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Topic: Vibrato/intonation issue? |
Mark Lynott
From:
Chicago, Illinois, USA
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Posted 21 Feb 2008 8:19 am |
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A number of non-steel playing musicians have commented to me that many of the greats of lap steel and bottleneck style from the 20's and 30's , those that many of us have been greatly influenced by are "way out of tune"and therefore "not good musicians".
I happen to like both players with a wider vibrato and those with a more calm pitch-accurate style and use a little of both in my playing depending on the song. Is it just "not ok" to use a vibrato that's a little on the wider/faster side? Seems like vibrato should be what your musical soul is saying and not a formula, right? |
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Carroll Hale
From:
EastTexas, USA
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Posted 21 Feb 2008 8:39 am
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funny thought.........can all those millions & millions of people who bought records/tapes/cds of those "old 20's - 30's" music and have listened for all these many years also have ears that cannot detect "out of tune"....or maybe they all just like what some of us would call "good music".....
I play with about 15 older/retired folks and I call us the "OOT..OOT" band...(out of time/out of tune) band.........and we are definitely not always on the same beat or same frequency..........but WE DO HAVE A GOOD TIME.......and that is really what counts..
my 2 cents on this....
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Bill Hatcher
From:
Atlanta Ga. USA
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Posted 21 Feb 2008 8:43 am Re: Vibrato/intonation issue?
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| Mark Lynott wrote: |
A number of non-steel playing musicians have commented to me that many of the greats of lap steel and bottleneck style from the 20's and 30's , those that many of us have been greatly influenced by are "way out of tune"and therefore "not good musicians".
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They are snobberishly ignorant. They can't see the forrest for the trees. |
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Rick Collins
From:
Claremont , CA USA
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Posted 21 Feb 2008 8:48 am
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Agreed, Mark. Of course the style of vibrato will vary with the tempo of the tune. Plus, a little wider in the lower register __ tighter in the upper.
This should come naturally with practice. Slower tunes need vibrato for the sustaining effect.
Keep thinking: "I must listen closely to myself playing." Every time you practice try to imagine you are playing before an audience.
I don't agree that the first steel guitar players were not good musicians. Each had their own style. But, I do think some the later players were better. At least for my taste, I'd rather hear some of the later players play.
Of course Jerry Byrd could do anything, and just about did.
Last edited by Rick Collins on 21 Feb 2008 8:55 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Bob Hoffnar
From:
Austin, Tx
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Posted 21 Feb 2008 8:53 am
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Music is a form of communication and personal expression. To make sweeping judgments about generations of successful musicians to justify a smug attitude of superiority is the mark of a fearful heart and limited mind. In simpler words anybody would say something as stupid as "....not good musicians" has their head up their ass.
_________________
Bob |
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Brad Bechtel
From:
San Francisco, CA
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Posted 21 Feb 2008 8:54 am
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| Quote: |
| A number of non-steel playing musicians have commented to me that many of the greats of lap steel and bottleneck style from the 20's and 30's , those that many of us have been greatly influenced by are "way out of tune"and therefore "not good musicians". |
You need to hang out with a better class of musician, Mark. 
Which specific steel guitarists do these "non-steel playing musicians" consider to be "not good musicians"?
_________________
Brad’s Page of Steel
A web site devoted to acoustic & electric lap steel guitars |
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Mark Lynott
From:
Chicago, Illinois, USA
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Posted 21 Feb 2008 9:58 am
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| Brad Bechtel wrote: |
| Quote: |
| A number of non-steel playing musicians have commented to me that many of the greats of lap steel and bottleneck style from the 20's and 30's , those that many of us have been greatly influenced by are "way out of tune"and therefore "not good musicians". |
You need to hang out with a better class of musician, Mark.
Which specific steel guitarists do these "non-steel playing musicians" consider to be "not good musicians"? |
I referred them to some examples of the playing of Sol Hoopii, Roy Smeck, Clell Summey ("Steel Guitar Blues" w/Roy Acuff) Bukka White and Son House. |
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David Doggett
From:
Bawl'mer, MD (formerly of MS, Nawluns, Gnashville, Knocksville, Lost Angeles, Bahsten. and Philly)
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Posted 21 Feb 2008 12:50 pm
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Standards were different in the days of the pioneers of steel and slide guitar, both for the musicians and the listeners. What they were doing was the best anyone had ever heard. Also, many of the pioneers were really just elevated amateurs and folk musicians. This was especially true of many early blues men, who had day jobs and only played on weekends. They simply didn't have the years of seat time that later full-time pros had. Also, emotional content was as important or more important than precise playing and singing. And they were making it up as they went along, with no previous models to try to emulate and surpass.
There is a pattern in much of pop music. Original innovators develop new sounds that may be somewhat raw, but that are emotionally engaging and fresh. Then imitators and technicians come along and further perfect the style. Many of them become technically more proficient than the originals. But it begins to sound slick and stale and boring. The focus on impressive technique replaces the originality and emotional power of the originators. Would you rather hear Son House or Johnny Winters? B.B. King or Eric Clapton? The early Byrds or the later Eagles? Hank Williams or Garth Brooks? Flash and perfection ain't everything.  |
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Mark Lynott
From:
Chicago, Illinois, USA
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Posted 21 Feb 2008 1:23 pm
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| Well put David, I notice that the detractors I mentioned also don't care for most singers that have a roots/folk style either. |
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Don Kona Woods
From:
Hawaiian Kama'aina
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Posted 21 Feb 2008 2:46 pm
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Rick says,
| Quote: |
| Keep thinking: "I must listen closely to myself playing." Every time you practice try to imagine you are playing before an audience. |
Rick, that is one of the best pieces of advice that I have heard for your practice time. It is the same thing that I did when practicing for basketball games in college. Practice as if you are playing the game.
Rick says,
| Quote: |
| I don't agree that the first steel guitar players were not good musicians. Each had their own style. But, I do think some the later players were better. At least for my taste, I'd rather hear some of the later players play. |
I would say that if the steel players of today were playing back in the 1930-40's, they would be no better than those early steel players. We build on the past to become better players today. Another basketball point. I played college basketball 40 years ago. The players now are definitely better. But if they were playing in the 1960's they would be no better than the players of that era.
Think about it!!
Aloha,
Don |
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