Good gravy..., come on people!

[Mike Neer]

I can see I'm outnumbered here again. I have nothing against "old" people - I'm just a little over a year away from joining the ranks of you. Face it, we're in a youth-dominated culture as much as some of you don't want to believe it. But you are old by today's standards. Keep telling yourselves otherwise if it makes you feel better. At least most of you have accepted it and you're having fun - this is a good thing.

I play and sing Hawaiian music for money almost every weekend and, yes, I have to wear the damned shirt, too. It's part of the job. I've learned the hard way that clients don't care as much about Hawaiian music as they let on - in fact, they'd rather hear stuff they're familiar with like *$@! yacht rock. The over 40 musician crowd is simply not expected or required to do anything innovative past a certain point in age. Probably for good reason, since they're raising families, saving for retirement, paying for a house note, trying to make a living, etc. So it makes it all that more surprising and cool when I hear something different and new from a seasoned player/artist (and those are in severe decline).

Matt, you seem to have a habit of making sweeping generalizations. Not always a good thing.

[Mat Rhodes]

You're right, Mark, I was referring to the part-timers.

Mike, you're right in that generalizations are not always a good thing. Most of us are experienced enough to know that there are exceptions in everything. I can tell you that in Houston, the musical bar is low, I mean "average", enough among at least 80%-90% of the musicians that I've witnessed - that's how I came up with my generalization. I have no doubts that the northeast's percentage of fair-to-middlin' musicians is much lower.

Baskin Robbins has 31 flavors. We all like what we like.

[Mark Mansueto]

"The over 40 musician crowd is simply not expected or required to do anything innovative past a certain point in age."

Tell that to guys like John McLaughlin and Alan Holdsworth who are in their 60's and still churning out inovatinve music.

Yes, I agree that we live in a youth oriented society but I don't think that's the attitude towards those involved in non-commercial entertainment. Serious music lovers don't care how old the players are or what they look like.

[Gerald Ross]

Matt, do you really want to be accepted by everyone in the 16-18 year age group?

Matt, they've got their own culture, just as the "more mature" population has theirs.

My advice... don't even try to appeal to these youngsters. Yes, there will be one or two of them who understand and appreciate what you musically you have to offer. But to the majority of them, you are an old man and the harder you try to get to their level the more pathetic it becomes.

Enjoy where you are in life.

[Ron Whitfield]

I look at the music scene today as a geat opportunity to get really good music back into peoples heads. After decades of mucis quality (on the corporate airwaves)going bottom barrel, the world is our oyster.
Of course penetrating the thickened skulls of those who don't know the difference, and many who couldn't care less, will always be a battle, but with the advent of this new fangled 'net' thingy, good music is at our finger-tips and just has to be produced and put out there.
It'll take past my lifetime to get firmly established again, but it can happen, I hope.

Long live Jimi & Gabby!

[Steinar Gregertsen]

Most of my students are in the 14-18 age group, and I'm often amazed by how familiar they are with the music I grew up with and how much they seem to enjoy it. Perhaps because there's been a "it's hip to dig the cool 60's and 70's music" trend for a while now...

They don't care much for my instrumental music though, but I can live with that...

[Doug Beaumier]

Most of my students are in the 14-18 age group, and I'm often amazed by how familiar they are with the music I grew up with and how much they seem to enjoy it.

Same here, Steinar. I teach 40 guitar students a week, mostly teenagers, and most of them have heard Beatles-Zepp-Hendrix-Police-etc. and they are always excited about learning those songs on guitar... but they have little to no interest in my steel guitars! I have a couple of lap steels in the room and a pedal steel, and I often show the students how lap steel works and play a song for them, but they aren't interested. It's funny how some people (like us!) can be so enamored with the steel guitar sound and others really don't care. Oh well, I guess banjo players sit and wonder why the masses are not drawn to the beautiful sounds of their b@xj0s!

[Carroll Hale]

I guess if "beauty is in the eye of the beholder....

then "good music is in the ear of the be"hearer"..

[Don Kona Woods]

Mark says,

I have no doubt that the HSGA crowd are a great bunch of people to hang with, in fact I think I've even felt a bit of envy when I've seen convention photo's that show jam sessions featuring steel players. I actually would like to go sometime... I'll be the 52 year old guy in the Jimi hendrix T-shirt

Mark, you are beginning to "see the light."

You will also not be out of place in your T-shirt, there are a few more of you so you should feel right at home. For me, I will be wearing Aloha attire.

See 'ya at the convention.

Aloha,
Don

[Danny James]

OK--I've been watching this thread for a while and wasn't going to go there.
Oh well why not We have a little band called the "Sounds Of Yesterday". Our ages are from 68 to 87. ( I'm 70 ) We play bass, rythm guitar, lead guitar,Fiddle and Multi-Kord Hawaiian guitar, and 4 of us sing.
The crowd we mostly play for are 50 or older. We play a variety of music and refuse to limit ourselves to one specific style. Classic Country, Bluegrass, Gospel, Classic Pop, and Hawaiian. Don't laugh because we always get asked to come back and the people in this age group love what we do.
Our aim is to make peoples lives a little happier if only for a little while.
We play retirement centers, Senior centers, A fair every yr. for the last 7, Private parties, etc.
There are a lot of people out there who are starved for music like we do. If ya ain't tried it you should.
So far we get all the places to play our old tired bodies can stand and we enjoy what we do and are the best of friends. What more can ya ask for?

[Ron Whitfield]

...here we had us a nice little unsophisticated thread about all kinds of silliness, and you've stepped in and mucked it up with something sensible!

Way to go, Mr. James
And, my hat's off to you for playing the old folk's homes. Those have to be the most appreciative audiences available.
Any sound clips we can hear so we know what to expect when it's our time for the social security checks?

[Mark Mansueto]

Mr. James, I am humbled in your presence. Keep up the good work.

[Danny James]

Thanks for the kind words guys! Sound clips---The only thing I have in that would be some tape recordings I have lying around done on an old Karaoki machine. I have no way of sending it on a computer.

I did send some Hawaiian stuff I did on the Multi-Kord which was a tape over tape over tape then edited and onto MP3. It is on the audio page on the HSGA Web site. I play all the instruments there so the recording quality is not the best. Although Rick Aiello and Gerald Ross made it sound a lot better than the tape itself for which I am grateful.

Danny

[Mark Roeder]

It is a hard row to hoe these days. My wife and I are both over 50 and have been loyal performers of country music for 30 years.( Lap Steel 2yrs)www.kristylarson.com I feel like it is hard to get people to notice any style off the popular main stream. Media machines have desensitized a lot of ears to the point they don't hear the beauty in other more subtle performances. It is very frustrating trying to get noticed for music you believe in. As an older performer it is the integrity in the music that comes from years of playing that makes being unnoticed even more frustrating. Ahhh... but now I rant.

I just wanted to chime in on an interesting thread, it got my juices flowin or was that the gravey recipes.

If you don't think this is a good thread look at the veiw numbers in one week. Thanks
Mark

[Mike Neer]

Musicians have to adapt to keep busy. If it is getting difficult to get your music heard, you sometimes have to explore other avenues, for example being a sideman, maybe even learning to play other instruments. I like being a sideman (I have no desire to lead my own projects at this point) and I have an insatiable desire to continue to grow as a musician.

In the last few years, I've made significant changes to the way I approach music. I no longer feel set in my ways about anything--if anything I am completely open-minded to playing good music, whatever the genre, as long as it meets my own criteria. These days, I am spending more time playing pedal steel and getting intimate with it in my own way because this is the path which has presented itself to me at the moment. I frequently sell gear because my needs change, and I no longer really feel attached to anything.

I don't believe I will ever become stagnant, because a) my financial situation won't let me, and b) my absolute love of music won't let me.

Did I just go about a mile off topic? Sorry if I did, but music is a living art and unless you accept that fact, you'll do a lot of head scratching trying to figure out why no one is listening.

[Mat Rhodes]

music is a living art and unless you accept that fact, you'll do a lot of head scratching trying to figure out why no one is listening.

Now who's generalizing, Mike?

Music's also a commodity and a performance/product that can be and is sold. As a sideman, you have the luxury and flexibility of picking and choosing who you play with - you're also somewhat at their mercy if the band decides you're expendable. If you're ever in the position of band leader, marketing guy, and you're still playing for a living, your perspective on this might be somewhat curved.

[Ron Whitfield]

I believe THIS is the thread to go off topic on, or hijack, if there ever was one!

[Mark Roeder]

Mike I agree with you completely. As I am a sideman as well. I try to sit in with anyone I can to learn what I can from that experience. Yes music is a living art and with that comes frustration but also rewards from the art. Be that rarely financal.

The frustration comes when I put alot of time in a project and....no point in repeating my rant.

I don't mind a meandering thread now and then...It's like a conversation over coffee or a beer.

Mark

[Mike Neer]

...If you're ever in the position of band leader, marketing guy, and you're still playing for a living, your perspective on this might be somewhat curved.

As a former leader of an 8-pc band, I decided for my posterity that I'd rather be a sideman. There's just not enough money to make it worthwhile for me. On the original music front, I feel I work more effectively as a collaborator, so at least the onus isn't completely on me.

Jeez, I just realized I'm talking a lot of crap.

[Mat Rhodes]

I believe THIS is the thread to go off topic on, or hijack, if there ever was one!

Well, Ron, you wanted some topics. Don't know how new or interesting they are, but here they are.

[Ron Whitfield]

...if we could just spread the love all around!

[Danny James]

----if we could just spresd the love all around!


We can!