Alternate Picking Hints?

David Mason · Post by **David Mason** » 7 May 2003 8:20 am

I am trying to work on alternate picking using my thumb and middle finger, and I am wondering if this should be practiced across chords as well. In other words, would you pick string 5 with the thumb, string 4 with the finger, string 3 with the thumb, and string 2 with the finger, then back down again? I use three fingerpicks and have been just sort of grabbing whatever I could however I could, but this clearly is not a suitable way to generate mega-speed through applied practice.

Bobby Lee · Post by **Bobby Lee** » 7 May 2003 9:51 am

Here are the exercises that got me into "cross-picking":
http://www.b0b.com/sgwest/pp7804p4.htm
http://www.b0b.com/sgwest/pp7806p4.htm

------------------
<img align=right src="http://b0b.com/b0b.gif" width="64" height="64">Bobby Lee - email: quasar@b0b.com - gigs - CDs
Sierra Session 12 (E9), Williams 400X (Emaj9, D6), Sierra Olympic 12 (C6add9), Sierra Laptop 8 (D13), Fender Stringmaster (E13, A6),
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David Mason · Post by **David Mason** » 7 May 2003 1:35 pm

Thanks! That's exactly what I was looking for. It's sort of like what I figured, but I wasn't sure if "crossing over" was advised. Maybe I'll leave the picks off my first and third fingers for a while, they tend to get greedy and start wanting a piece of the action when I'm playing....

Bengt Erlandsen · Post by **Bengt Erlandsen** » 8 May 2003 4:44 am

Make sure you do this crosspicking exercise SLOWLY and then build up speed.
The fingers need to learn that even though the notes played goes up, each finger playes the same notes down at half the speed.
The accentuation plays the notes up at a even slower speed.
Have fun.

<pre>
v v v v
1---------------------------------------
2---------------------------------------
3---------------------------------------
4-------T-----M-----T-----M-----T-------
5-----M-----T-----M-----T-----M---------
6---T-----M-----T-----M-----T-----M-----
7---------------------------------------
8---------------------------------------
9---------------------------------------
10---------------------------------------

Accent every note marked "v" and repeat
whole pattern w A+B pedal down.
</pre>

Bengt Erlandsen
ZumSteel S12extE9 7+7

joe wright · Post by **joe wright** » 10 May 2003 5:26 pm

The example above does not make any sense to me as I see that to be played as a simple forward roll. To crossover in the above example has you working ten times as hard as you need to...joe

Eric West · Post by **Eric West** » 10 May 2003 6:26 pm

That's what keeps a lot of people from doing it. That fourth note just won't happen.

And another thing.

I've tried myself, to play the "main bag" of BE Instrumentals, like 4wd, R the D, Cold Rolled Steel, and the BC ones like Almost to Tulsa, Rhodes Bud Boogie, and Twelve midnite without "crossing over" or using "finger rolls". ( Twelve Midnite, I haven't the slightest idea how a guy would play it without crossing over.)

I won't say it can't be done, but it'd be done sloppily at best. I've heard it done that way. It's just not anything like BE or BC played it.
Also to the above, a steady pattern of alternating can be a drill that doesn't get you "there" on some songs.

A lot of it, like Indian killed the Woodcock, calls for double thumbing, or others, such as Buddie's Therapy calls for just doing a certain pattern which mostly incorporates alternation, but not strictly so. Also OBS, on the ending is crossover, though not alternate.

Taking it that you are blocking the Emmons way, "bouncing" on your ring finger, or the "old BC way" bouncing on your little finger, the trick is to after you are able to "power" your way to a certain speed, to relax and be able to do it without your arm being tense.

As far as "Palm blocking" or Pick Blocking goes, I'd have to say that BC would show me the blackened surface of his little or ring finger as being the only part that blocked the strings. His palm only rested on strings that he wasn't playing. He may have changed, but in the two years I took lessons from him, I didn't see him do anything other than that. He "Pulled" the notes out of the guitar, as hard as he could, and blocked each one. Probably still does..

I don't know what "Palm Blocking" is. I also don't know what "pick blocking" is. I know what I sound like when I try both, and it doesn't appeal to me.

There's definitely a place for finger rolls and I've ordered PF's course on "speed picking" hoping to get some new ideas. I use more of them than alternate crossover licks on the Nervous Breakdown and Hummingbird stuff. No way around it.

Hard stuff is what pushes one to overcome limitations.

Anybody can play anything they want, with any kind of picks they want, or none if they choose. (I'm sure BC has shed his fingerpicks by now

.)

Me, I'm bringing some super glue to the gig tonite.

Play what you want. I certainly do.

EJL[This message was edited by Eric West on 11 May 2003 at 02:27 AM.]

Bengt Erlandsen · Post by **Bengt Erlandsen** » 11 May 2003 6:18 am

Sure my example can be played as a forward roll, but chances are the accentuation will be ten times harder to play as written at the correct place w a fwd roll. I do the same pattern as a fwd roll also. Just depends on which note I want accentuate.
Example is actually easier if I use thumb/index crosspicking (palmblocking) instead of thumb/middle finger.

Accentuation of 1 note at the right place might make all the difference to a melody line.

Bengt Erlandsen

joe wright · Post by **joe wright** » 11 May 2003 8:18 am

You can use the forward roll and place the accents exactly as you have them. The key is developing finger independence. You can do that by training the six basic rolls into Thumb, One and Two. Of course you want to learn alternates such as Thumb/One (open and closed grip)

There are more than just thumb-two alternates and crossovers...I play various "crossovers" but do not see them as such. I see it as changing right hand positions and playing "techniques'.

You have two finger crossovers, three finger crossovers, I use four picks so I also have numerous rolls using all four picks. So I can play Thumb/One alternate, move to a new position and play a forward roll, or a four finger roll, or a backward roll or another two finger alternate.

I place my hand in positions and work out of those.. If my thumb is on the tenth string then that is the tenth position. And my hand is also trained to play my movements in any grip...closed or wide. For example you could play a thumb/one alternate on the same string, adjacent strings or with strings between thumb and one.

In my books and videos I teach all of the possibile movements and ways to place them into your hands. Your steel guitar depends upon your body to operate it...licks that haven't been played are moves that haven't been made. Somewhere in my site there is an article that discusses crossovers and how I approach them...

Back to the guitar...got the ankle and wrist weights on and I'm practicing technique.....joe

C Dixon · Post by **C Dixon** » 11 May 2003 8:43 am

It depends in LARGE measure on the individual. There are players who CAN alter T 1 M as easily as they can walk; in ANY combination and do it easily and effortlessly.

Joe Wright has THAT gift. I cannot say enough about this man and his incredible dexterity. He is truly blessed. What ever time he spent practicing it only embelished his given talents. The practice did NOT create the talent. And herein lies the difference between individuals.

In one million years I could NEVER do it. EVER! In younger years I have tried for hours on end to do it. It simply will NOT work for me. My fingers get in the way of each other.

Crosspicking is the ONLY way I have ever been able to do it with any degree of success.

So one has to pick within what our precious Savior has endowed us with.

carl