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Topic: Where is the cut off point between vintage and modern? |
Ken Byng
From:
Southampton, England
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Posted 16 Dec 2007 4:27 am |
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There has been debate in the past about restoration of pedal steels and the subsequent effect on their value. As most restorations seem to involve ShoBud guitars along with Fender (not the ShoBud models), I would be interested as to what would be classed as a 'vintage' instrument. Is it anything made in the 40's, 50's or 60's, or by particular manufacturers such as Paul Bigsby?
Which instruments are best left alone to preserve their value, and which ones would have their value or desirability enhanced through total renovation and restoration? |
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Will Hart
From:
St. Croix, Virgin Islands
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Posted 16 Dec 2007 4:46 am
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| Interesting and somewhat subjective question. But I think of a modern guitar as one with split tuning. |
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John Roche
From:
England
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Posted 16 Dec 2007 4:59 am
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| one that stays in tune |
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Andy Sandoval
From:
Bakersfield, California, USA
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Posted 16 Dec 2007 5:49 am
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| I'd leave any old guitar alone if everything on it worked properly, but if it doesn't then it's just a museum piece to look at. Sometimes it's not easy to replace old parts especially when you can't find them so in that case I wouldn't hesitate to update with new parts. I'd rather be able to play an old guitar with newer parts then worry about keepin it all original and not be able to play it. |
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Michael Lee Allen
From:
Portage Park / Irving Park, Chicago, Illinois
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Posted 16 Dec 2007 11:09 am
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Removed.
_________________
"Wisdom does not always come with age. Many times age arrives alone."
Last edited by Michael Lee Allen on 26 Feb 2011 11:12 am; edited 1 time in total |
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David Doggett
From:
Bawl'mer, MD (formerly of MS, Nawluns, Gnashville, Knocksville, Lost Angeles, Bahsten. and Philly)
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Posted 16 Dec 2007 8:02 pm
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I don't think real vintage collectors are interested in pedal steels of any age, except for the first few of a brand. And they may never be. However, there are many players who value the nostalgic, cosmetic, and tonal aspects of some of the older models. For these players the values are similar to what you find with old cars. Customization and upgrading does not necessarily harm the value, and can even make the instruments more desirable, just like with cars a stock '57 Chevy may not be worth as much as a Barris or Big Daddy Roth extreme custom. Also, a beat up junker '57 Chevy is not worth as much as one that has been restored, even if aftermarket relacement parts are used. In the same way, an old Sho-Bud refinished and restored with modern parts by Marrs or Coop is worth more than an old beater.
Let's face it. Much of the value of vintage 6-strings is driven by the millions of guitar players chasing after the diminishing numbers of old guitars. That supply-and-demand driven price inflation then brings in collectors who buy old instruments for investment purposes. There just aren't enough steelers with deep pockets to drive up the price of your run-of-the-mill old pedal steels. And without that investment potential, deep pocket collectors are not interested.
Also, the size of pedal steels is a problem for collectors. Having a few old guitars packed away in cases in a closet, or hung on a wall for display is one thing. Filling up your floor space with a bunch of old pedal steels is not so practical.
All that being said, the players' idea of vintage can extend up until fairly recently. I think we consider Sho-Buds from the '70s and '80s as vintage. Even if they have modern mechanics, they have retro lacquer cosmetics, and they are no longer made. Also, even the last of the Emmons push-pulls made in '80s are considered vintage. And I'm thinking early Zums (late '70s or early '80s?) are considered vintage. LIkewise, early Franklins. And probably early Anapegs, Excells, Williams, etc. Any mechanically or cosmetically or tonally exceptional pedal steel that is no longer made could be considered vintage, especially by owners of later models of the same makers. |
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Dr. Richard Buffington
From:
Arizona, USA
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Posted 17 Dec 2007 5:33 am Cut off age of vintage guitars
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| I do know that any guitar that I bought new would have to be vintage. Not necessarily collectable. Doc. |
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Jim Sliff
From:
Lawndale California, USA
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Posted 17 Dec 2007 6:15 am
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If you talk to vintage dealers and collectors it strictly depends on the brand (and sometimes model) of instrument, and there are subsets within or outside that (Pre-CBS Fender Strats & pre big-headstock Fender Strats are both vintage "categories"). There's no definitive cutoff.
15 years ago, before the vintage thing went crazy, "20 years old" was the simple cutoff point. Now it's extremely detailed.
_________________
No chops, but great tone
1930's/40's Rickenbacher/Rickenbacker 6&8 string lap steels
1921 Weissenborn Style 2; Hilo&Schireson hollownecks
Appalachian, Regal & Dobro squarenecks
1959 Fender 400 9+2 B6;1960's Fender 800 3+3+2; 1948 Fender Dual-8 Professional |
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