Emmons LegrandeIII pickup replacement

[Rhino]

Hello friends …

If it’s possible I would like to change out a 108N pickup in my Legrande III.

It’s my understanding that I need to do a mod in the pickup cavity on the counterforce plate in order to make room for a standard size pickup.

Can someone tell me what this mod entails?

Thanks…

From the South East corner of Washington State.

Rob…

[Doug Palmer]

Rhino, any Emmons P/U will fit. No need to change anything. I have several new and use ones if you are interested.

The 108 is the natural humbucking. I prefer a single coil in my guitars. Wire it up the same way, just make sure you get 4 1/8" spacers and 4 4-40 machine screws to mount it with. The plate should already be pre-drilled for them.

Let me know if you have any other questions.

Doug Palmer

[Doug Palmer]

Rhino, just re-read your post and noticed you have a counterforce plate. You don't need the spacers, just 4 short compression springs. Sorry for the mistake.

Doug

[Jack Dougherty]

What windings does the Legrand take?

[Rhino]

Thanks for the reply Doug and YES I will get in touch with you.

Long ago on the forum I read that some mod needed to be done to the counterforce plate in order to add more cavity depth for a standard pickup.
I don’t have the measurements handy but the 108N width and length are pickup standard size, it’s the depth that is different. Currently my 108 is bolted tightly to the bottom of the pickup cavity which is on the counterforce plate. Since the 108N pickup is about half the height of a normal pickup my thought was that a mod was necessary in order to achieve proper string spacing from the top of the pickup.

Hi Jack…

I have the 108N Emmons factory installed humbuckers on both necks of my Emmons. The ohm measurement is 21.8K on both pickups. This is the highest pickup resistance I have ever encountered!

Later…

[Jerry Roller]

Rob, most replacement wide mount pickups will fit but hot pickups such as BL710 which needs more string clearance will not drop low enough. That is the case you are referring to. I put 705's in my LeGrande III and it was too close to the strings so I removed the base plates and made new base plates from thin aluminum.
Jerry

[Roger Crawford]

Wallace TrueTone's dropped in mine with no problem.

[Larry Moore]

I have a Emmons Single coil 19.5 & also have a BL - 705 one of the old ones (chrome case with the two blades).
Can we trade??
Larry

[Jack Strayhorn]

The 108N was wound to 22K, but do not compare this with a single coil because the wire guage is different. SC uses 42 wire, 108N uses 41 wire.

[Bobby Boggs]

Jack,should a 108N be as bright as a single coil at 19.5 since they're wound with lighter wire?? Also, I have 2 that read about the same.About .20 difference. Yet one is much brighter than the other.Both are mounted the same height from the strings etc. Is it because resistance is not the only thing that makes a pickup bright or dark? Thanks ....bb

[C Dixon]

Is it because resistance is not the only thing that makes a pickup bright or dark?

The answer to that is "YES".

In fact, unless ALL else is the same, and I mean ALL else, the "resistance of a PU has little to do with it's brightness or darkness or anything else.

I will try to make this simple for those not associated with "AC" electronic theory.

If you take a straight piece of wire, regardless of its resistance, you can pick up NO sound. Period. NO matter how you arrange the magnets or anything else in a pickup.

Take that same wire and form it into a loop, and you CAN "pick up" some sound assuming there is some kind of magnet in proximity to the wire. Now having said that, the following has a direct effect on what a PU "sees":

1. The size of the wire in diameter called gauge.

2. The number of turns of the wire.

3. The spacing (tight or loose) of the turns of the coils.

4. The type of wire.

5. Whether there is an "air core" within the coils or some other form of material called a "dialectric".

6. The type, size and shape of the magnets.

7. The location of the magnets with respect to the coils.

8. The strengh of the magnets.

9. And of course the location of the PU with respect to the strings.

10. The combined impedance ("AC" resistance") of all the above of the PU, with respect to the input impedance of the amp, and any other electronic devices between the PU and the amp.

There is more, but that's enough to get the point across.

The ONLY thing you can say about an ohmeter reading of a PU, is the DC resistance of the wire itself, regardless of how that wire is formed. You can make NO other postive statement unless, ALL else is equal.

In other words, the "DC" resistance is ONLY a reference IF everything else is equal.

Putting it more succinctly: The exact SAME resistance betweeen two PU's can make a decided difference in brightness or darkness (tone) of either PU, depending on any or all of the above factors.

Hope this helps Bobby,

carl

[Bobby Boggs]

Thank you Carl. You always take me to school. But I love it. Great info to share with all the electronics dummy's.Me being the dumbest of all...bb

[Jack Strayhorn]

Bobby, Carl explained it best. I certainly do not know or understand all of the science within the pyhsics of coil design. The 108N at 22K ohm is the closest in tonal color to a 19.5-20K ohm standard single coil pickup. In winding a humbucking pickup, the resistance needs to be a closer tolerance. A slight variation up or down makes quite an recognizably audible difference. In a single coil it is hard to detect a few 100 ohms. up or down. I know that anytime we went over the 22K mark, the pickup was muddy. If one came out below 21K, it was much too bright and brittle.