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Topic: Where to get sets of (not really) open-E strings? |
Steve Lipsey
From:
Portland, Oregon, USA
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Posted 4 Aug 2013 8:42 am |
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For my new Gretsch w/Multibender guitar (see multibender post)....
the tuning is (lo-to-hi) B, E. F#, G#, B, E
where to get open-E sets for short (22.5") guitar? I know I won't use the low E, and will need an F# to add in, but buying sets still seems like the way to go....I probably have enough single strings in my "string vault" for a first change, but will need more...
thanks...
_________________
https://www.lostsailorspdx.com
Williams S10s, Milkman Pedal Steel Mini & "The Amp"
Ben Bonham Resos, 1954 Oahu Diana, 1936 Oahu Parlor
Last edited by Steve Lipsey on 6 Aug 2013 8:31 am; edited 2 times in total |
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Andy Volk
From:
Boston, MA
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Steve Lipsey
From:
Portland, Oregon, USA
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Posted 4 Aug 2013 9:46 am
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Andy-
thanks for that...of course juststrings has pretty much everything - I'm trying to figure out what set somehow overlaps the most on this "sort of Open-E" and "sort of E9 pedal steel" tuning.....and has enough tension for a short scale lap steel....
OK, back to the string tension calculator...I have the charts, and also use this one to make sure I'm getting pretty even tension across the strings:
http://www.mcdonaldstrings.com/stringxxiii.html
seems like it may be more reliable than the d'addario tension charts....
_________________
https://www.lostsailorspdx.com
Williams S10s, Milkman Pedal Steel Mini & "The Amp"
Ben Bonham Resos, 1954 Oahu Diana, 1936 Oahu Parlor |
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Carl Mesrobian
From:
Salem, Massachusetts, USA
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Tom Pettingill
From:
California, USA (deceased)
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Dave Mudgett
From:
Central Pennsylvania and Gallatin, Tennessee
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Posted 4 Aug 2013 8:11 pm
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For odd tunings, I just use the string tension calculator and get bulk strings from juststrings.com
Plains: http://www.juststrings.com/plainsteelguitarbulkstrings.html
Nickel wound: http://www.juststrings.com/nickelguitarbulkstrings.html
Stainless wound: http://www.juststrings.com/stainlesssteelguitarbulkstrings.html
This way, I get exactly the gauges I need and very inexpensively. I generally prefer stainless wounds for steel, but I guess it depends on what I'm using it for - maybe for blues and rock & roll, I'd use nickel. For this tuning
| Quote: |
| the tuning is (lo-to-hi) B, E. F#, G#, B, E |
I'd guess something to mimic the tension on an E9 pedal steel with a 24"-24.25" scale (there, a typical set is something like .036 or .038, .030, .026w, .020p, .017, .014) to be something like .046, .036, .028w, .022p, .018, .015, but the tension calculator is probably the way to go. At an average of roughly $8.30/dozen for wounds and roughly $3/dozen for plains, that would come to around, let's say, $34/dozen-sets, or less than $3/set plus shipping. |
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Steve Lipsey
From:
Portland, Oregon, USA
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Posted 6 Aug 2013 12:03 am
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Dave-
Thanks for that idea - matching the tension of the same strings in a pedal steel set, adjusted for the smaller scale....you had it nailed except for the lowest two...yours were a bit too big (tension too high) ...but your thought process made it easy...
Looks like: string size (tension):
42 (2 -32 (29)-28w(30)-22(24)-18(24)-15(29) for B-E-F#-G#-B-E
Now when the steel gets here I have a great starting point to see how it feels, at least it will be fairly consistent across the neck...I can futz with the individual strings using singles from my "string vault" and then order the bulk strings once I'm sure...
_________________
https://www.lostsailorspdx.com
Williams S10s, Milkman Pedal Steel Mini & "The Amp"
Ben Bonham Resos, 1954 Oahu Diana, 1936 Oahu Parlor |
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Steve Lipsey
From:
Portland, Oregon, USA
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Posted 6 Aug 2013 8:34 am
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did the calculation for pedal steel strings, to be able to match them for the Deusie lap steel....a sort of odd combination of tensions...maybe because you don't want the thin strings any thinner, for best tone?, or something to do with which ones get pulled a lot? but still some odd choices...tension in parenthesis for each string. will post over on pedal steel forum also, but thought it fit here due to the thread on duplicating tension...
F#.013p (30), D#.015p (29), G#.011p (twenty-eight), E.014p(twenty-eight), B.017p (23), .G#020p (23), F#.026w (twenty-eight), E.030w (29), D.034w (30) B.036w (24)
Jagwire E-major set matches perfectly, just have to add a .026 for the F# (which I happen to have a lot of.
I'm thinking that bulk strings might not be good here because these are pulled by the bender, and better strings might be needed to survive the pulls...
_________________
https://www.lostsailorspdx.com
Williams S10s, Milkman Pedal Steel Mini & "The Amp"
Ben Bonham Resos, 1954 Oahu Diana, 1936 Oahu Parlor |
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Dave Mudgett
From:
Central Pennsylvania and Gallatin, Tennessee
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Posted 6 Aug 2013 10:06 am
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FWIW - I've been using those bulk strings as extras on my pedal steels for the last few years, no problems. I guess the .011 and .017 aren't reinforced like, let's say, the GHS set versions are. But I haven't had any abnormal string breakage at all.
I sorta' know that the .036 and .046 at 24.25" have a bit higher tension than the .030 and .036/38 at 22.5", respectively. I guess my (unstated) thinking was that I would find those two pedal steel gauges a bit floppy on a 22.5" lap steel. I usually use a bit heavier gauges on a lap as compared to pedal because I tend to attack those strings harder on things I'd play on lap.
Of course, it's simple enough to experiment with those two gauges, since they're the bottom two of standard .009-.042 (XL) and .010-.046 (L) electric guitar sets. I always have extras of those around and most stores I know have tons of them in their single string boxes - tons of people buy unwound and small-gauge wound strings, but hardly anybody breaks the bottom 2 strings. That's why I went up to .036 and .046 instead of .034 and .044.
One other thing - the tension on wound strings is significantly influenced by the core/wrap ratio. Using a larger-diameter core tends to give higher tension. The upshot is that wound strings of a given overall gauge are not all created equal, and that is something that needs to be factored in if you want to balance the tension/feel. |
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Steve Lipsey
From:
Portland, Oregon, USA
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Posted 6 Aug 2013 11:37 am
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Dave-
Thanks....yeah I feel the same about wanting higher tension on a lap steel, but this multibender instrument is supposed to be more pedal steel-like for me, with levers and all, tuning more pedal steel-like.....won't be hammering on and pulling off, will use a bullet bar....so I'll see what it feels like when I get it, will try some experiments...
the gauges recommended by "match the tension" are, for E B G# F# E B, 15, 18+, 22+, 28, 30, 39+, where the "+" gauges are just ones with lower tension, as in the pedal steel set, so could easily accommodate a larger string....
_________________
https://www.lostsailorspdx.com
Williams S10s, Milkman Pedal Steel Mini & "The Amp"
Ben Bonham Resos, 1954 Oahu Diana, 1936 Oahu Parlor |
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