Playing Backup, Looking For The Best Instructional Material
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Playing Backup, Looking For The Best Instructional Material
I'm convinced I need either one on one instruction or good instructional material to learn how to play backup. I've tried figuring it out on my own with recordings, but I'm not getting anywhere. I'm sure the best would be one on one with a good teacher, but so far I haven't been able to find anyone in the Cincinnati, Ohio area.
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I'm sure other folks here have more specific and more extensive advice to offer. I'm mostly self-taught but came to it with a solid background as a jazz guitarist.
Two thoughts: lessons at home via Skype (I know these are available), and also you might take a look at the Cindy Cashdollar vids. My recollection is there's at least some coverage of backup playing on those.
Two thoughts: lessons at home via Skype (I know these are available), and also you might take a look at the Cindy Cashdollar vids. My recollection is there's at least some coverage of backup playing on those.
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You might try a GOOD guitar teacher if there are no steel players in your area, ESPECIALLY a guitar player who is conversant in the style of music you want to play.
Play along with records. Make sure you know where all the chords are without effort and that your intonation is good moving from one to another at the speed of the tune. Get a band-in-the-box type computer program for practice (if you have an iphone/ipad/ipod get iRealB.) Find a band with players a bit more advanced than you are (but not by too much!)
Think of it as a good opportunity for you to develop your own unique style
Play along with records. Make sure you know where all the chords are without effort and that your intonation is good moving from one to another at the speed of the tune. Get a band-in-the-box type computer program for practice (if you have an iphone/ipad/ipod get iRealB.) Find a band with players a bit more advanced than you are (but not by too much!)
Think of it as a good opportunity for you to develop your own unique style
Primitive Utility Steel
When you sit down and listen to recordings, take notes of what you're hearing (eg, plays after each vocal phrase, echoes the vocal, plays chords, plays melodies). It really helps to decipher what you are hearing away from your instrument, so that you can sit down at your instrument and tackle it already knowing what you are going for. I think that is one of my best strengths as a musician--my ability to really listen and assess what is going on. That can be developed.
If you would name one of two examples that you really like, I will try to walk you through it.
If you would name one of two examples that you really like, I will try to walk you through it.
- James Quillian
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For an instrument that is as popular as the lap steel there is amazingly little tab floating around. If you could get a hold of the tab of any old C&W song, that includes the backup parts and learn the whole thing, the concept would all fall in place. To get the idea, all you need is a few generic backup licks and then figure out where to put them. IMO any music idea is easier to learn in context.
- Kekoa Blanchet
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There's a book by DeWitt Scott entitled "Back-Up Behind the Singer", with tabs of C6 lap steel guitar backup for five songs, along with a CD (a band and singer playing the five songs, with and without the steel guitar track). Good examples of backup, along the lines of what James Quillian just suggested. Scotty's Music http://scottysmusic.com/ as well as the Steel Guitar Forum used to sell it. I don't see it on either website right now, but maybe a call to Scotty's could find you a copy.
- Kekoa Blanchet
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Mike, this sounds like a great topic to follow up your tutorial series on improvisation. Your step-by-step approach and the clarity of your instruction are a tremendous gift to all of us who are trying to add to our skill set. Some of my favorite backup playing of all time is you behind The Moonlighters. It would be terrific to get some insight on your approach to this subject.Mike Neer wrote:When you sit down and listen to recordings, take notes of what you're hearing (eg, plays after each vocal phrase, echoes the vocal, plays chords, plays melodies). It really helps to decipher what you are hearing away from your instrument, so that you can sit down at your instrument and tackle it already knowing what you are going for. I think that is one of my best strengths as a musician--my ability to really listen and assess what is going on. That can be developed.
If you would name one of two examples that you really like, I will try to walk you through it.
I'd recommend listening to good accompanists on steel, guitar, piano and even string sections. Like Mike said, really listen. Are they comping chords? Playing counter melodies? Harmonized lines" Single note fills? Echoing the vocal? Pushing the tune along with rhythmic hits? My opinion: you'll learn more from borrowing from good players than following some exercises in a book. A few examples:
Ralph Mooney
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F1_QU32J4YA
Counter melodies, vocal echos
Sinatra (Billy May chart)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HmQq6yLe2ww
Classic big band - rhythmic phrases in the cracks between vocal lines, changing registers
Jerry Byrd with Marty Robbins
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7_oaEw0p3js
Diatonic, harmonized chord runs, rhythmic full chord flourishes and glissandos
Ray Charles
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Thls_tMuFkc
Single note obligsatos (flute) One strum per measure (guitar) chromatic walks upward (Ray's Piano)
Brook Benton
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GGiceab-jqQ
Diatonic harmonized slides & simple melodic licks (guitar), sustain chords
(organ) single note obligatos (harmonica)
There are zillions of good examples. Steal ideas from all instruments. But, if it's really not working for you then a teacher could help - maybe even a piano player?
Ralph Mooney
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F1_QU32J4YA
Counter melodies, vocal echos
Sinatra (Billy May chart)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HmQq6yLe2ww
Classic big band - rhythmic phrases in the cracks between vocal lines, changing registers
Jerry Byrd with Marty Robbins
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7_oaEw0p3js
Diatonic, harmonized chord runs, rhythmic full chord flourishes and glissandos
Ray Charles
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Thls_tMuFkc
Single note obligsatos (flute) One strum per measure (guitar) chromatic walks upward (Ray's Piano)
Brook Benton
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GGiceab-jqQ
Diatonic harmonized slides & simple melodic licks (guitar), sustain chords
(organ) single note obligatos (harmonica)
There are zillions of good examples. Steal ideas from all instruments. But, if it's really not working for you then a teacher could help - maybe even a piano player?
Another great example of superb and sympathetic back-up lap & pedal steel is Greg Leisz's playing on Bill Frisell's John Lennon tribute CD, all we are saying (a wonderful recording in every way).
http://www.amazon.com/All-Are-Saying-Bi ... B005F9CORS
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Log5fKfz8H4
http://www.amazon.com/All-Are-Saying-Bi ... B005F9CORS
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Log5fKfz8H4
Kekoa, thanks for the compliment. I have always loved that role, whether on guitar or steel. Anyone who knows me knows that I have always created my own parts on the fly--even when playing cover songs. I play strictly by intuition and in the moment, which makes it incredibly difficult to describe to someone else how to do it. After the fact, yes, I can talk about it, but as far as an approach, it's not something I think about.Kekoa Blanchet wrote: Mike, this sounds like a great topic to follow up your tutorial series on improvisation. Your step-by-step approach and the clarity of your instruction are a tremendous gift to all of us who are trying to add to our skill set. Some of my favorite backup playing of all time is you behind The Moonlighters. It would be terrific to get some insight on your approach to this subject.
I can, however, listen to someone else's recording and describe what is going on.
I would have to say that, to be the best musician one can be, there are 3 things you need to do:
1. Learn as much as you can about music (melody (including counterpoint), harmony and rhythm)
2. Listen to as much music as you can, deeply examining the role of each instrument. I would often go kicks where I would listen to nothing but the bass parts, or maybe even string parts, over and over, just studying them, sometimes taking notes.
3. Play often with other musicians
All of those things will help you become a better musician. After that, you can begin to play instinctively and, hopefully, very musically.
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Moving well beyond the initial query in this thread, but good info and suggestions on an important topic.
Following Mike Neer and Andy Volk's excellent suggestions, the more ambitious players who're looking for a deeper knowledge base might want to check out "How To Comp" by Hal Crook. It presents a well-conceived and comprehensive approach to accompaniment from the perspective of "creating my own parts on the fly". Caution: it's pretty heavy lifting - not a book for beginners.
Following Mike Neer and Andy Volk's excellent suggestions, the more ambitious players who're looking for a deeper knowledge base might want to check out "How To Comp" by Hal Crook. It presents a well-conceived and comprehensive approach to accompaniment from the perspective of "creating my own parts on the fly". Caution: it's pretty heavy lifting - not a book for beginners.
- Eric Dunst
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Another great example is Cindy Cashdollar's playing with Redd Volkkeart (or anyone for that matter). Here's a clip. There are more out there from this DVD/show (Redd Volkeart - Tele Twang)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gY8AFtlAykA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gY8AFtlAykA
- Ray Montee
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The fine art of playing back-up...........
Playing back-up/fills with a vocalist is much more technical than some might think.
Back-up is truly played from the heart....even more so than straight solo playing.
There is no comparison between Emmons, Green, Chalker and Byrd........ Their individual personalities are expressed via their playing/style.
You cannot intermix their back-up with one another.
It starts with the players' ears. When YOU listen to a great tune with steel in the mix, do you REALLY, Really, really LISTEN.......or do you merely enjoy the music for what it is?
To get to the nuts and bolts of truly good/acceptable back-up, one must LISTEN!
For a real good look-see into exceptional back-up, one might consider giving a listen to some of the tunes on the JERRY BYRD Fan Club site. Whether you like his style or not, there's a lot to be learned there and it's FREE!
Then give some listening to Ray Pennington and Buddy Emmons; Gary Carpenter with Curtis Potter.......
If you don't get the pix, you may require some very serious one-on-one instruction.
No one ever said it was going to be easy.
Back-up is truly played from the heart....even more so than straight solo playing.
There is no comparison between Emmons, Green, Chalker and Byrd........ Their individual personalities are expressed via their playing/style.
You cannot intermix their back-up with one another.
It starts with the players' ears. When YOU listen to a great tune with steel in the mix, do you REALLY, Really, really LISTEN.......or do you merely enjoy the music for what it is?
To get to the nuts and bolts of truly good/acceptable back-up, one must LISTEN!
For a real good look-see into exceptional back-up, one might consider giving a listen to some of the tunes on the JERRY BYRD Fan Club site. Whether you like his style or not, there's a lot to be learned there and it's FREE!
Then give some listening to Ray Pennington and Buddy Emmons; Gary Carpenter with Curtis Potter.......
If you don't get the pix, you may require some very serious one-on-one instruction.
No one ever said it was going to be easy.
- Brian Hunter
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I am fairly partial to the way Andy Gibson plays behind Hank 3. Both of these clips let you hear it well. I try to bite whatever I can for my own band. When I am in a big lick copping phase my band notices so it works!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1SgrKc1n ... re=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FlhZpaCZ ... re=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1SgrKc1n ... re=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FlhZpaCZ ... re=related
Brian
- Ray Montee
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Got my curiosity up!
On Hanks' second tune included here....
the steel player does a chorus somewhat like JERRY BYRD.......
The dynamic bite of that little FENDER guitar is not that far from the sound of a Ric Bakelite.....
What amp is he using? Anybody know for sure?
the steel player does a chorus somewhat like JERRY BYRD.......
The dynamic bite of that little FENDER guitar is not that far from the sound of a Ric Bakelite.....
What amp is he using? Anybody know for sure?
- Brian Hunter
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- Brian Hunter
- Posts: 375
- Joined: 2 Feb 2011 8:25 am
- Location: Indianapolis
- Brian Hunter
- Posts: 375
- Joined: 2 Feb 2011 8:25 am
- Location: Indianapolis
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If you are backing up GOOD SINGER, be sure that you are playing exactly on Key. If you get in the "cracks" it can really screw up the Singer.
On the other hand, if it is a Singer who is not always on Key, sometimes with a substained chord or two you can help them to stay on Key. Music has many challenges.
On the other hand, if it is a Singer who is not always on Key, sometimes with a substained chord or two you can help them to stay on Key. Music has many challenges.
- Dom Franco
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The question of "how to backup" is not limited to steel guitar.
In general there is a big gap in knowlege out there among many musicians, no matter what instrument they play.
I learned the most about this topic during long all night recording studio sessions. (Studio time is usually cheaper at night, and using the 2nd engineer who works for less pay)
1. Don't step on the vocals (No fills that conflict with the melody)
2. Wait til the end of the vocal phrase, and play some complimentary notes that tie in to the next line.
3. You dont need full chords all the time, in fact it can muddy up the mix.
4. Find a register (fret position) that is higher or lower than the piano and guitar, so as not to clash with either.
5. I agree with previous posts that it must come from the heart. You need to "feel" the song and play the licks that seem like they were intended by the songwriter, and somehow are "inspired" not just thrown in as an afterthought.
I hope this helps;
Dom
In general there is a big gap in knowlege out there among many musicians, no matter what instrument they play.
I learned the most about this topic during long all night recording studio sessions. (Studio time is usually cheaper at night, and using the 2nd engineer who works for less pay)
1. Don't step on the vocals (No fills that conflict with the melody)
2. Wait til the end of the vocal phrase, and play some complimentary notes that tie in to the next line.
3. You dont need full chords all the time, in fact it can muddy up the mix.
4. Find a register (fret position) that is higher or lower than the piano and guitar, so as not to clash with either.
5. I agree with previous posts that it must come from the heart. You need to "feel" the song and play the licks that seem like they were intended by the songwriter, and somehow are "inspired" not just thrown in as an afterthought.
I hope this helps;
Dom
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Another good example comes to mind, and I think illustrates some of Mr. Franco's suggestions, is Jeremy Wakefield's playing on Wayne Hancock's A-town Blues album.
His playing is inventive, varied in texture, fairly busy, but not obtrusive. Also, the way he and guitarist Dave Biller interact is outstanding - both guys have chops to burn, but don't overplay.
His playing is inventive, varied in texture, fairly busy, but not obtrusive. Also, the way he and guitarist Dave Biller interact is outstanding - both guys have chops to burn, but don't overplay.
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"one on one instruction or good instructional materials
Hi,
There's good instructional material called How to Play Back Up by Jimmy Heffernan available through his website. It's dobro-centric, but could be useful even if dobro's not your thing (depending on what instrument you're trying to learn and what style and how much you're able to generalize the information).
A more efficient route may be one on one lessons via the internet or Skype, since there are no steel teachers in your region. The Steel Guitar Forum links page includes a list of instruction & instructors, some of whom say they offer remote lessons.
Best,
Vince
There's good instructional material called How to Play Back Up by Jimmy Heffernan available through his website. It's dobro-centric, but could be useful even if dobro's not your thing (depending on what instrument you're trying to learn and what style and how much you're able to generalize the information).
A more efficient route may be one on one lessons via the internet or Skype, since there are no steel teachers in your region. The Steel Guitar Forum links page includes a list of instruction & instructors, some of whom say they offer remote lessons.
Best,
Vince