

Weird that it didn't work on the lap steel. Not even open strings? Both nut and bridge should excite the whole darn plank...

Jack Stepick · Post by **Jack Stepick** » 2 Nov 2015 8:29 am

I've used one on my Emmons P/P attached to the cabinet...works fine.

Thom Gustafson · Post by **Thom Gustafson** » 2 Nov 2015 8:31 am

I use a Snark super-tight clipped on the rear apron of my Derby SD10 near the peghead and it works fine unless I'm working in a VERY noisy room.

Richard Sinkler · Post by **Richard Sinkler** » 2 Nov 2015 8:34 am

Jeff Mead wrote:
Richard Sinkler wrote:It might work. Just as an aside, I use a Petersen Stroboflip. Sometimes I don't have the neck select switch to the E9 neck (I tune C6 first) when I am tuning. So with the tuner set to E9, but the neck switch on C6, the tuner tunes using the vibrations from the guitar. When I notice the neck switch, I change it to the E9 neck, and the tuned strings are not tuned correctly to pitch, some strings far off.
When you have the selecter for the wrong neck, the tuner is not acting like a clip on tuner at all and is not using the vibrations from the body of the guitar.

In the situation you describe, the tuner is picking up the signal from the pickup on the other neck, meaning that it is getting the sound of whatever strings are ringing (quietly) in sympathy with whatever you are playing on the other neck. Try plugging through an amplifier and plucking strings on the neck that isn't activated. That ghostly "reverby" sound is what you are giving the tuner to work with, so it's no wonder it doesn't do a very good job.

The clip on tuners would have a much better chance of getting it right in this scenario as they are picking up the vibrations from the instrument itself, not via the pickup.

Someone on another thread somewhere said they used a clip on tuner on their Stringmaster (non-pedal) steel. They reckoned it worked attaching it to the protruding jack plug or on one of the tuners itself and it worked fine with even the furthest neck (can't remember if it was a triple or a quad).

Makes sense.

John Swain · Post by **John Swain** » 2 Nov 2015 9:50 am

I use a Snark clipped on to the peghead, C6 side, and it works great!

Drew Pierce · Post by **Drew Pierce** » 2 Nov 2015 11:36 am

I use a Snark clipped to the rear leg on the changer end. I slide it all the way up, so the clip also makes contact with the endplate. Works fine. C6, E9, amp on or off, makes no difference.

Benjamin Wolfram · Post by **Benjamin Wolfram** » 2 Nov 2015 5:28 pm

Great to hear people thanks so much for the feedback, I don't see any reason why one wouldn't work clipped onto the cabinet or somewhere, and since we all play with a volume pedal as standard that just means that you don't have to add anything into the signal chain and you just kill the volume with your pedal then tune with the clip-on tuner...makes a lot more sense if it works than adding a tuner into the signal chain to me, less fuss, so long as it still works in a noisy room I guess.

Bill A. Moore · Post by **Bill A. Moore** » 3 Nov 2015 7:59 am

I tried my Snark with my Gretsch lap again last night. The smaller strings work normally, but the 2 larger strings have a long delay before displaying the tuning, and also seem to fluctuate more. I tuned with a plug in Korg, and where the Korg was displaying dead on tuning, the Snark would move sharp, and then center, before moving flat. I think there's too much body mass to let the vibrations excite the tuner, and the string spacing doesn't allow the tuner to be attached closer to the nut.

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 3 Nov 2015 1:27 pm

They will usually work, but you have to remember not to use all the notes, since these tuners are designed for straight guitars (with frets) and the temperament is slightly different than those used on pedal steel.

It will get you close, though.

Bill A. Moore · Post by **Bill A. Moore** » 3 Nov 2015 2:13 pm

Mine Snark is chromatic.

Benjamin Wolfram · Post by **Benjamin Wolfram** » 3 Nov 2015 2:58 pm

Donny Hinson wrote:They will usually work, but you have to remember not to use all the notes, since these tuners are designed for straight guitars (with frets) and the temperament is slightly different than those used on pedal steel.

It will get you close, though.

What do you mean "all the notes"? Wouldn't you just set it to tune a certain string to the note for that string? Same as using one of the standard Boss TU12 tuners and tuning each string in turn right? That's the only way I've ever tuned...

Bob Carlucci · Post by **Bob Carlucci** » 3 Nov 2015 3:29 pm

I just lay my Snark on its side right on the body of any steel I play, and it works fine every time. Never clipped it on ANY steel guitar yet, and no issues.... bob

Benjamin Wolfram · Post by **Benjamin Wolfram** » 4 Nov 2015 2:49 am

Well I just got my new Peterson Stroboclip home and clipped it on my Pedal Steel (a Rittenberry S10) and it works like a charm. Compared it to my iPhone Peterson strobe tuner app and it was dead on exactly the same as that. Seemed to work great clipped onto the cabinet rather than the peghead, worked great at any spot really but seemed to maybe work best clipped next to the output jack next to the changer.

Big ups to this tuner, it's a dead accurate simple tuner which just makes a world of sense playing a pedal steel when you can just roll the volume back with your pedal and tune away with the clip-on without having to have another pedal in the chain...A PROPER WINNER!!

Bo Borland · Post by **Bo Borland** » 4 Nov 2015 7:28 am

I use a snark at home, clipped to the right rear leg, it works fine on both necks but it is NOT as accurate as my ear or the rack mounted Korg PB-05.

Bill A. Moore · Post by **Bill A. Moore** » 4 Nov 2015 7:51 am

Bob, you're right, no need to use the clip! Works great!

admin · Post by **b0b** » 4 Nov 2015 10:27 am

Do any of the clip-on tuners show cents sharp/flat? All the ones I've seen assume equal temperament is "in tune".

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 5 Nov 2015 8:17 am

Benjamin Wolfram wrote:
What do you mean "all the notes"? Wouldn't you just set it to tune a certain string to the note for that string?

Well, no, because the ET tuning offsets for the average straight guitar aren't the same as the offsets needed for the average steel guitar. If this weren't the case, then no one would put out big bucks for a tuner that allows programming different offsets, or tempers. To put it simply, one method or setting won't work for all instruments; all guitars are unique. Ever noticed that each guitar requires different amounts of "tweaking", even after you've used a tuner and made everything dead-on? And even then, not all chords will sound as sweet. Some are really nice, some are good, and some are just...acceptable. The differences get even greater when you're trying to use the same tuner for different instruments. Acoustic guitar, electric guitar, and steel guitar all have different temperament requirements for the chords to sound their best. You can exactly match up one note on different instruments, but the more notes you add, the harder it is to get them all in-sync.

The Peterson tuners are arguably some of the best out there, but here's a quote right from their manual:

As it happens, there is no one temperament that allows for truly in-tune musical intervals over multiple key signatures.

Many things will affect the amount of tweaking needed for a stringed instrument to sound in tune (or, at least as good as possible). String length, string guages, string deflection from the player's hands; all these things will change the offsets.

David Cubbedge · Post by **David Cubbedge** » 5 Nov 2015 9:04 am

I use a Snark as a backup to my Pod XT.

Benjamin Wolfram · Post by **Benjamin Wolfram** » 5 Nov 2015 12:26 pm

Donny Hinson wrote:
Benjamin Wolfram wrote:
What do you mean "all the notes"? Wouldn't you just set it to tune a certain string to the note for that string?
Well, no, because the ET tuning offsets for the average straight guitar aren't the same as the offsets needed for the average steel guitar. If this weren't the case, then no one would put out big bucks for a tuner that allows programming different offsets, or tempers. To put it simply, one method or setting won't work for all instruments; all guitars are unique. Ever noticed that each guitar requires different amounts of "tweaking", even after you've used a tuner and made everything dead-on? And even then, not all chords will sound as sweet. Some are really nice, some are good, and some are just...acceptable. The differences get even greater when you're trying to use the same tuner for different instruments. Acoustic guitar, electric guitar, and steel guitar all have different temperament requirements for the chords to sound their best. You can exactly match up one note on different instruments, but the more notes you add, the harder it is to get them all in-sync.

The Peterson tuners are arguably some of the best out there, but here's a quote right from their manual:

As it happens, there is no one temperament that allows for truly in-tune musical intervals over multiple key signatures.
Many things will affect the amount of tweaking needed for a stringed instrument to sound in tune (or, at least as good as possible). String length, string guages, string deflection from the player's hands; all these things will change the offsets.

Thank you very much for this, I kind of thought this was the case but I'd never read into it or used sweetened tunings...I'm going to look into it now for sure!

The shame is with the Strobo Clip is that it has those sweetened tunings for so many instruments, even bagpipes, but not for pedal steel guitar