Push-Pull lowering G#'s to G or F#???

Pete Burak · Post by **Pete Burak** » 8 Nov 2002 10:33 am

Anyone lowering G#'s to G or F# on their Push-Pulls?
How does the B pedal raise feel?
Thanks in advance for the feedback,
Pete B.

Chick Donner · Post by **Chick Donner** » 8 Nov 2002 11:31 am

I lower 6th (and in my case 11th) strings, both G#'s, a full tone to F#. No problem.

Allan Thompson · Post by **Allan Thompson** » 8 Nov 2002 11:36 am

Hi Pete,
I lower the 6th a whole tone on my Push Pull and the B pedal is fine. I use a 20 plain string.

Pete Burak · Post by **Pete Burak** » 8 Nov 2002 11:39 am

Cool!

Gary Walker · Post by **Gary Walker** » 8 Nov 2002 6:40 pm

Jay Dee, the P/P purist says the lowering of the 6th string poses too much pedal slop on a P/P. His approach is to raise the the 7th F# to be in unison with the 6th G#. This is a very nice raise and adds a different approach when used with the A & B pedals.

Bobby Boggs · Post by **Bobby Boggs** » 9 Nov 2002 12:40 am

Guys we've lowered the 6th to F# on a PP for 30 years now.Pete ask about the G# to G to F#.How well does this work.Do you use a 1/2 tone tuner and have a 1/2 stop like the 2nd string?I know there is a way to get the split tune effect.But don't you lose something in that deal.I mean opposed to an all pull split tune?Seems I remember a PP with the split tune.But I think the split has hooked to the (A pedal).Which would cause you to lose an important part of it.Since it's usually hooked with a 2nd rod and bellcrank to the knee that lowers the 6th on guitars that don't have split tuners. ;confused:---bb

Bobby Boggs · Post by **Bobby Boggs** » 9 Nov 2002 12:47 am

Sorry I read Pete's post wrong.It's almost 4am here.he asked if the 6th could be lowered to G or F#.However does anyone know how to get the split tune effect on a PP?I'm sure Mike Cass, Brian Adams and several others know.Thanks bb. Think i'll go to bed now.

Jim Smith · Post by **Jim Smith** » 9 Nov 2002 6:58 am

Since the 3rd string raise is so much longer than the 6th on a P/P, I would think you wouldn't even notice the extra raise freeplay required when lowering the 6th.

Pete Burak · Post by **Pete Burak** » 9 Nov 2002 9:27 am

Yeah, I was wondering about lowering the G# (mainly string 6) to either G or F#, and wondering if it would require much more pedal travel for the B pedal. (I wasn't really thinking about the half stop issue, but it's a good point none the less).
On my all pull, I leave enough lowering travel to lower the G# to either G or F# on string 6, and just make a quick change at the endplate when I want to use one or the other on a given song (and it doesn't effect the B pedal raise at all).
Just thinking about the effect this would have on the B pedal raise on a Push-Pull.
Thanks for the input!

rhcarden · Post by **rhcarden** » 9 Nov 2002 11:09 am

I lower the 6 string (G# to F#) with pedal 1 and pull it to G with my RKL. (The RKL also lowers strings 2 and 7). It does not effect string 6 without pedal 1.

------------------
Bob Carden 66 Emmons P/P 8/9
BMI 13 string 7/7

Bobby Boggs · Post by **Bobby Boggs** » 9 Nov 2002 11:32 am

A very smart fellow and good friend to all steel players cleared this up for me.Carl Dixon wrote:

While a "split" cannot be done easily on a P/P (BE had a P/P modified that did it), I did somethin you might want to post on the forum. Feel free to copy this letter if you do.

I put an additional raise rod and collar on the A pedal (on the 6th string) of my P/P . I put a "half-tone" tuner on the bellcrank on this 6th string raise rod. And I adjusted it so that if the A pedalwas down and I tried to lower the 6th string from a G# to an F#, it would not go lower than a G(since raises overide lowers on a P/P).

This allowed me to get, one of my favorite licks that I use (I am sure you do too) on my all pull. IE,pedals down two frets up from the major chord: Roll off the B pedal and lower the 6th string to a G for that pretty V to V7 chord resolve. It works great on the P/P; with the exception you are NOT"splitting" to a G, you are limiting the drop to a G note by the half-tone tuner on the A pedal. I used it for years.

After I started using it, I went one step further and added the same thing on the 4th pedal on my P/P. This allowed me to get and E minor (strings 4, 5 and 6) that we get on an all-pull by splitting.Again in this case you are not splitting: rather you are limiting the lower travel of the 6th string changer finger by the half-tone-tuner.

If you have never done this, and you like the idea, the credit does NOT go to me. The late Fred Trogdon (former Emmons guru) showed it to me over 25 yrs ago! But I could NEVER get anyone to understand what I was doing, so I simply used it and stopped trying to explain what I was doing.Sure it was not a true "split", But it came close to giving me what we get on an all pull using the split feature.

Again, feel free to post it if you want to on the forum.

God bless you and yours always my dear friend,

luv ya,Carl[This message was edited by Bobby Boggs on 09 November 2002 at 11:38 AM.]

rhcarden · Post by **rhcarden** » 11 Nov 2002 11:34 am

Good idea Bobby! however, with the extry pull on the A pedal you cannot get the 6th G without the C# on the 5th string. That's not good for me. I use the 6th string (F#) lower with the E strings lowered to D# for the B major chord, raise the F# to G for B aug, raise the 5th string B to C# for B9th aug 5th, and so on.

I use the pull rod from the B pedal 6th string G# to A pull with a collar and a
bellcrank tuner on the RKL.

------------------
Bob Carden 66 Emmons P/P 8/9
BMI 13 string 7/7
[This message was edited by rhcarden on 12 November 2002 at 08:26 AM.]