Forced to use Fender

Steve Spitz · From: New Orleans, LA, USA

I`m playing a festival next week , and have to use a re-issue twin. How do you guys set one up (EQ) .I won`t have much time if any to fiddle with it.Should I leave the black box at home for a tube amp ?
Am I nuts, or does a pot pedal(hilton) sound better with a tube amp and single coils ? I usually use a hilton. Any feedback out there ? Thanks

Alan Rudd · From: Ardmore, Oklahoma

I played with a band a couple of years back in which the steel player used a Twin on our first gig. He never used it again, although I urged him to. I thought it was by far his best sounding amp.

Jim Sliff · From: Lawndale California, USA

Clyde Mattocks · From: Kinston, North Carolina, USA

I occasionally take my reissue twin on a gig if we
have limited hauling space so that I can use one amp for steel and tele. I like the normal (non reverb)
side for steel and use a Lexicon digital reverb in
front. If you've got to hit it cold, I recommend
setting everything on 5 and tweak as you go. First
start adjusting the Middle control to get to where you want to be. Works for me, others may go a
different route.
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LeGrande II, Nash. 112, Fender Twin Tone Master, Session 400, Harlow Dobro, R.Q.Jones Dobro

Steve Norman · From: Seattle Washington, USA

In my experience with them I have had to turn the treble way down. They are pretty bright. If you only have a second I would turn the trble to 3 or so and bump it as I go
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GFI D10, Fender Steel King, Hilton Vpedal,BoBro, National D dobro, Marrs RGS

Clyde Mattocks · From: Kinston, North Carolina, USA

Yeah Steve, that is my experience too, using the
reverb channel. I usually run it down to two. a
Fender reverb seems to accent the treble. An
outboard digital reverb is a little warmer and you can tolerate a little more highs on the amp. Of
course, the steel used makes a lot of difference.
My settings are for an Emmons LeGrande II.
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LeGrande II, Nash. 112, Fender Twin Tone Master, Session 400, Harlow Dobro, R.Q.Jones Dobro

Michael Douchette · From: Gallatin, TN (deceased)

If there is time to fiddle with it, start with all on 5, and tweak. If not... I would use Jim's settings, but in reverse. Treb 4, Mid 5, Bass 6, use a reverb pedal instead of the spring. Just to avoid the thunder.
_________________
Mikey D... H.S.P.
Music hath the charm to soothe a savage beast, but I'd try a 10mm first.

http://www.steelharp.com
http://www.thesessionplayers.com/douchette.html

(other things you can ask about here)
http://s117.photobucket.com/albums/o54/Steelharp/

Ken Fox · From: Nashville GA USA

Maybe you could hide the modded Nashville 400 behind the Twin!

Brad Sarno · From: St. Louis, MO USA

If you're used to a particular midrange dip from another amp, you can find that dip with a Twin by using the treble knob. The Treble control not only adds/cuts treble, but it also moves the mid dip around. If you typically like a midrange dip around 800Hz, then a Twin treble setting of about 3.7 will give that same dip frequency. If you're used to a Webb, then try treble settings around 5 to 6 to get that kind of midrange. So its kind of a dance between correct mids and treble. Bass should likely be in the 4-6 range. Too much bass, and the notes lose punch. They may get fat, but they also get loose. Not too much mid cut either. Right around 5 on the mid knob should be right. NO bright switch.

I find it extremely easy to find a great steel tone on a Twin. Even the reissue is close enough.

Brad

Jim Sliff · From: Lawndale California, USA

All the slight variations confirm that there's nothing "standard" about amp settings.

One other note about reverb (although it won't matter in this particular case as he won't have time) - the reverb driver and recovery/preamp tubes can make a huge difference in the amount and frequency response of the spring reverb. Anyone with a Fender reverb tube amp that doesn't care for the reverb sound (or finds a lack of control) can switch between different 12AX7's and 5751's (for less gain) on the recovery side and 12AT7's as a driver. Both these tubes are critically important to the reverb sound and the usual stock tubes don't cut it IMO; I almost always replace them with NOS U.S., British or German tubes (often the military versions). The stock Groove Tubes are simply the same EH, Sovtek, etc. cheap imports wearing different clothes....
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No chops, but great tone
1930's/40's Rickenbacher/Rickenbacker 6&8 string lap steels
1921 Weissenborn Style 2; Hilo&Schireson hollownecks
Appalachian, Regal & Dobro squarenecks
1959 Fender 400 9+2 B6;1960's Fender 800 3+3+2; 1948 Fender Dual-8 Professional

Donny Hinson · From: Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.

I agree with the guys here, if we don't know what you're looking for, it's hard to make recommendations.

Bob Hoffnar · From: Austin, Tx

If you find that you are getting some weird distortion even at low volumes plug into the 2nd input. It is attenuated a bit so you won't overload the input pre amp. Some pedal steel pickups have much more output than guitar pickups and overload that 1st input. I had that issue with twins when I used BL 710 pickups.
Those amps sound great. The Hilton pedal is no problem with them.
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Bob

Scott Swartz · From: St. Louis, MO

Brad Sarno, Jim Peters, Dave Anderson, and myself recently played a show with a Twin Reverb as the backline.

I recorded the show using an HD24 and mixer direct out on every channel, so I have audio files of the steel channel for all 4 guys playing through the Twin.

One p/p, a Williams, a Carter, and a MSA, all sounded great both at the show and listening to the audio files.

That should tell you something... Your title made me chuckle, I would be happy to be "forced" to use a Twin LOL

And you will want to use the Black Box also so your pickup is seeing the same load as through your normal rig.
_________________
Scott Swartz
Steeltronics - Steel Guitar Pickups
www.steeltronics.com

Keith Hilton · From: 248 Laurel Road Ozark, Missouri 65721

I am presently using a Fender Vibrosonic with a 15 inch speakder. This is a tube amp with around 100 Watts. I have been using just the amp without any effects, just reverb on the amp. Emmons guitar, Hilton pedal, Fender Vibrosonic. I've been getting a lot of good complements on the sound. In the past I think I over did "delay" when I was running effect units. Still would like to have a good effect unit, but I can't stand the units that have reverb and delay mixed together. Brad has got the best pre amps for steel guitar in opinion.

Pete Burak · From: Portland, OR USA

If you have a unit that has a phase button, you could jumper both channels.
My Vibrosonic sounds way mo betta like this.
I plug steel into the 1st channel input (far left), then out of the input next to it to an ART TubePack in bypass mode but with the "phase" switch depressed (you can use any unit that you have lying around with a phase switch), then to input 1 of the reverb channel.
Now you are using all the volume and tone knobs on the amp to tailor your vol/tone/verb.

Twayn Williams · From: Portland, OR

I own a Twin '65 RI and I'd also go with Jim's settings, except I'd run into the second input on the reverb channel, NOT the first one! Steel pickups tend to be really, really hot and the second input has a cap or some such to reduce the input signal strength so you don't overload the front-end of the amp too quickly. I think of the first input as my Strat input and the second input as my Les Paul input. As always, YMMV!!!
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Primitive Utility Steel

Steve Spitz · From: New Orleans, LA, USA

Thanks for all the input. I am running a millenium with tru tone single coil pickups.
My options are RV3vs amp reverb , Hilton vs Goodrich pot pedal, Black box or not .

Ken Fox - I like your idea. Ken recently put his intense mod on a NV400 for me. It was filthy when I bought it , Now it`s "pimped out" , re-covered w glitter vinyl sounds great.
I`d love to use this weekend (french quarter fest) but parking and hauling is really tough.
I`d love to hear opinions on any other options, and will update anyone who cares after the gig.
Similar scenario in 2 weeks at the New Orleans Jazz fest. Thanks to all.

Keith Hilton · From: 248 Laurel Road Ozark, Missouri 65721

Pete, what does the phase do in jumping both channels? Years ago I saw Jimmy Day, just jump out of one channel into the second channel on a Twin with a straight guitar cord.

Jim Sliff · From: Lawndale California, USA

Donny Hinson · From: Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.

I'd like to add you can get some "drop out" or strange tones (caused by phasing) when using both channels, but it's only a big problem when you have the tone settings on both channels set similarly. Back in the mid '60s, I even used this method to get the "phaser/chorus sound" by adding a jack to my volume pedal that allowed me to pan back and forth between each channel on my Twin Reverb. (That's back before phaser and chorus pedals were available.)

No, I probably wasn't the first to ever think of doing that, but I'll wager I was the first in these parts! Wink

Steve Spitz · From: New Orleans, LA, USA

Thanks for the all the good stuff. I suspect the vibrosonics out there are comparable , but not the same . I think I have a handle on the EQ , just don`t want to overdrive it. I suspect the goodrich pot pedal may be less likely to do so , but I sure do prefer usng the hilton. On the fence with my black box.(tubes on top of tubes, per Donny)
Thanks guys!

Stephen Silver · From: Asheville, NC

I recently did a road gig where I had to use a backline provided Twin RI with stock speakers. As I had used Twins all through the 70's, I went with the settings I used back then which was T at @6, M at @3.5 and B at about 8.5. Dipping the mids down on a Fender amp always helps me (even on my FSK)

I also had my SGBB which made an incredible difference.

It sounded great in a room with 2000 people....I can't recall ever liking a Twin s much as I did that night.

I play an Emmons LGIII with stock pickups and a Hilton pedal.

SS
_________________
Life is mostly Attitude and Timing

Steve Norman · From: Seattle Washington, USA

let us know how it went! very informative thread and I would like to know the results! I like exclamation points!
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GFI D10, Fender Steel King, Hilton Vpedal,BoBro, National D dobro, Marrs RGS

David Doggett · Posted 12 Apr 2008 1:38 pm

I play a Millennium with Truetones and Hilton VP into a silver-face Dual Showman Reverb (same as SF Twin and Vibrosonic). If you are use to a big steel amp with a 15, you can get the twin 12s close to that voice with treble 3, mid 5.5, bass 8. Start with the bright off, and the reverb around 4. But the Twin Reissue is based on the black-face Twin. It has less power and breaks up sooner. Cutting back the bass can help if you get too much break up. I don't think you will need the black box.

Michael Johnstone · From: Sylmar,Ca. USA

Bring along an outboard EQ pedal so you can scoop and shape your mids with some control. That's the only way I can live with a Twin for steel.An outboard digital reverb will add a little class also.

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