Purchasing online or from a store

Billy Murdoch · Post by **Billy Murdoch** » 17 Dec 2008 3:24 pm

I was looking to purchase a stomp box today and the online price was 20% less than the price at a local music store.
I called the music store to see if they could match the price and the salesman said he could knock off about 3% if I paid cash.I argued that,even with the discount their price was still a good bit above the other vendor (about $35)
I had to laugh when the salesman also told me that I would have much more pleasure in coming down to the store and buying the unit from Him and dealing with a "real"person.
I do'nt think I relish the thought of driving into town,paying for parking,endure the freezing rain and pay over the top for the pleasure of meeting Him.

I realise the shop has overheads which must add to the final cost of an item but I also think these guys have been making big profits over the years and they are squirming now.
I friend of mine bought a six string guitar last year which had been marked down from £1599 to £1399,my friend held out £1100 in cash and after a long standoff the shop sold Him the guitar at that price.
How can they list an item at £1599 then sell it for £400 less?
Do You buy online or store?
Billy

Fred Jack · Post by **Fred Jack** » 17 Dec 2008 3:50 pm

Billy,
At first I didn't think I would like online buying but the more I use it the more I like it. Price,of course,is better but add in the convenience,like sitting in the nice warm house shopping online ,then order and in a couple of days they bring it to your door.I use it more and more everyday. Regards,

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 17 Dec 2008 5:14 pm

Normally a "good deal" is about 25%-35% off the list price. On cheap items, though (under $100), a lot of music stores just don't bother to discount as much. It's a matter of carrying cost, 30% off an amp or guitar might still easily net them $100 or more. If you apply the discount to a $79 stomp box, they're only netting $10, not really enough to justify stocking it.
An online seller might be selling 50 stomps a day though, so it's worth it to him.

Larry Jamieson · Post by **Larry Jamieson** » 17 Dec 2008 5:54 pm

I guess I have to chime in here because I run a small town, mom & pop music store. The big box stores and web sellers buy items by the dozens, or hundreds, and therefore get a much better price than I do. So, they can offer a better discount. When my dad started the business in 1957, you made a good profit on what you sold. Now, with the internet and mail order catalogs, as well as big box stores like guitar center, It is difficult to make a living running a small town music store.
Two things keep me going. I rent violins and band instruments to people in my town and surrounding communities, and I offer lessons. Without these two sources of income, I would have been out of business years ago. My expenses include utilities, property taxes, income tax, self employment tax, my own health insurance, upkeep on the building and grounds, advertising, etc. etc. You can't sell an item at 10% over what it costs you and stay in business... I try to be competitive with market prices, but it is sometimes just not possible.
Larry Jamieson www.waltonmusichouse.com

Bo Legg · Post by **Bo Legg** » 17 Dec 2008 7:19 pm

Mom and Pop music stores where a lot of fun and I bought a lot of equipment from them over the years. I can’t find one anymore, you know where you would pull down a guitar of the rack and seat around the fire and pick and talk about the weather.
Steel guitar stores aside, most music stores don’t have anything a steel player would want and if you pull a guitar of the rack and seat down and play and talk about the weather, they’ll start leading you to the door.
Something would go wrong at a gig and I would call mom or pop from the store and they would show up with whatever I needed.
If I wanted to try out something at the gig they would say take it Bo and if you like it I will make you a deal. Over the years I was not charged rent on anything I needed or wanted to try out and I appreciated that and I bought my stuff there even if it was higher priced because I knew they cared and would take care of me.
A monitor amp went out and I dropped by my local music store not a mom and pop store and they loaned me an amp and when I brought it back the next day the charged me $35 rent. I can take out anything from their store if I rent or buy it and I can go outside and talk about the weather anytime I want.

Ben Edmonds · Post by **Ben Edmonds** » 17 Dec 2008 8:03 pm

I would buy local. Support your local human. I would rather keep a local music shop open than save a couple bucks.

ray qualls · Post by **ray qualls** » 18 Dec 2008 8:28 am

I'm with Larry on this one! Mom & Pops stores are almost a thing of the past as they can't compete with the likes of Wally-World and MusiciansFriend and your bigger corporate stores. Times are changing boys and if you have a small music store in your town, go down and visit because it'll be gone sooner than you think. Thanks Larry for visiting mine when you were back several years ago. Mine only lasted 6 months and if you find a Butt somewhere, its probably mine, as I lost it back then! Ray

Barry Blackwood · Post by **Barry Blackwood** » 18 Dec 2008 8:46 am

When you find an item online for a lesser price, free shipping, and no sales tax, IMO, that's a deal that's hard to refuse. Sorry mom and pop, but the times they-are-a-changin'. One practice I do find annoying, however, is when an item is shown online for one price, and then you go to the same retailer's local brick-and-mortar store, and the price is considerably higher. Shouldn't it be the same price online or store?

Robert Harper · Post by **Robert Harper** » 18 Dec 2008 9:15 am

I have found some thing cheaper online. By the time shiiping charges are applied it is about the dame. So No saving except sales tax.Like yous guys say the ma and pas are far and few between now. Do I think its better No. I enjoyed talking with the locals even if tey were at times doing the hard sale Look they had families to feed. But the old dayus are gone, unfortunately

Archie Nicol · Post by **Archie Nicol** » 18 Dec 2008 9:18 am

I buy my fish hooks on line.

Arch.

Ronnie Boettcher · Post by **Ronnie Boettcher** » 18 Dec 2008 10:19 am

I made good friends with a one owner music store in the late 50's. After dealing with him on a few items, I could walk in, and say I am taking this or that, and write down what I took. Yes I was like a outside sales rep for him. After I showed the instrument, or products to the person I knew, either I would call and ask the price, or just bring it back to the store. Almost every item I took out was sold, or they wanted a more or less expensive one. Still the store had a sales, and all was happy. I never tacked on a dime for myself. And in doing so, the owner made it up to me on my purchases. Even the instruments I sold for him, the people who bought them was very pleased, and no problems with any warranty, or hands on fixing or replacing. This way the buyer could try out, and decide yes or no on the item, without any hassle. I vote for the music stores, and only on line when you can't find the product. I have dealt with Hatfield Music in Pigeon Forge Tn, over the phone, but knew exactly what I wanted, and the store I use now is Sam Ash. They run a ad in the AFofM, and are very reputable.

Marc Jenkins · Post by **Marc Jenkins** » 18 Dec 2008 10:34 am

I work in a music store that also sells online. We sell for the same price in either case.

It should be mentioned that markups in the the music instrument retail game are NOT big. More like TINY. I have friends in clothing retail, salons, and CD sales. All of them have significantly bigger margins overall (although the independent CD store, not as much).

Ken Byng · Post by **Ken Byng** » 18 Dec 2008 11:07 am

Music store for me. If anything goes wrong you have immediate redress if the store is local. My local store is a gathering place for musicians and drummers, and quite often one can hear of dep gigs that are available if you are looking. Support your local store - don't lose it. Having said that, a good music retail business should diversify and deal both direct and on the web.

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 18 Dec 2008 2:04 pm

Barry Blackwood wrote:...when an item is shown online for one price, and then you go to the same retailer's local brick-and-mortar store, and the price is considerably higher. Shouldn't it be the same price online or store?

To an MBA, it makes perfect sense. What they're trying to do (in a sneaky way) is discourage storefront buying and encourage online sales. If they can eliminate most storefronts and sell nearly the same amount of stuff by selling online, profit goes wayyyyyy up!

Dyke Corson · Post by **Dyke Corson** » 18 Dec 2008 9:47 pm

We have two small shops in central Illinois and we try to price match when we can. I would hope it's worth something to be able to see the product, try it, and have a place to return it to for service when it's broke or in need of adjustment. Small shops like ours won't be around much longer if no one gives us a chance to compete. Most of our stuff is priced in the store the same price you will find on the net. The margins are very small and it's tough, but it's all I have ever done (besides play gigs)so we hope folks will still support small shops like ours.

Richard Sinkler · Post by **Richard Sinkler** » 19 Dec 2008 4:11 pm

On most stuff, I find the online price the same as the big stores we have around where I live (Guitar Center, Guitar Showcase, and Gelb Music). The difference, like Barry said, is the free shipping and no sales tax. I will buy local if I need it quick and fast shipping costs would be about the same as sales tax. Of course, Same Day Music charges very little for 2nd day air shipping and that is what I use the most.

As far as the local "mom and pop" stores around here, they mostly sell cheap junk and have high prices to go along with it, if they have what I am looking for in the first place. If they could compete, I would use them. But, money is very tight and I have to buy where I can afford it.

Tony Prior · Post by **Tony Prior** » 19 Dec 2008 4:19 pm

I called Guitar Center a to see if they had some Dr Stringfellow, they said they did. So instead of ordering it on-line I drive over to GC, I went to the counter asked for it, they said they didn't have any, or couldn't find it. I told the guy I called , he said yeh I know, but sorry dude.

I used a gallon of $4.00 gas at the time to drive to the store only to return home without it.

On-line is looking pretty good to me.

Bent Romnes · Post by **Bent Romnes** » 19 Dec 2008 4:24 pm

Archie Nicol wrote:I buy my fish hooks on line.

Arch.

And what about your kittens, Arch?

Bent Romnes · Post by **Bent Romnes** » 19 Dec 2008 4:35 pm

I love shopping online. It is so easy, almost TOO easy.
as long as the shopping is in my own country - Canada. The US online prices look very tempting indeed, but add shipping, customs, FedEx brokerage fees and provincial salestax and our current lousy $, there is no benefit to me any longer.

That said, Mom and Pop stores & personal shopping look more and more tempting IF there is a store in the vicinity. I love the personal touch, the feeling I get when I walk into a store and talk with a real person who has the time to have a nice chat.

I think we should support our local stores if this is at all possible. I even go so far as to avoid the big box stores that have a big foreign interest, and will much rather pay a little extra as long as I can get it at my local Home Hardware.

The way I see it...

Charles Curtis · Post by **Charles Curtis** » 20 Dec 2008 9:37 am

I have purchased from Al Brisco in Canada and Dave Hartley in the good 'ol UK. When they have what I want I'm not going to discriminate; hey we're all together in the mid east with our troops as well.

Gordy Hall · Post by **Gordy Hall** » 20 Dec 2008 10:57 am

Are there ANY retail shops in the SF Bay area that have pedal steels in stock?

Thanks.

Gordy

HowardR · Post by **HowardR** » 20 Dec 2008 11:17 am

Billy Murdoch wrote:I realise the shop has overheads which must add to the final cost of an item but I also think these guys have been making big profits over the years and they are squirming now.
Billy

It's simple......operating an online business is much less expensive than running a brick & mortor business.

Harvesting sales on a screen is much different than a salesperson dealing with a customer.

Online sales are the present & future as it's easy & painless for the consumer.

Mom & pop stores are on their way out and it's because we buy online......cheaper......

Now this is all ok, but don't complain about the little stores not being here for us anymore when we haven't been there for them.....you can't have it both ways.......

Steve Branscom · Post by **Steve Branscom** » 20 Dec 2008 5:03 pm

Last Christmas I bought 3 guitars for my family. I bought 2 Taylor acoustics at the music store I take dobro lessons from. I bought a Fender electric from Muscian's Friend, on line.

The acoustics ended up being the same price as on line. The best part was that I got a salesman to play them for me so I could hear the sound differences. My wife liked my daughters guitar better than the one I bought for her so I exchanged it at the local music store. That was decidedly easier than had I bought it on line. It was an easy choice because I'm in there every 2 weeks for lessons.

The electric I bought was a scratch and dent special. I still can't find the flaw but it was almost $150 cheaper than the new version. My local store didn't carry the Fender line or any other electrics except Collings.

Both purchases made sense for what I was trying to accomplish. I continue to patronize both. I continue to do business with Elderly Music in Lansing as well as Dusty Strings in Seattle. For good measure I also patronize ebay for instruments and other accoutrements. Each distribution outlet has its own advantages and disadvantages and each has a place in the marketplace.

Brick Spieth · Post by **Brick Spieth** » 20 Dec 2008 7:13 pm

Gordy-

I have seen exactly one new Carter Starter and that was about two years ago at Guitar Showcase in San Jose.

Other than that, Gryphon in Palo Alto has a nice bunch of lap steels and the occasional double or triple neck steel, but nothing with pedals.

you have to go to So Cal for a real PSG store.

Greg Cutshaw · Post by **Greg Cutshaw** » 20 Dec 2008 8:39 pm

I just bought a Fender Squier Classic Vibe Strat from MF online. The guitar is absolutley perfect. If it wasn't they would take it back, pay the return shipping and send me a refund or another one. Due to their great service, I just ordered another Classic Vibe, a Tele, today. I bought a guitar from AMS, maybe a fluke, but the neck was warped so I returned it and will not go back. Brick and mortar, including malls, are going to fade away.

A year ago, MF sent me a 20% off coupon and i used it to buy a $2200 item that is NEVER discounted any where. Last week I ordered an LCD TV from Amazon.com. Free shipping, no tax, white gloves delivery and they are an authorized dealer for that brand. The whole deal was $349 below best Buy's sale price with tax. Then I went to Tapeworks online and got the warranty for 1/2 the price of Best Buy and it offers in home service from the same factory technicians and kicks in after the mfg. warranty. Then I got certified HDMI 1.3a cables from a popular online store for $4.50 each and didn't have to deal with the stupid Monster Cable pitch from local dealers.

I find it very easy to research specs, user reviews and seller ratings online. What brick and mortar offers these?

Greg

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Purchasing online or from a store

Purchasing online or from a store

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