The Steel Guitar Forum

Happy Holidays everyone!!! We are blessed to have such a great forum! In Andy Volk's book, John Ely says he was doing the Hawaiian vibrato incorrectly, doing it from the shoulder rather than from the whole arm. I have what he calls a "lazy country vibrato" where I roll the bar. Should I be "shaking" it and what does he mean by using the shoulder rather than the whole arm? Should I practice sliding the bar back and forth? Thanks

http://www.horseshoemagnets.com/_sgg/ma_1.htm
http://www.horseshoemagnets.com/_sgg/m7_1.htm <font size="1" color="#8e236b"><p align="center">[This message was edited by Terry Farmer on 20 December 2006 at 12:33 PM.]</p></FONT>

happy holidays.
I am not sure how a Hawaiian vibrato differs from any other. unless one uses the shoulder? that seems exaggerated.
my vibrato, which I use for many genres is more concentrated in the upper arm and wrist. roll or wiggle , whatever the song needs.
maybe Hawaiian vibrato is jargon for flipping
one off

edit

George you are right about the eraser. I had the opportunity to see Jerry, David Kelii, Mel Abe,and Pua Almeida up close and they all did it this way and for my money you can't get more hawaiian vibrato than that. cc

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica">quote:</font><HR><SMALL>The Jerry Byrd Video- shows his style of making little circles , sort of like using a pencil eraser.

Very Effective and great style. You can cirlce forward or backwards - figure 8's for that matter.

as with all vibrato - smaller , narrower smoother = good

wide - big - rough = hurricane.</SMALL><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yep, I was confused when I saw his instructional video and viewed that segment ...

But having hours of live performances on video ... well, I just took that advice with a grain of salt ...

Judge for yourself ...

4 JB "Live" Videos ...

Check out the "Tomi Tomi" number (Byrd's Gone Wild) ... them's some big circles

<font size=1>PS: Please don't upload these to UTube or any similar site</font>

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<font size=1>Dustpans LTD.
The Casteels
HSGA </font>

<font size="1" color="#8e236b"><p align="center">[This message was edited by Rick Aiello on 23 December 2006 at 03:40 PM.]</p></FONT>

Some teachers say use your wrist, not your arm.

Thanks everyone. Thanks,Rick for the videos.You made my day!!!.Jerry is my hero. What a phenomenon. What a touch he has and what a joy to be able to watch him do it.

Thanks for posting Rick. Those JB videos are priceless.

Is anyone else having trouble getting the audio to work on these clips? I've tried everything I know, even upgraded to the dreaded Media Player 11. I get video but very, very faint audio when turned all the way up. Any ideas anyone? It's killing me not being able to hear these!

Mark-Yu are not alone there. I have trouble with my Media Player. It too is not loud enough and the tone isnt that great.

But I use Winamp and the tone and vloume is much better, and I prefer it.

Happy New year fellow Michigander...al

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My Website..... www.cmedic.net/~almarcus/

Mine works fine. I can make it real loud if I turn all controls all the way up. I have nothing special only what comes with XP 2002 and any updates they send for free. I recently did receive a huge file from them that was about 48MB as I recall and it installed a whole new media program. Check for updates if you are eligible from them.

Getting to watch Byrd play is fascinating.<font size="1" color="#8e236b"><p align="center">[This message was edited by Gary Lynch on 26 December 2006 at 07:14 PM.]</p></FONT>

Thanks guys, I'll keep trying different things. I don't have a problem with any other videos, that's why this has me stumped. I've never seen J.B. play and I'd love to be able hear these.

I believe that Hawaiian vibrato may have come in three different forms.

1930's - Fast vibrato - Examples: Andy Iona, Dick McIntire

1940's - Medium vibrato - Example: David Kelii

1950's - Slower vibrato - Example: Jules Ah See and Barney Isaacs

I believe that the earlier fast vibrato was related to the need for more sustain. As the pickups improved and allowed greater sustain, a slower vibrato became more prominent. It also yielded a more mellow tone. JMOHO

Aloha and Happy New Year,
Don

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica">quote:</font><HR><SMALL>1930's - Fast vibrato - Examples: Andy Iona, Dick McIntire

1940's - Medium vibrato - Example: David Kelii

1950's - Slower vibrato - Example: Jules Ah See and Barney Isaacs

I believe that the earlier fast vibrato was related to the need for more sustain. As the pickups improved and allowed greater sustain, a slower vibrato became more prominent. It also yielded a more mellow tone. JMOHO</SMALL><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I definitely hear the changing of vibrato styles listening to recordings from those decades. Your theory makes sense, although, if you listen to vocal vibrato styles over the same periods, they seem to mirror the changes in instrumental vibrato styles, too. Given that a faster vocal vibrato was the singing style in the early part of the century, and that steel guitarists were able to achieve a vocal-like quality because of the fretless nature of the instrument, I think that may have been a factor as well. Listen to early 20th century recordings of violinists, too, and you hear the same thing.

Then again, I dunno... maybe not.

It certainly makes sense when you think of them trying to get more sustain before the electric steel came about, and it makes total sense that the early electric players were used to playing with a technique the they would have used on non-electrics.

Personally, I think I prefer the older style electric steel vibrati ala McIntire, Iona, etc., though, I really enjoy the later styles, too, in their own way.

As long as there's some of that heartfelt "vocal-like" quality and feeling of aloha in there, I love it all.

TJW

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Todd James Weger --
1956 Fender Stringmaster T-8 (C6, A6, B11); 1960 Fender Stringmaster D-8 (C6, B11/A6); Regal resonator (C6); 1938 Epiphone Electar (A6); assorted ukuleles; upright bass

Maybe we need a Rick Aiello vibrato check?

Aloha and Happy New Year,
Don

Those are great videos without any question ! Mahalo Rick. Many of us had the great pleasure of knowing Jerry during his years in Waikiki. He purposely lost a lot of weight from when those videos were taken. As for his volume pedal, some of the newer Forum members may not realize it was wired in reverse...pedal "up" was full vol; "down" was low volume. Those videos bring back many fond memories and again, my thanks !

I agree that a slower vibrato seems to have become more more common in recent decades. That said, there are still plenty of violinists and other musicians who use a pretty fast vibrato. As for who was first, vocalists or instrumentalists, to start the shift from fast to slower vibrato, my guess is that it's probably like the old "chicken or the egg" question. Who knows? There may be a PhD dissertation on the subject.

Personally, I tend to like a slower, fairly wide vibrato. The danger is that a slow, fat vibrato can easily become too "sappy." There is a fine line that's easy to cross. To my ears, some of the most effective vibrato is very close to that line--right on the edge of being too much.

Sometimes (certain jazz tunes, for example) the best vibrato is no vibrato, in my opinion.

Here's a ...

7 minute medley

... video by Jerry Byrd that I put up last evenin' ... to help Ring in the New Year

Thanks! I loved it.

I agree, awesome! It's nice to finally see my all time favorite steel player in action! Thanks Rick.

If you are playing Hawaiian maybe you need to swivel your hips along with it!!

Robro Ron