The Steel Guitar Forum

Hi Bobbe, thanks for your way of putting words to the problem we have as dealers. I agree with you on all points! When I started my company Steel Guitar Music here in Stockholm about 25 years ago, I got a nice deal with Dekley. A great steel with a budget price and I sold a bunch of guitars. I also was the exclusive dealer for MSA until they went out of business. After that, I sold Sho-Bud, Emmons, Sierra and so on. The last ten years the whole market has changed since the factories began to sell directly to pickers. I don´t know who started that trend, but I am sure you know more about it.
This is what has happened to me: Some customers come to my shop, look at the guitars I have in stock, play them, get lots of information. And some guys call me by the phone and I help them out as good as I can. Then they go home and order the guitar directly from the factory!! In the past I have asked some of the factory owners if I could be their dealer for Sweden and Scandinavia, but the answer has always been "no deal". I guess they think they are going to sell more guitars without having a dealer in between themselves and the customer. But it also means that most factories in the US take no responsibility for their guitars when sending them abroad. A local dealer can give the customer the service the factory can´t! Through the years I have been the helping hand for a couple of pickers, who bought their guitars directly, when their steel wasn´t in the shape it should. I didn´t like the situation, but since steelers are my friends I helped them out anyway. Nobody can send the guitar back over the Atlantic Sea for a repair. Who would pay that trip?
Whatever you are buying, food, cars, clothes, records and so on there are factories selling via dealers. Why is it different in the pedal steel business? Janne Lindgren

Janne, I think you have a good point here. I have bought atleast five or six steels from you through the last 25 years and always been treated with respect and friendlines. You always stand by your deal and never let your customers down. When you invest like 3000$ in a steelguitar you really want to be sure that you can get support whenever it´s needed. Come to think of it, you´re the Bobbe Seymour of Sweden.......

Vi hörs!
Stefan

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica">quote:</font><HR><SMALL> Some customers come to my shop, look at the guitars I have in stock, play them,
get lots of information. And some guys call me by the phone and I help them out as good as I can. Then they go home
and order the guitar directly from the factory</SMALL><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Not only is this unethical, but it's shortsighted and stupid. I don't buy new guitars, but I buy new recording equipment, and I always buy from a salesman that I have 'history' with. It may cost more, but the extra cost is neglidgible compared to attention and service I recieve. One time I crashed a hardrive with about 6 months worth of work on it that wasn't backed up (no one ever accused me of being too professional) and he had an engineer from the company call me the next day, Saturday, and spend the afternoon talking me through the recovery. What was that worth?

Great post Janne.
My experience says that dealers always were there when I need them and they gave me a great service.

all the best for you

It would seem better to go downtown to a dealer than spend money on a long distant phone call to the factory if you have a problem(imho)

Bill

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<quote>quote:
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"Some customers come to my shop, look at the guitars I have in stock, play them,
get lots of information. And some guys call me by the phone and I help them out as good as I can. Then they go home
and order the guitar directly from the factory"
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Also:


"Not only is this unethical, but it's shortsighted and stupid"<unquote>

Ditto. Besides the practical loss we all eventually suffer because of this, it's also extremely small and materialistic. The buzz one gets from saving a few bucks only lasts so long.<FONT SIZE=1 COLOR="#8e236b"><p align=CENTER>[This message was edited by Jeff A. Smith on 26 September 2001 at 05:18 PM.]</p></FONT>

Hi Janne,good post and i agree with you 100%.
I've bought 2 guitars from you,my first "steel" back in february -99 and i believe it was the first "Lindgren S-10 (3+4)" wich you and your brother build.
Then traded it for a MSA D-10 in November last year 2000...i must say i am a very satisfied customer and it feels good to know that whenever i need proffesional help all i have to do is contact you.

Have it...
Anders

I am really sorry to say this but:

Most of you have missed the underlying point of this post.

That is to say that givin' todays economics,regardless of who we are,we will attempt to maxmaize the bang for the buck spent !!

This isn't only a U.S.A. problem but also a world-wide happening. Givin' what has happened to the consumer,(Health Ins fees,low wages,Cost of Living,Family and Home cost,Collage fees,Etc,etc)he is going to attempt to find the cheapest,not nessarily the most ethical method to acheive his/her goal.

This line of thinking has lead to many artist,players,and dealers being shorted out of a sale,income,and/or monies for future business tranactions/sales/monies.

This is,unfortunatly a fact of life. There is little or nothing that we can do about it. It isn't going to change or become a moral factor in the way the consumer does business, so we must take this as a factor when we price our products,fees,and/or services.

I,personally,could do with many,many small sales and gain the repeat business as oppose to just one or two BIG sales every now and then. (tried and proven,by me) Look at the (in the U.S.A.) Wal-Mart approach, They buy and sell in volumne,as opposed to the store that caters to a middle-class,special group of people,(read this as (Pedal)Steel Players)They make money,We do not make hardly a decent livin'.

I do NOT know the answer to this problem but,I do know that it will NOT change because it is a givin':

To maxumize the money/benefit for the money spend in all business transactions,be it personal or Company.

If this goal cannot be achieve, then the Company/Business will not acheive sucessed in it's area of economics.

This is all sad, but true--- a sign of the times. Ethics and morals seem to be a thing of the past, not taught in the home, or schools for that matter. When I traded up from a starter model to my GFI Ultra, I did business with my teacher, a little guy. Yeah, it cost more in the begining, but in the long run he has been there to tweek, show ME how to tweek and adjust as I have gotten better and the tweek made a differance in how I played. I don't think I am putting down direct sales, you can even buy cars these days on line, but I do believe you sacrafice human interface with someone who cares, that is right in front of you and not on the phone or email --- the extra cost is worth it, at least to me.
Just my thought on the subject, and I may live to regret it.

Steve K.,I always agree with you.(so far!).
I want to thank all of you for your support on this critical matter.Janne,You can be the Bobbe Seymour of Europe if you wish but you better have a lot of guitars,cars, women,airplanes and nerve. And don't plan to sleep much!
Bobbe <FONT SIZE=1 COLOR="#8e236b"><p align=CENTER>[This message was edited by BobbeSeymour on 27 September 2001 at 01:03 PM.]</p></FONT>

Bill said:

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica">quote:</font><HR><SMALL>I am really sorry to say this but:
Most of you have missed the underlying point of this post.

That is to say that givin' todays economics,regardless of who we are,we will attempt to maxmaize the bang for the buck spent !!</SMALL><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Also:


<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica">quote:</font><HR><SMALL>I do NOT know the answer to this problem but,I do know that it will NOT change because it is a givin':

To maxumize the money/benefit for the money spend in all business transactions,be it personal or Company.

If this goal cannot be achieve, then the Company/Business will not acheive sucessed in it's area of economics.</SMALL><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Just to clarify my personal perspective, I'm a believer in the free market. I don't think there is anything wrong with people seeking out the best buy on a product, or with business finding better ways to serve people and give them that best buy. I believe strongly in that basic process.

For me, it is an ethical matter when someone that has no genuine interest in buying from a dealer, takes advantage of free services offered by a dealer that are understood to exist for the benefit of possible customers. Sure, it's not illegal, but it definently is proceeding in bad faith.

Jeff, I think you are missing the point here.The price for a new guitar IS the same, from the factory, or from a dealer! Dealers arn't allowed to sell to much less than retail and factorys don't at all.We are talking ethical factorys here, not garage homebuilders. So , you are a lot better off buying from a dealer. Two warrentys,personal attention,service,quick parts,etc. This has nothing to do with pricing, free enterprize or saving money. The price is the same or even Less from the dealer BECAUSE HE NEEDS YOUR TRADE IN! The factory hates your trade in. Think you get a better deal from a legitement factory? Nope, no way,want a good deal on a new guitar? Call me,I stock a bunch.Iv'e sold 5 new Emmons guitars this week,have 3 being delivered next week. Emmons co. in trouble? I wish I had those troubles! 85 guitars behind? most of them are coming to me, I hope!
www.steelguitar.net

You guys need to understand this, The dealer will sell you the guitar for LESS money than the factory will direct! Listen to this,The better deal is from the dealer!
What is hard to understand here? Do you think your saving money paying retail from the factory? Duh! Retail is retail, no matter who you give the money to!