IV chord with V root in bass

Greg Vincent · Post by **Greg Vincent** » 22 Sep 2003 9:09 am

Hi folks,

I dig the sound of the IV chord with the V's root in the bass as a sub for the V chord in a V-I resolution.

Should that be considered a V9sus4?

It has a very open, 'poppy' sound.

Have I been listening to my old Wings albums too much?

-GV

chas smith · Post by **chas smith** » 22 Sep 2003 9:30 am

You could think of it as another "4th structure" inversion. If it was an F chord with a G in the base, then the G-C-F is the 4th chord, the A is "color".

Herb Steiner · Post by **Herb Steiner** » 22 Sep 2003 9:37 am

Way pre-dates Wings... it's the 3rd chord in the Beach Boys' "Don't Worry Baby."

I used to consider it a dominant 11th chord, but now agree it's a V9sus4.

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Earnest Bovine · Post by **Earnest Bovine** » 22 Sep 2003 11:28 am

In practice, you would see G11, G9sus4, Dm7/G, and play them all the same. And F/G is almost the same but with no D note, which makes very little difference.

Bobby Lee · Post by **Bobby Lee** » 22 Sep 2003 6:52 pm

If you don't sound the B or the D, how can it be a G anything? I'd call it F/G.

Jeff A. Smith · Post by **Jeff A. Smith** » 22 Sep 2003 7:20 pm

On standard guitar there's a common voicing that everybody would first associate with the designation F/G:

G bass note on 6th string, under a 1-3-5 non-inverted F major triad. <FONT SIZE=1 COLOR="#8e236b"><p align=CENTER>[This message was edited by Jeff A. Smith on 22 September 2003 at 08:24 PM.]</p></FONT>

Mike Sweeney · Post by **Mike Sweeney** » 26 Sep 2003 5:31 am

Here in Nashville most everyone calls that a four over five.

John McGann · Post by **John McGann** » 26 Sep 2003 6:38 am

Bobby Lee- I think it has very much to do with G although not a straight up G triad, obviously... although F/G is correct, your ear perceives the voicing from the root up, which makes is sound like a G7 sus 4 type chord, especially in a V to I progression. You don't hear "F" tonality-wise as much as you hear G. Of course, when you solo over that one, you can draw from the F triad like crazy...

This type of chord was all over the place in mid 70's fusion/pop like Steely Dan, the Crusaders, Lee Ritenour/Larry Carlton etc.

Roger Rettig · Post by **Roger Rettig** » 26 Sep 2003 7:42 am

I've always thought of that sound as an 'eleventh' - that's what I call it, even though we don't always play all the notes that constitute the full chord.

Can't play James Taylor's stuff without it!

RR

Mike Perlowin · Post by **Mike Perlowin** » 26 Sep 2003 4:35 pm

John McCann is correct. It may not have the botes of a G triad, but the EAR perceives it as a G suspended 4.

BTW, John is a VERY hot guitar and mandolin player. He sent me a tape a few years ago that blew me away.

David Nichols · Post by **David Nichols** » 27 Sep 2003 7:18 pm

It's a V chord harmonically. Of course, practically, it's all the above

basilh · Post by **basilh** » 30 Sep 2003 4:24 pm

Over here it's known as a Four over Five.
Baz