A new steel player with a few questions

Kevin Spafford · Post by **Kevin Spafford** » 6 Jun 2014 6:15 pm

Hi everyone,

I'm looking to get a lap steel in the next few weeks and I have been digging through the many threads on this forum and I've gathered a ton of info. This is a great resource and I have already learned a lot.

Since I am brand new to this instrument, I have been looking for entry level instruments that can at least be upgraded somewhat in the future if I keep going with it.

I have seen the Rondo SX lap steel come up several times as one that can have various components swapped out, and I think that is what I'll be going for most likely. If anyone has other contenders in that same price range (more or less), feel free to bring them to my attention. I am most interested in the ability to build on the foundation of the instrument (new pickups, new bridge, etc).

With the Rondo in mind, I am wondering if anyone can speak about the quality of the pickups. I see one model has a single coil, and one has a P90. Is one of them drastically better than the other? I'm leaning toward the P90 but if the single coil is better, that would be good information.

I'm also wondering if anyone has ever installed a multibender on a Rondo lapsteel. Is there enough space on the body to comfortably do so?

Thanks for fielding my questions! Also, if anyone knows of a lap steel teacher in the Portland area, please let me know. There seems to be a good pedal steel scene here which I'll be checking out soon, but I don't know of anyone who focuses specifically on lap steel. Maybe any pedal steel player can teach lap steel also? I don't know how the crossover works between them.

Michael James · Post by **Michael James** » 6 Jun 2014 8:49 pm

I have a Recording King RG-32. Retail at $179.99

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/folk-tra ... eel-guitar

I ditched the stock pickup and put a DiMarzio DP154 in it's place. Huge upgrade.

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/accessor ... bar-pickup

On the bridge I added steel rod for the strings to rest on as the string come out of the body of the guitar. All I did was cut the smooth part out of a 5/8" bolt with a hack saw, squared up the ends with my bench grinder, then I polished it with a buffer on my bench grinder.

Also I added black dot fret markers. Compare it to the stock instrument. All I did was put some black electrical tape on some sticker wax paper I had, then I used my three hole binder punch to punch out little black tape circles that I attached to the fret board. They really stick tight. I haven't had one come off yet.

Good luck.

David Matzenik · Post by **David Matzenik** » 6 Jun 2014 10:18 pm

A friend of mine bought a P90 Rondo recently. It sound just OK. As for workmanship it was pretty rough. I don't believe these bottom level instruments have much resale value so you will probably be stuck with it if you buy one. Consider how much you intend to spend on upgrades. Of course it will still be a Rondo.

Patrick Harison · Post by **Patrick Harison** » 7 Jun 2014 5:58 am

When I was starting out, I sure wish someone would have told me to not screw around with cheaply made new instruments. You won't get you're money out of them, and once you get out of the rank beginner phase, you realize that they're not really adequate. If you buy a higher quality used instrument at the right price and then later decide that the steel isn't for you, you can always cash out and break somewhere near even. For under $300, one of the best values for a beginner/intermediate instrument is the Chandler RH-2... Can usually be had used on the forum/ebay/craigslist between $200-$300. Nice piece of wood, made in america. And... Provided that you're not too tough on it, you will have no problem breaking even. If you have a little bit more cash, your options really open up.... And again, with instruments that will hold their resale value even more. MOST IMPORTANTLY, a decent instrument will entice you to practice more with a beautiful sound and great playability. The steel is a serious commitment, so, financial stresses withholding, think about all the hours you're going to put in. The cost of even one of the finest instruments should turn into pennies an hour after year of enjoyment!

Steve Lipsey · Post by **Steve Lipsey** » 7 Jun 2014 10:10 am

I learned from Paul Brainard in PDX....he is a master of pedal steel, lap steel, keys, trumpet, etc.....he is a Forum member, you can PM him....
You could also try Russ Blake..also a master, also a member...

Lane Cunningham · Post by **Lane Cunningham** » 7 Jun 2014 10:33 am

I don't know what type of music you are trying to play but there is a great band from portland called the caleb klauder band (http://calebklauder.com/). I believe they sometimes have non-pedal and sometimes have pedal steel. Either way, they would be a good resource for who to get lessons from and it's always a good show.

Kevin Spafford · Post by **Kevin Spafford** » 7 Jun 2014 3:03 pm

Thank you for the replies. I really appreciate the input on this.

Would it be more advisable to get a Joe Morrell lap steel as opposed to the Rondo? I just came across a few on Amazon and they look fairly good for the price.

Also, I'll take a look at those teachers in Portland. I have been to Landmark Saloon and watched some great pedal steel players, and oddly enough I am probably going to see Caleb Klauder tonight! Great timing on the recommendation.

Stephen Cowell · Post by **Stephen Cowell** » 7 Jun 2014 6:07 pm

I have three votes on the Morrell... no, no, and no.

If you're near Austin you can come and get an 8-string for free... I'm tired of looking at it.

Steve Green · Post by **Steve Green** » 8 Jun 2014 4:26 am

If you're interested in a Recording King, here's one on Ebay for less than $100 shipped.

I recently bought a Rickenbacker 620 from this seller for an exceptional price, and the transaction went smoothly, with very fast shipping.

CLICK HERE FOR THE EBAY LISTING

Liz Williams · Post by **Liz Williams** » 8 Jun 2014 7:38 am

Kevin, that's a great deal on the Recording King. If you like the guitar, I don't thing you could go wrong. And remember: Lap steel guitars are like potato chips: One is never enough.

I want to put in a plug for the Rondo SX single coil. I just bought a bright red one and really love it. This may mean that I have gutter taste in terms of tone, but I love my other guitars, too, which include a Supro, Oahu Tonemaster and a Magnatone Troubador.

The Rondo SX I got is impeccable. The tuners aren't the best, but they work fine and stay in tune. You'll need to intonate the bridge and put something under the pick up to get it closer to the strings. The string spacing is just like an electric guitar, which I find familiar and easy to play, Slants are especially easy on this guitar. It has a full, big, bright, but not piercing sound. I was surprised at how good it sounds.

Best of all, the SX comes with three legs (which will need to be cut down for seated play, unless you can raise your chair), and a gig bag with two compartments - one for the legs and one for the guitar. I intend to experiment with mine down the road, replacing the nut and bridge and running the strings through the body. I don't think the tone or sustain need improving, I just want to learn. Having a guitar that no one wants on the resale market is very freeing in this regard. I bought it primarily to travel with, not wanting to risk a more precious and irreplaceable guitar.

Good luck with your decision.

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 8 Jun 2014 9:11 am

Liz Williams wrote:Lap steel guitars are like potato chips: One is never enough.

I like that! just one more... and then another.

Liz Williams · Post by **Liz Williams** » 8 Jun 2014 9:15 am

...and then, "how did I get 20 of these?"

Kevin Spafford · Post by **Kevin Spafford** » 8 Jun 2014 11:27 am

Lane Cunningham wrote:I don't know what type of music you are trying to play but there is a great band from portland called the caleb klauder band (http://calebklauder.com/). I believe they sometimes have non-pedal and sometimes have pedal steel. Either way, they would be a good resource for who to get lessons from and it's always a good show.

Thanks for the info eveyone. Taking a look at that recording king and it looks solid.

Also, I checked out the Caleb Klauder show last night. It was a great time.

Kevin Spafford · Post by **Kevin Spafford** » 8 Jun 2014 11:28 am

Liz Williams wrote:...and then, "how did I get 20 of these?"

I can see this becoming a real problem for me. I keep looking at vintage lap steels and I want them all.

Lee Cecil · Post by **Lee Cecil** » 8 Jun 2014 12:54 pm

I agree with Liz about not always focusing on the resale market. I have several guitars that I realize I'll never be able to sell, and I either knew that when I bought them or when I made whatever modification I made which reduced or eliminated the resale value. Your car depreciates the minute you drive it off the lot, but that doesn't mean you shouldn't buy it. Cars are to meant to drive, and instruments are meant to play. If I buy a guitar and play it for years, enjoying it and learning with it, I've got a great return on my investment already, regardless of whether I can sell it and "break even" financially. If I've played music on it and enjoyed it, I've done better than break even.

Jim Williams · Post by **Jim Williams** » 8 Jun 2014 6:03 pm

I have both of the Rondo models you mentioned. I think the one with the p90 has a better sound, and it is made of swamp ash, which is heavier out of the dense wood and has very good sustain. The standard model sounds ok with the single coil as well though for a hundred bucks. I like my Rondos, but I will say the quality control is pretty bad. You will most likely see some cosmetic imperfections so just remember what you paid for it. IF you could find a vintage steel for what it is worth and not what the jokers on Ebay think they are worth, that would probably be a better path. Something like a Supro or Valco or one of the many other ones that they made with other folks names on them would be nice.

Jim Williams · Post by **Jim Williams** » 9 Jun 2014 1:06 pm

This is a fairly new listing on the forum here...

http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=266907

I don't really know what this is worth, but I have heard that they are good sounding guitars, and that that string through pickup is very good.

It has the old fashioned connector on it, but it has a cable and you can buy an adapter to adapt it to standard 1/4 inch plugs I believe.

Tom Snook · Post by **Tom Snook** » 9 Jun 2014 1:45 pm

Kevin,welcome to the best forum money can buy.You didn't mention,do you play any musical instuments or will this be a first for you?What kind of music do you want to play?
Most of the afore mentioned steels will get you started.And I seem to remember seeing a YouTube video of someone playing a Morrell lap steel that sounded pretty twangy,but whatever you decide to buy,It will most likely be the first of many.So just keep coming back to the Forum and learn from the many knowledgable members.

Kevin Spafford · Post by **Kevin Spafford** » 9 Jun 2014 4:25 pm

Tom Snook wrote:Kevin,welcome to the best forum money can buy.You didn't mention,do you play any musical instuments or will this be a first for you?What kind of music do you want to play?
Most of the afore mentioned steels will get you started.And I seem to remember seeing a YouTube video of someone playing a Morrell lap steel that sounded pretty twangy,but whatever you decide to buy,It will most likely be the first of many.So just keep coming back to the Forum and learn from the many knowledgable members.

Thanks Tom, I really like this forum. Just from browsing threads before posting I found a ton of information in the search for my first instrument.

I also play guitar and drums in a few bands. The kind of music I want to play on steel isn't really traditional country, although I love it, but more "alt-country" for lack of a better term.

This kind of stuff - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ORky0VxAGZw

Really downtempo, lazy drifting music. I have some friends who do this kind of thing and I am involved from time to time, so I'd like to try adding lap steel to the mix.

I'm not sure what kind of tuning that song is evening using. I'm still figuring this all out.

Tom Snook · Post by **Tom Snook** » 9 Jun 2014 6:32 pm

Dude,down tempo is an under statement!I checked out 3 songs of theirs on utube. Each song was slower than the one before it.I'm thinking open E or D.I've never heard anything quite like it.

Kevin Spafford · Post by **Kevin Spafford** » 9 Jun 2014 6:43 pm

It is interesting music. I listen to that record a lot when I'm reading or unwinding late at night. I love the feel of those songs.

I realize I'll be best served by starting out with C6 as there is a ton of material out there. I love Hank and I listen to him quite a bit.

Dom Franco · Post by **Dom Franco** » 10 Jun 2014 2:18 am

I teach steel guitar lessons, and I live in Beaverton.
I have tons of material in C6th and A6th. I have been teaching for many years.

Dom Franco
you can Email me: domfranco51@hotmail.com

Jim Williams · Post by **Jim Williams** » 10 Jun 2014 9:44 am

Pretty stuff, I'd like to see some of the folks at the local bluegrass jams try and play with this...:0

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 10 Jun 2014 10:18 am

That song is so painful slow... 30 bpm, I would have trouble playing it in time! I can't count that slow.

Kevin Spafford · Post by **Kevin Spafford** » 10 Jun 2014 10:55 am

It certainly isn't for everyone!

It looks like Rondo doesn't have the model I want in stock until July, so the hunt continues.

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A new steel player with a few questions

A new steel player with a few questions

band to check out in pdx.

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