Like playing the blues??

Jack Francis · From: Queen Creek, Arizona, USA

I hope that I’m able to make sense of
What I’m about to say.

I’ve been playing for a good many years
with many different bands, playing a
variety of music styles.

With every style, but one, it has been necessary
to try and play what is currently being
fostered on the public over the radio.

With R&R and country, what is current
works best by playing to your peers….
younger crowds aren’t all that impressed
by a bunch of old dudes playing “THEIR”
songs. Older crowds are more appreciative
and enjoy the old classic music but the younger
people that are there seems to not get it.

The one type of music that appears to be
accepted by folks of ALL ages and can be
played by us at ANY age without people
looking at us being “OLD FOOLS” trying
to be relevant is ..THE BLUES.

It is what it is, and folks aren’t surprised
to see this old boy rockin’ out with some
good old blues tunes. It seems as though
every body gets into those good old tunes,
and you don’t have to listen to the radio
and learn what the “NEXT” big deal is out
there pushing. In every band that I ever played
in we looked at new material to see if 2 years
from now it would still be relevant, most of
today’s songs won’t have that longevity.

IMHO.

Jim Cohen · From: Philadelphia, PA

Ah yes, the blues: five notes and the truth.

Jack Francis · From: Queen Creek, Arizona, USA

Albert King...1 very "tasty" note...and the truth!

Webb Kline · From: Orangeville, PA

There's something real, something that reaches the innermost part of the soul in the blues. Dealing with life, hardships, trials, is something we all must do and the blues has a way of meeting us there, of helping us to acknowledge our problems and fears, yet enables us to laugh at them at the same time and encourges us to move on, to grasp what hope we can find.

I have turned many Psalms and passages from the Prophets into blues songs. Their laments are not at all unlike the laments of today's blues and for good reason. The blues has and always will be the cry of humanity, the longing for deliverance from pain and heartache.

The near-primal nature of the blues progression touches our soul like little else can do. Today, there is instruction available that can make almost anyhone a great jazzer, bluegrasser, rocker or country picker. But, a good blues player can only earn that title from wrestling with life itself.

On Clapton's first concert DVD for the Rehab Project, he did a version of Old Love and his guitar solo makes the tears run down my face every time I listen to it. Every pain--the loss of his son, his broken heart, every disapointment in Eric's life flows off of his fingers in that solo and puts me in touch with the struggles of my own hardships and losses.

That is the real blues and why it is so universal. I could sit down and figure out that solo and play it note for note, but because it wouldn't be an extention of my own soul, it wouldn't be the blues.

My heart had to be yanked out of my chest and crushed under the feet of my first wife and then I had to lose my 2nd wife to cancer before the blues made any sense to me and before I could play it. Then it became like a life line to me. I think it is one of God's most precious gifts to mankind when he is in dire straits.

David Doggett · Posted 2 Sep 2005 12:37 pm

I think it is unfortunate that the steel guitar became so stereotyped as a country instrument. I think steel is the greatest blues instrument there is. It can play rhythm, chords, and can play a soulful lead like nothing else. In his autobiography, BB King said he developed his style trying to imitate a steel guitar. Growing up in North Mississippi in the '50s and '60s, I was exposed to about equal parts country, r&B, and rock'n'roll. It's all in my veins, and my heart, and I love to play all of it.

Charles French · From: Ms.

"and can play a soulful lead like nothing else"

as long as someone ain't got a fuzz stompbox hooked up to their gitar.

Donny Hinson · From: Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.

People like and relate to Blues because it's simple. Good sound isn't important because it's more feeling and emotion than substance. You don't have to be in perfect tune. There's no complex theory, no plethora of chords, and no blistering or complex scales required. It sounds more "authentic" on cheap, crappy equipment...this is one type of music where you don't need a new Tele and a re-issue Twin. A beat-up old Danelectro or Kay, and a small Sears amp, will do just fine. If you're playing flat-top, an old Regal or Stella is far preferred to a Martin or a Gibson.

"Emphasize what you ain't got, then you can play blues"

[This message was edited by Donny Hinson on 03 September 2005 at 05:12 AM.]

Dave Mudgett · From: Central Pennsylvania and Gallatin, Tennessee

Yes. The blues are where I started, and are a big part of what I am, and always will be. I like the blues influence in country - which I'm sure some people are annoyed by - provided it doesn't mess with the country feel of the tune. To me, Hank Williams, Jimmie Rodgers, and the Delmore Brothers were blues singers of the first order, but with a different feel than most of the black blues artists of the time. Country singers like George Jones and Conway Twitty have always had a strong blues influence, to my ears. Conway's duet with Sam Moore is a perfect example of what can be, IMO. Guys like Lee Roy Parnell and Mike Henderson are great examples of blues, Nashville-style, IMO. They've closed the gap somewhat with more traditional blues, and with more of a rock twist, this is also reflected in 'modern Nashville country'. As usual, I like some of it, and don't like some.

I take a bit of issue with ideas like " blues is simple", "Good sound isn't important", "it's more feeling and emotion than substance", "You don't have to be in perfect tune", or the implication that, more or less, "anybody can play the blues". Often, "a little knowledge can be a dangerous thing", and if that applies to any field of music, that is blues. I probably hear more 'bad' blues playing than any other style - my opinion.

People like Duke Ellington, Charlie Christian, Charlie Parker, and Wes Montgomery took blues to a high form - OK, we also label them "jazz" - but a lot of it was simply very sophisticated blues.

In music, feeling and emotion are the essence of substance, but I'd go further - I think it is hard to play blues well, and good blues intonation is extremely hard. Of course, some styles of blues playing are intended to be a bit sloppy, but there's nothing haphazard about the pitch of masters like B.B. & Albert King, Muddy Waters, Gatemouth Brown, and many, many others. Blues pitch shouldn't be evaluated in terms of Western scale pitch. Intervals, but especially thirds, fifths, and sevenths are varied heavily, and a good player doesn't do this randomly. The context and feeling one is trying to create set the selection. Listen to many players slavishly copy licks, but never have a clue what's going on pitchwise or feelwise - I hear this all the time.

Really, I don't see how blues is any simpler than country music. In their simplest forms, they are simple 3-chord tunes with a lot of sparseness, but also lots of feeling. This is what most of "the public" relate to in either style. But both have huge jazz- and rock-based extensions where true virtuosos practice their craft.

Finally, I view these two styles as parallel developments in American music that each fed off each other. I don't believe that the styles most of us consider 'blues' or 'country' would have occurred without the other.

I agree with David D. that the steel is a very expressive instrument for blues. We've discussed this, as well as the relationship to the "sacred steel" style, in other threads recently.

Like Webb, I also came through some personal trials through playing - especially blues - and "the real blues" only really begins to make sense with "real-world mileage". Let me say, that I feel exactly the same way about "real country". I think this is part of what country traditionalists are railing about - country, like blues, is music about real people going through hard times, not driving their SUV to a disco party. But we shouldn't chastise most young people for not having "real mileage" yet. It'll come in time.

David Doggett · Posted 3 Sep 2005 9:41 am

It has always struck me that rock'n'roll is for kids; and country and blues are for adults with some mileage and some paid dues. '60s rock and the baby boomers stretched rock a little intellectually and age-wise. But still, the youthfulness within all of us is the heart and soul of rock'n'roll. Blues and country (at least until recently) are about the real adult world.

Playing blues well is just as difficult as playing country well. Novices unwittingly butcher both, and think they are great. But playing either with feeling helps make up for some sloppiness and lack of complexity. As far as the sophistication of the equipment, like with country, an experienced artist can make cheap equipment sound great, and expensive equipment wont help a clumsy novice. A guy like Robert Cray knows good equipment, and sounds like it, as did Stevie Ray Vaughn and other top blues artists. But Hound Dog Taylor did pretty good with the pawn shop stuff.

Webb Kline · From: Orangeville, PA

Mr. Mudgett, as often, we are on the same page. That was well said. We'll have to hook up sometime when I'm visiting out there and solve the world's problems.

And you're right about the age factor. It's not age nearly as much as it is what's happened in the years you've lived. My sons have been through this mess with me and they are both very emotive players in their own right. Not really country or blues players in a traditional sense, but they definitely have that same raw emotional vibe as found in blues or pure country.

My youngest, Abe, is attending Penn State, so maybe you'll hear him sometime. He's more of a singer/songwriter type. Technically not the musician that his brother is, but a lot of emotional depth.

I think when we start stereotyping too much, we miss the real essence of the blues and country more than we preserve same by adhering to strict traditional standards.

I sometimes feel like the Americana genre evolved out of an attempt to strip the blues, country, folk and bluegrass of their segregated categorizations. I guess that's why so much of what we now call Americana appeals to me.

Donny Hinson · From: Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.

Well (Dave and David), I guess we'll have to agree to disagree!

You see, Chet Atkins was a great guitar player, but he couldn't do blues. Look guys, you can't be a perfectionist and know what the blues is about. You're plainly leaning towards more modern R & B and Jazz blues forms, both great musical styles in their own right, but about as far from real blues as the Nashville's Ryman is from a Mississippi log cabin. Real blues is the folk music of the downtrodden. It's the gutteral moan of an old sharecropper flailing on an old $20 oak-bodied Stella guitar. It's elementary, primal, it's basics, it's all the things that modern music isn't. It's like folk art, it's rough, crude, and imperfect, and it touches us somewhere down deep in our soul...but only if we've done some sufferin' along the way.

Clapton and SRV may be great players, but they can't do authentic blues like Leadbelly, Robert Johnson, and Charlie Patton, IMHO.

Dave Mudgett · From: Central Pennsylvania and Gallatin, Tennessee

Good points, David. Yes, the distinctions are blurred these days even more, but have never really been clear cut. Even though what I view as "real blues" and "real country" music have some mileage, or "paid dues" on them, one can party just as hearty to a backgound of these.

In a certain sense, I think the equipment issue is a red herring. I've heard lots of different kinds of music made on all kinds of equipment. I do agree that if one is going for a particular vintage feel, the appropriate period equipment usually does this most easily. This is fine if the goal is to present a "museum performance" of a style of music.

I've played in old-school units - had to have the right look, instruments, and play everything with the old-school feel. For a while, this was cool and educational, but I think it's posible to do this too slavishly and stay too locked in the past. When a musical style ceases to develop, it dies and, even worse, can become a parody of itself.

I think modern blues has been able to morph with with the times, and still maintain a clear identity as "blues". I think part of the reason is that the authentic artists didn't necessarily think they even could cross over to mainstream pop. That difference is cultural. Ironically, people hear that authenticity, and have been joining the bandwagon for decades now. "Real blues" may not be the "flavor of the month", but is more alive than ever now, IMO.

On the other hand, I think Nashville has tried too hard and in a calculated way to cross over over a period of decades, rather than just do something they believe in and let the chips fall where they may. People also latch onto this, and is one of the reasons many people have a negative impression. I absolutely don't think there's anything implicitly more "human" or "soulful" about blues than country. This is, of course, strictly my opinion.

Dave Mudgett · From: Central Pennsylvania and Gallatin, Tennessee

Charles Curtis · Posted 3 Sep 2005 11:46 am

Scotty may still have the cassette by Julian Tharpe, "Take Your Pick"; there is a blues piece on here, "Ode To Billy Jo", that just blows my mind. I don't recall ever hearing anyone else play like this; there are the subtle "blues" mixed with some of the most daring speed picking that I have ever heard in my life. If the tab exist for this or anything close, I want it. This IMO was sheer genious at work.

Bob Smith · From: Allentown, New Jersey, USA

Good point David, fine blues players are indeed few and far between.My personal fav. was the great Albert King. bob

Eric West · From: Portland, Oregon, USA, R.I.P.

Don't do it..

quote:
You can sing a happy song if you're glad;

A protest song if you're sad.

But if you want to play The Blues;

Then son, you gotta learn how to Lose

-David Bromberg-

Winnie'd get a kick out of that..

EJL

David Mason · From: Cambridge, MD, USA

That's funny, I've always thought of Miles Davis as one of the finest blues musicians of all time. Not because of his style of music, he changed that all over the map to fit the times. But - in the late 50's he had Cannonball Adderly and John Coltrane as his sax players, THE hot young bucks of the era. They'd blast away, notes flying everywhere, Coltrane was in his "sheets of sound" period where he was playing scales so fast you'd hear chords, and then - Miles would ease out three notes, the RIGHT three notes, and cut 'em dead. In the late 60's he had John McLaughlin, Keith Jarrett, Wayne Shorter, Chick Corea in his band blasting away, notes all over the place - Miles would play HIS one note, cut 'em all dead. I even saw him in his 80's incarnation with John Scofield and Mike Stern on guitars, two of the best of the post-fusion players, both of them way past that whole G.I.T. note-by-rote thing that descended like a plague on jazz guitar in the 80's. Great solos, people standing and cheering them on (Stern in particular), then - Miles would play his SAME DAMN THREE NOTES - and everybody'd sit back down, stunned into silence. Blues is a feeling?

Earnest Bovine · From: Los Angeles CA USA

What were those 3 notes?

Earnest Bovine · From: Los Angeles CA USA

Legend is that Bix was so loaded when he got to a gig that he passed out after playing just one note. BUT you should have heard that note!

David Mason · From: Cambridge, MD, USA

David Doggett · Posted 4 Sep 2005 10:06 am

3b, 5b, 7b

Barry Blackwood · Posted 4 Sep 2005 3:28 pm

Epitaph on bluesman's headstone - "Well I didn't wake up this mornin ...."

Jack Francis · From: Queen Creek, Arizona, USA

Barry....Good one!

Charlie McDonald · From: out of the blue

To me, Miles has always been the blues.
"Like a child crying in the closet...."--Nat Hentoff

Webb Kline · From: Orangeville, PA

I was feelin' kinda blue last night and pulled out some of my blues CDs--Luther Allison, Sonny Terry, Junior Wells, Albert Collins, Hound Dog Taylor...I played C6 along with them and I think it was some of the best psg playing I've done in a long time. Then I put on an Elmore James CD. When the Sky Is Cryin' came on, I got on my piano and I got the blues. I turned the stereo off and I played non-stop til after midnight.

I was soaked, tired and more fulfilled from playing than I've been in a long time. There really is something about the raw emotion of the blues that does something to my soul that no other genre of music can do. Not that I don't love other music, but sometimes a man's music has to meet him where his heart is and last night, I had the blues. I was the artist and the audience all in one, and it was a great show.

[This message was edited by Webb Kline on 10 September 2005 at 05:55 AM.]

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