Jerry Byrd FryPan ?

basilh · Post by **basilh** » 17 Sep 2010 2:19 am

What's wrong with this picture ? 2003 ?

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ... 0432087245&

Rick Barnhart · Post by **Rick Barnhart** » 17 Sep 2010 5:46 am

Looks like the same seller is offering a 7 string??

http://cgi.ebay.com/Sho-Bud-Shot-Jackso ... 563f791096

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 17 Sep 2010 6:02 am

What's wrong with this picture ? 2003 ?

Sho-Bud was long out of business by 2003.

Brian Doyle · Post by **Brian Doyle** » 17 Sep 2010 6:07 am

Bas is it a 22 or 24 long or short scale

Erv Niehaus · Post by **Erv Niehaus** » 17 Sep 2010 6:31 am

I notice that the "certificate of limited edition" isn't signed by Shot Jackson on Sho~Bud's behalf.
I have a "certificate of limited edition" for my Jerry Byrd frypan and it is signed by both Jerry Byrd AND Shot Jackson.

I notice that on the 7 stringer for sale, it says Shot Jackson on the fretboard and not Jerry Byrd.
Chances are that that guitar was produced after Shot Jackson and Jerry Byrd dissolved association.

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 17 Sep 2010 9:06 am

I'm curious to know from whom the guitar was purchased in 2003. Evidently the seller had a blank Certificate on hand and filled in the date 2003.

Here is some relevant info from a 2002 thread ---> CLICK

According to Jack Byrd (Jerry's brother), when Bobbe Seymour purchased the Sho-Bud inventory in the mid-1980s he acquired a number of unsold Sho-Bud JB frypans. Jack says that Bobbe eventually sold them. I assume that the frypan on eBay is one of those. I can't say for sure, but that would explain the 2003 date and the lack of a "Shot Jackson" signature. Check out the above link. It's interesting reading!

basilh · Post by **basilh** » 17 Sep 2010 5:29 pm

Well, to start with I think the slotted holes for the pickup mounting screws is not standard, the knobs are solid aluminium, whereas I have seen them as "different", and the machine heads don't correspond to ones I've seen on JB Frypans.
I'd like to see closeups of the pickup mounts and machine heads on other Shot Jackson produced ones..

basilh · Post by **basilh** » 17 Sep 2010 6:14 pm

Doug, with reference to the forum link, it is indeed interesting reading, I'm always reluctant to believe information from sources other than the horses mouth, as knowledgeable as Jerry's brother is about Jerry's business dealings, it's still second hand here-say evidence, until the documents are shown.
But Being as Jerry's brother says Jerry sent him the original documentation of all the serial numbers AND original purchaser's names, it should be relatively easy to verify the B068 serial number.

This serial number is of a "Short Scale" one sold within the original "Genuine-Legitimate" period.
Serial numbers AFTER B084 are, apparently, Fake or Non Original.. as also are Long Scale models with a serial number above A099.

A catalogue of the original owners and serial numbers SHOULD be made public for the sake of posterity alone, plus it MAY prevent the kind of misleading information being bandied about by sellers and owners of the plagiarised models, and protect the investment value of the originals. Surely something all admirers of Jerry would wish.
I dearly hope the facts as mentioned by Jack Byrd are correct. Being as Jack posted his information in 2002 whilst Jerry was still with us, one CAN presume that it's correct, but it would be a service to not only Jerry's memory but to his dedicated fans who bought the ORIGINALS, to post a listing of the original owners and serial numbers to establish the provenance of them. (As would be the norm with rarities)

On the other side of the coin regarding information and as an example of how things can get completely misunderstood, Freddie Tavares' wife is convinced of these facts, she said, "Freddie bought a 6 string Black & White bakelite Rickenbacker steel guitar as soon as the model came on the market in July 1935, (serial number 003) removing the left front white cover to store his bar and picks (thumb and 3 finger) inside between dance sets. He used C6th tuning for Hapa-Haole and more modern Hawaiian songs, raising the A to B flat for a C 7th tuning when playing older Hawaiian songs."

A Panda Rick and C6th in 1935 ? and 3 fingerpicks ?

David Matzenik · Post by **David Matzenik** » 17 Sep 2010 7:29 pm

Hello Basil, I follow your logic,I don't like to base an opinion on hear-say either. I think that's called journalism

But you seem to be questioning whether Freddie Tavares used three finger picks (if I'm reading correctly). For that miniscule point there is photographic evidence to the affirmative. Cheers.

basilh · Post by **basilh** » 17 Sep 2010 9:23 pm

David, the detail is in the minutia..and as a musicologist and buff of Hawaiianna I have the utmost respect for you.

As for the three fingerpicks I was quoting Freddie's wife, and I WAS questioning his use of them in the year 1935 (As she stated) I have no doubt that he used three but I understood it was later.
Also the use of C6th in 1935 would seem to be contradicted by Jerry Byrd's assertion of his adapting and developing the Am7 into the C6th in 1939.
(That's the rather tenuous link betwixt the two seemingly unconnected subjects within this thread..)

What date is the pictorial evidence of the three picks conundrum?, and what do you think about my suggestion for a compendium of the owners of genuine JB FryPans ?

David Matzenik · Post by **David Matzenik** » 17 Sep 2010 10:06 pm

Basil, the compendium idea is a good one. As the guitars are rare I would think the owners would support it. A JB Frying Pan Owners Club perhaps. Freddie's wife obviously got a few things mixed up. Can't blame her for that, its all rather technical and she was probably getting on a bit at that time. I have two movie studio stills that show Freddie using 3 picks. The earlier one is from 1937, the MGM short "Pacific Paradise" with the Harry Owens Orchestra. And the other is from the 1940 MGM feature "Its A Date." Aloha.

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 18 Sep 2010 5:42 am

-----> I just received an email from a man who says he has a JB Frypan with THE SAME serial number as the one in the auction... B 068. He says he bought it new in 1980. He also has the certificate and a letter from Jerry Byrd. Assuming this is true... the one in the auction must be an aftermarket copy. The person who sent me the email is not a forum member, but he reads the forum often. Just thought I'd pass the info along.

Erv Niehaus · Post by **Erv Niehaus** » 18 Sep 2010 6:02 am

I believe Jack Byrd is mixed up as to the "A" and "B" designations.
I have a long scale model Jerry Byrd frypan and the serial number is B-025.

Ray Montee · Post by **Ray Montee** » 18 Sep 2010 7:49 am

I have one of those JERRY BYRD model fry pans....that originally belonged to Don Davis.

It has the SHOT JACKSON fret board.............

The serial number has been effectively obliterated.

I'm curious, since there's been quite a few explanations offered by the Jackson family as to how the SHOT JACKSON models arrived on the scene.

HOW MANY OF YOU out there in cyberland, have one of those 'scarce', rare..... SHOT JACKSON units?

basilh · Post by **basilh** » 18 Sep 2010 10:50 am

Erv Niehaus wrote:I believe Jack Byrd is mixed up as to the "A" and "B" designations.
I have a long scale model Jerry Byrd frypan and the serial number is B-025.

If that IS the case, then how can ANY credibility be given to the quote from Jerry's letter to him, without documentary proof ?
And as for the DUPLICATE serial number to the auctioned one, well the mind just boggles at the connotations for the rest of the JB Frypans out there...

The "Skipper" should be the one to Chair this proposed inquisition..

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 18 Sep 2010 1:25 pm

And as for the DUPLICATE serial number to the auctioned one, well the mind just boggles at the connotations for the rest of the JB Frypans out there...

I agree. It's kind of scary. It sounds like someone made a bunch of knock-offs complete with "correct" serial numbers. Whoever did this had to be a knowledgeable insider. More info ---> Here

David Matzenik · Post by **David Matzenik** » 18 Sep 2010 2:06 pm

Doug Beaumier wrote:

I agree. It's kind of scary. It sounds like someone made a bunch of knock-offs complete with "correct" serial numbers.
I'm always fascinated by motives. Why would anyone bother to go to all that trouble making obscure instrument copies? Surely not because of the profit margin?

George Kovolenko · Post by **George Kovolenko** » 18 Sep 2010 2:22 pm

Another interesting observation. The seller of this item also has 4 or 5 other lap steels up for auction, and each of them has a much higher than usual number of bids. The Fender has 52, Epiphone 25, and a couple of Vegas with 13 & 14. I've been checking out the lap steel auctions daily for a couple of years and never have seen this type of bidding activity on a number of items up for auction at the same time, especially by the same seller. Right now, most of the other items up for bid have "0" bids, and a few have 1 or 2. It's almost like someone (?) is bidding up the price. Very Strange.... Kinda goes with the discrepancies concerning the certificate.

Ray Shakeshaft · Post by **Ray Shakeshaft** » 21 Oct 2010 5:44 am

I have just bought an 8 string 'J.B, Fry-Pan' with the number stamped on the end B-076. The Certificate of Limited Edition refers to 'only 300'. It is signed by Shot Jackson and Jerry Byrd. (At sometime a drop of water got onto Shot Jackson's signature and it has smudged which at least indicates it was signed with a pen) There is NO date in the top right or name in the 'Issued To'. The certificate has a typed in number that matches the one on the guitar (B-076)

It has the fake horse-shoe pickup and perhaps the tone pot needs attention and the pickup seems to slide around but nothing that cannot be corrected. The body is in very good condition.

There is also leaflet 'About the Fry-pan' and the picture on the back shows Mr Byrd holding a guitar up to the camera. Mine is identical to the picture

Put simply, what have I got? Is it an un-authorised, fake, or genuine JB Frypan.

Bobbe Seymour · Post by **Bobbe Seymour** » 21 Oct 2010 7:20 am

No, I only recived two finished Fry-pan castings in my "Sho-Bud" deal of the eighties, I sold (or traded) both to John Coop I believe as I couldn't find the correct pickups to finish them.
I know nothing of these "build" certificates.

Bobbe

Bobbe Seymour · Post by **Bobbe Seymour** » 21 Oct 2010 7:21 am

No, I only recived two finished Fry-pan castings in my "Sho-Bud" deal of the eighties, I sold (or traded) both to John Coop I believe as I couldn't find the correct pickups to finish them.
I know nothing of these "build" certificates.

Bobbe

Bobbe Seymour · Post by **Bobbe Seymour** » 21 Oct 2010 7:23 am

Sorry, there seems to be a bad echo in my computer,

R K S

Jerry Overstreet · Post by **Jerry Overstreet** » 21 Oct 2010 9:19 am

That frypan looks like the JB model built by Excel. Scotty used to and still may sell them.

Erv Niehaus · Post by **Erv Niehaus** » 21 Oct 2010 10:01 am

As far as I know, Excel still sells them.

Bill Creller · Post by **Bill Creller** » 21 Oct 2010 10:12 am

I almost bought an Excel JB frypan in Hawaii when "Fuzzy" the builder was there at the convention. We got mixed up on when he was leaving for Japan, and I didn't get it. Kinda glad that I didn't buy one now. It was s/n 42.

The Steel Guitar Forum

Jerry Byrd FryPan ?

Jerry Byrd FryPan ?

About those after market.............FRY Pans