The Steel Guitar Forum

Like many of you, I fully enjoyed the first issue of this magazine and took a leap of faith and paid for a years subscription in advance....I know this forum is not supposed to disrespect people but after emailing Terry on at least 2 separate occasions and a promise of a refund, I am out of more than $50 and no magazine...so what's up with that?

Well, I hope you are not the victim of a scam like the Dobro folks just went through. Same deal there: people paid for a dobro magazine in advance that never got delivered. Unfortunately, they got taken for a lot more than just the magazine subscription so maybe you are luckier than you know.

Well, depending on who you listen to, yes you're right, you're out the money. Terry was warned before he got started that there was not enough support for the thing and he was going to wind up in the ditch, money AND time-wise. As predicted, only about 1/3 of the folks who said they'd be on board actually were. A lot of folks are upset, as you'll see as this thread grows. I was in right away, but I knew odds were it was going to not happen, it was a gamble, and it didn't pan out. I've lost more on one roll of the dice in Vegas, and that's the way I look at it. As I understand it, the 3rd issue is arranged, but there's no way to print or distribute it. Where he got in trouble was overestimating demand (most of the folks who promised to support didn't) and underestimating costs-he needed about 5 times what he had to start. And reality is, no matter how you cut it, a mag like that can't be done affordably-you'd probably have to charge $35 an issue or more to make it work.

There will be some irate posts, Terry will get defensive and insist it's not dead, and in a couple months we'll do this all over again. I sense from his posts that Terry's pretty angry about the whole thing, and I can't blame him, on a certain level. Had he gotten the support he was promised, this would be working. But he's been around long enough to know that as a group we're fast with the mouth and slow with the wallet, so it's hard to sympathize, especially when he insisted he had enough to proceed. I think there's a little bit of denial going on in claims it's not dead-the patient is not breathing, it's eyes are closed, and it's starting to bloat. I'd say it's flat lined.

Another case of the road to hell being paved with good intentions. 50 bucks wasn't a bad investment to risk on the chance of him pulling it off. Essentially, that's what we did-invested in a start-up. It didn't work. Most of them don't. We all knew that, or should have, as it was obvious that was the case. The folks who are jumping up and down about being ripped off are taking it a little over the top, in my opinion.

However-and this is another point entirely, I think Terry could have handled this better all the way across the board, and that's been the cause for some anger that may be justified, but that's between the parties involved. It's probably time to move on here.

------------------
Fulawka D-10 9&5
Fessenden D-10 8&8
"All in all, looking back, I'd have to say the best advice anyone ever gave me was 'Hands Up, Don't Move!"
www.johnbarnold.com/pedalsteel
www.buddycage.net

http://www.nrpsmusic.com/index.html

I have a problem with the "roll of the dice" or "startup investment" analogies.

This product was not marketed as "gamble" or "take a chance on a start-up" venture. It was, and still is, marketed as a product.

At least on a roll of the dice you have a chance to win. My money went into someones pocket and nothing was delivered. Even better I ordered his book and never got that either. Guess it beats a day job !

<SMALL>What we have here, is a failure to communicate</SMALL>

... and that, IMHO, is the worst part of the whole deal...

IHMO. All I can say is "Don't judge a person untill you've walked in their shoes for a day, turn your frustrations over to a higher Power and get rid of resentments".
You'll feel a lot better. Al

All the best things can be said about Terry and his intentions.

If I understand the facts correctly:

FACT: He took money from people and promised a product

FACT: He has (or has spent) their money and they have still have no product.

That is illegeal. He should not be allowed to get away with that. If in fact this is the case

Just like others I'm out $50. But put that in perspective. If you took a friend out to dinner at a reasonably good restaurant, it would cost the same. A round of drinks has cost me that much on occasion. I'spent at least $50 too much for a guitar I wanted. I wanted Terry to suceed. So I "invested" 50 clams.

Terry tried. He tried very hard. The demographics and the hard knocks of business were not on his side. If you have ever laid awake at night wondering how you were going to find the money to make payroll, I'll bet you sympathize with Terry.
I've written this off as an investment that didn't pay off. But as they say, opinions vary.

So, Al
Just curious
I realize you wrote some articles for the magazine.

Did YOU pay for a subscription?

I'm trying to understand how anyone can defend a product that was marketed, money accepted, and not delivered. Many of us (me included) cited previous EXCELLENT publications that failed but wanted this one to succeed so much we went ahead and sent in money (A LONG TIME AGO) hoping for something that never materialized.

Is it not reasonable when each of the subscribers has paid for a product that didn't ever reach production to ask WHERE THE MONEY WENT?

------------------
<small>Larry Bell - email: larry@larrybell.org - gigs - Home Page
2003 Fessenden S/D-12 8x8, 1969 Emmons S-12 6x6, 1971 Dobro, Standel and Peavey Amps

And for those who imply that several of us made a commitment and didn't live up to it--I subscribed to the magazine and waited an inordinate amount of time for the first copy and when it arrived I would estimate perhaps 30% of the material was relative to lap or non-pedal steel. The title of the magazine suggests "Pedal Steel". The material was not what I wanted to partake in so I cancelled my subscription. Looks like, for once, I made the right decision.
Before the flames, I own and play two non-pedal steels.
fred

------------------
"From Truth, Justice is Born"--Quanah Parker-1904

Fred

Those of us who said they'd subscribe and then did are in the minority.

No, it wasn't marketed as a gamble, or an investment, in fact it was pushed pretty hard here on the forum (TOO hard if you ask me) and Terry said several times he had the resources to make this work and get through the first year of issues. What happened to that is a good question, and one that should have people irate. I'm not saying anger isn't justified, it's just probably too late. There's no question this thing was presented as a viable going concern, even as the delivery dates got delayed.

I knew when I sent my money in there's was less than a 50/50 chance I'd see more than 2 or 3 issues. I think a lot of others did too, because the fur started to fly the minute those things got late.

But the people who are angry have every right to be. I am too, but I can't say I'm surprised. I AM surprised to hear that books weren't delivered, but I didn't order one of those.

JB

------------------
Fulawka D-10 9&5
Fessenden D-10 8&8
"All in all, looking back, I'd have to say the best advice anyone ever gave me was 'Hands Up, Don't Move!"
www.johnbarnold.com/pedalsteel
www.buddycage.net

http://www.nrpsmusic.com/index.html

I wasn't implying that any malintent nor skullduggery was going on but you gotta admit that an explanation would be in order. Where did our money go? I'm not "resenting" just annoyed, especially when the man told me he would refund my money...after reading his book I know he had his share of ups and downs but who doesnt? I wholeheartedly believe that walking in another mans shoes is compassionate and appropriate at times. It still doesnt mean it was managed appropriately and fairly. I lost most of my retirement and kids college funds gambling(investing) in the stock market! I am responsible for that and obviously have to deal with the inherent consequences. As far as the comparisons to going out and having dinner or the such, at least there was a product and service. Why is the website still active? Oh well, OTHER THAN THAT MRS. LINCOLN HOW DID YOU LIKE THE PLAY? A bit dramatic but trying to make a point.

I invested and lost $1,500 in Russ Rask's SGW.

Any of you gys who are complaining about losing 50 bucks wanna trade?

Investing is different than purchasing a product, Mike.

If I buy stock in a company I accept any losses that might result.

If I buy a product from that same company, I expect the product.

I ahve not been up here due to this http://steelguitarforum.com/Forum14/HTML/002378.html

please check this link.

Sincerely,
Terry Wendt

------------------
PedalSteel.us Magazine

TheEarlyDays.com

and appearing regularly...aLotOfSpace.com
Jimmy Crawford/Russ Hicks... and Buddy Emmons on Bass!

I don't have a dog in this fight. After losing money in a previous steel guitar magazine subscription, I decided to wait until this magazine proved itself before I invested. I am truly sorry for Terry's health problems, and those of his family.

However (from a recent post by Terry)...

<SMALL>Many of you know my family and I moved into a temporary living arrangement in town here (Nashville) in July 2002.</SMALL>

<SMALL>Studio Plus Hotel in Nashville, an ESA property has taken over 60K+ in actual CASH MONEY from our family...</SMALL>

These two statements infer Terry was paying <u>well</u> over $20,000 a year...to live in a hotel.

I know one other family that tried to live, long-term, in a hotel.

It ruined them financially, too.

Alright everybody! Time to take your Alzheimer's medication! Seems some of you are forgetting we've already covered this topic ad nauseum.

Here's a re-cap for the forgetful:
Terry: Sorry, magazine's not coming out. I'm not financially stable.
Customer: Shoot!
Angry Customer: What!? I gave you $50! Give me my magazine!
Beligerent Customer: #$#%! You *&#$ jerk! That was my fifty *#&^*@#% dollars! I was probably going to spend it on booze and whores anyways, but now I can act like an idiot on a public forum because I feel that the internet gives me anonymity! In fact...
Terry: Sorry, I just can't do it.
Customer: I was hoping this would pan out, but oh well. It's not like I've never lost money before. Take care, Terry.
Angry Customer: Terry, I don't ever want to speak to you or see you again!
Beligerent Customer: #$#%! Fifty $%*#ing dollars, Terry! My life is $%*@ing ruined! I really needed that booze! Your name is going to be mud by the time I get through with you, Mr. Terry Wendt!--No, wait. You don't even deserve to be called mister. You're lower than $*#&! I'm going to make it my personal vendetta to...

Okay, so now that we're all clear that nothing's being accomplished in this thread. Let's move on.

Oh, all Robert Randolph thread posters please report at noon for your medication, as well.



------------------
"It's gettin' hard to find a place to play my guitar,
And they're tryin' to put an end to guys like me"

The Georgia Steel Guitar Association: we steel got them Georgia Peaches

<SMALL>all Robert Randolph thread posters please report at noon for your medication</SMALL>

I'll take mine now, please


------------------
<small>Larry Bell - email: larry@larrybell.org - gigs - Home Page
2003 Fessenden S/D-12 8x8, 1969 Emmons S-12 6x6, 1971 Dobro, Standel and Peavey Amps

last I heard, issue #3 was almost done- is it officially dead and gone?

------------------
http://www.johnmcgann.com
Info for musicians, transcribers, technique tips and fun stuff. Joaquin Murphey transcription book, Rhythm Tuneup DVD and more...

It's not dead, and there is a double issue on my PC (which is currently under watch by the HAZMAT guys)... and I am almost dead, but I believe the TRUTH is much stronger than FICTION -

This to shall pass, and some who bicht (I speelt er wrong intentionally) will eventually have no right to bicht. I still have plenty of issues (non-contaminated versions) of #1 and #2 available in our storage inventory... and one day the complainers will see. Many advertisers were never billed for their ads, as Scotty and Bruce Z and George L will admit, to name a few. They have offered repeatedly to pay me too, but I have refused to accept, as I expect to use that money to print and mail the next double issue, when my health and my family's health improves. I am very sorry, but that's just how the cards have been dealt to me.

PS- FRED MARTIN I SENT YOUR BOOK! YOU NEVER SAID YOU DIDN'T RECEIVE IT, BUT I HAVE THE PRIORITY MAIL RECEIPT WITH YOUR ZIPCODE ON IT WHEN I MAILED IT!!

Terry

------------------
PedalSteel.us Magazine

TheEarlyDays.com

and appearing regularly...aLotOfSpace.com
Jimmy Crawford/Russ Hicks... and Buddy Emmons on Bass!

Hope all gets better for you and your family Terry.You really seem to be having a bad time ever since you moved to Nashvllle,better move back here.Take care and GOD BLESS you and your family....Ron

------------------
Franklin Guitars

Ron,

I am not sure what you mean. With the exception of a couple of years (back when I saw you in MI) I have lived here since 1979. I have enjoyed most of my life and career here. It has only been the last 8 years that have been ()*&(&*%. ...and actually, the middle 3 1/2 of those 8 years were great!! It's been the last three that have been real hell!

I'm wanting to move to a warmer climate again but I have never had to make my living doing music.It has always been a great hobby that I got paid for, so I don't know what it is like to try and make a living in a busy place like Nashville ,where musicians are everywhere like you are doing. Working at a day job for 40 years has helped me with raising my family and now I can relax with my retirement..just a little joke about the move back for you...stay where you are happiest at....RS

------------------
Franklin Guitars

Hey Terry,

I'm glad to hear you say it's not dead.
I believe you.

New subscribers might be hard to get, but I suspect you'll sell a lot of single issues when it gets printed.

I'm looking forward to it.
You and your family's health comes first