Gibson BR9 40's lap steel

Walter Seaman · Post by **Walter Seaman** » 12 Jun 2015 11:18 am

Has anyone here had experience playing one of these old Gibson lap steel 6 strings-the BR9?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1940S-VINTAGE-G ... 1924254784

I was wondering how these models (assuming they are in good working condition) might compare sound wise with the old Gibson Centure or Ultratone lap steels.

Thanks!
WS

Jeff Mead · Post by **Jeff Mead** » 12 Jun 2015 11:59 am

my first lap steel was a BR-9 and I've still got it and it still gets played and gigged a lot.

Those old P-90 pickups sound great.

The tuning pegs tend to disintegrate but guys have successfully replaced the plastic bits with new ones, or new sets of tuners, exactly the same size are available (same as for a Les Paul Jnr).

I don't know how they sound compared to the other guitars you mentioned but mine holds its own alongside my vintage Fender steels.

John Rosett · Post by **John Rosett** » 12 Jun 2015 2:18 pm

These are great guitars-How can you go wrong with a 50's P-90 pickup? I think that the "Buy it now" price is too high. Most of the BR-9's that have sold on Ebay recently went for $250-$300.

Ben Elder · Post by **Ben Elder** » 12 Jun 2015 4:04 pm

And they're not rare--Gibson must have sold tens of thousands of them. They pop up all the time.

Jack Hanson · Post by **Jack Hanson** » 12 Jun 2015 5:40 pm

The Gibson BR-9 was constructed from a lesser hardwood (often laminated) than the more upscale Century and Ultratone models. I have personally observed one BR-9 that had a rather significant warpage (approxomately 10 degrees) between the nut and bridge -- not good. The jackplate is identical to the one Gibson used on some Les Pauls; consequently many BR-9s are fitted with replacement jackplates.

It could be a great instrument, and it could be a real stinker. Hard to tell from the pics and description. I'd be very leery of an eBay seller who does not offer returns, but that's just me.

About six months ago I purchased an all original blue 1951/52 Century in its original case for $232.60 on eBay. All it needed were replacement buttons for the Klusons and a new set of strings. It's certainly not in mint condition, but it's perfectly serviceable and it plays and sounds just wonderful.

Good deals are still out there. Good luck!

Bill Creller · Post by **Bill Creller** » 12 Jun 2015 7:40 pm

The usual belief is that Gibson built around 15,000 of the BR-9 model, and I'm inclined to believe it.
I bought a new one in 1947, with the matching amp, my first "electric" steel guitar ! Worked two summers to pay for it!
I sold it to a fellow player in Germany while stationed there in the early 50s. Bought another one about 9 years ago, but sold it after tweaking it to play better.
I liked a guy on Ebay saying how "rare they were !

They are a decent guitar though....

Bill Creller · Post by **Bill Creller** » 12 Jun 2015 9:16 pm

I was just on Ebay, and noticed 8 of the BR-9 models on there, and I didn't even get through all the listings. Lots of those available...

Hard for me to believe the prices for old vintage guitars that were not very good even when new !
The prices on the painted tin Rickenbachers was really nuts too !

Walter Seaman · Post by **Walter Seaman** » 16 Jun 2015 5:40 pm

Thanks everyone I really appreciate learning some of the history of this guitar and how it showed in so many peoples' formative years, with some still playing them! Vintage P90s can be great for sure!
I will definitely proceed with caution about any eBay purchases and keep an eye out for pricing, return policies, etc. I have seen a bunch of these guitars in varying conditions on eBay so there is a wide variety of choice.

I also just happened to notice a 1950s Gibson Ultratone (same as Century? I don't know) at a Guitar Center in Ohio. Looks to be in pretty nice shape but there are only two photos (pretty hefty price too, it seems):
http://www.guitarcenter.com/Gibson-Vint ... 4269057.gc

Jack Hanson · Post by **Jack Hanson** » 16 Jun 2015 6:09 pm

That Ultratone is not only the "same as a Century," it is a Century. Ultratones of that era were always white, while the Century models were always black. It's a common mistake, unfortunately.

Great lap steel guitar, in my opinion. I'd bet you could get it for significantly less money, depending on how bad they want to sell it. I would request more detailed photos, and have them try to verify the originality of the parts. Be sure they will accept returns if it does not meet your expectations.

If the "Fingerrest" (Gibson's name for the pickup/bridge cover) is in good shape, that would be a definite plus. The original case is also a definite plus.

Not a P-90 pickup, rather its the P-90's forerunner. Often called the "wide oval" or "racetrack" pickup, these were used on early postwar Gibson lap steels until about 1951. They sound just wonderful.

A huge upgrade from the student model BR-9.

Good luck!

Walter Seaman · Post by **Walter Seaman** » 16 Jun 2015 7:16 pm

Thanks Jack that is fantastic detail!

George Keoki Lake · Post by **George Keoki Lake** » 16 Jun 2015 9:04 pm

Back in the fifties the BR-9 was considered as a student model and priced accordingly. They were ok, nothing to write home about. My beef with them was the p/u cover which was non-removable. Anyway, it was a good student guitar and I sold quite a few of them.

Roger Palmer · Post by **Roger Palmer** » 16 Jun 2015 11:26 pm

I had a 49' which appeared to be mahogany and sounded great....Underrated guitars in my opinion.
All original with case should fetch around $500

Jack Hanson · Post by **Jack Hanson** » 17 Jun 2015 4:40 am

George Keoki Lake wrote:My beef with them was the p/u cover which was non-removable.

I agree with George.

Having first learned to play a 10-string pedal guitar, I like the feel of the heel of my picking hand directly over the strings at the bridge. The BR-6, BR-9, and later Royaltone models all have that non-removable cover. To me, it just gets in the way.

The cover on the Century and later Ultratone models is far preferable to me because it can merely be unscrewed and removed, leaving the area over the bridge unimpeded.

John Billings · Post by **John Billings** » 18 Jun 2015 11:14 am

Bill.
" bought a new one in 1947, with the matching amp,"

I have an amp from that time, BR-1 as I recall. It's strored away right now. Two 6L6s and a 12" speaker. Very nice-sounding amp!
JB

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 18 Jun 2015 1:36 pm

The usual belief is that Gibson built around 15,000 of the BR-9 model

Yes, I read that Gibson made more BR-9's than any other model. I thought the number was about 5,000, but maybe it was 15,000. It makes sense because the BR-9 was considered to be Gibson's student model. Hence the numbers on the frets. They were made in an era when entry level guitars had quality tuners, pickups, and pots. Unlike today's Asian made junk student models.

I've played three or four BR-9s briefly in recent years, owned by students of mine, and to be honest, I was not impressed with the sound. They sounded kind of dull, not much sustain compared to the Century 6 and Ultratone. A Century 6 can be bought for a reasonable price nowadays. Sellers ask a lot, but the guitars don't sell for those high prices. I only paid $300 for my Century 6, and that included an Oahu lap steel stand.