The Steel Guitar Forum

I just received an email from another forumite talking about my start in steel and if I was inspired by today's country. Well I've been reading various threads on this forum and there seems to be a strong disdain for modern country. I'm not going to defend or condemn it, but what is it that no one likes? Remember, I've only been listening for about 4 years, so I don't know the history of country that well.

My impression is that some folks want country to stay in a time capsule and never change. I grew listening to '70s rock and I know today's rock is nothing like what I listened to (and actually is part of the reason I switched to country). But my attitude is that things change and as long as it's for the better then I'm fine with it. I do know that there is some crass commercialism out there and I don't like that as much as the next person.

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Ron Plichta, former headbanger and PSG player in training.

MSA Classic S-10
Fender '62 Reissue Stratocaster
Fender Telecaster
Paul Reed Smith CE24 Maple Top
Rivera R100

There's nothing wrong with it, per se. It's just that not everybody likes exactly the same type of music -- even though our likes may overlap to a large extent.

What most seem to protest is that the new stuff somehow isn't "country". And that it, therefore, needs a new name, I guess.

Deep down, though, I think many don't like the fact that their favorite music is being displaced by the newer stuff. Even if the new stuff were given a different name, the old "traditional" stuff would still be getting less airplay today than it did back then.

I don't like a lot of what is played today (as well as a lot of stuff from yesteryear), either. All I can really do, though, is buy the CD's I like, call in the songs I like, and support the artists I like.

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The Unofficial Photographer of The Wilkinsons

There would be nothing wrong with the so called modern Country if it in fact was a Country product not a rock oriented production. Can you Imagine a Barroom band trying to do some of the things out now?

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CJC

Just My opinion. I started playing country music in the late 50's. In the old days, bands first played the beat, then the chord progression, then the MELODY. I think the biggest difference was the melody. Todays music emphasizes licks, not melody. (Not that that is a bad thing). Another factor: the backing instruments, whether steel or lead guitar, do not get to play anything but fills. There are very few turn arounds played. Maybe I'm nuts, but when is the last time you could hum what the steel or lead guitar or fiddle played? Or most of the songs themselves. Yet, everyone can hum Release me. I think that is the biggest reason for the staying power of some of the old tunes. Disclaimer ( I am not against todays music, I just personally prefer the old.)

I am one of the "traditionalists". There's nothing wrong with a lot of the new music, just it should have a label other than "country". It is not "country" it is more pop or rock oriented but marketed as "country". For someone in their teens or twenties (and maybe more) the current music is very palatable. Many in that age group would not be listening to the music if it was more traditional.

This is a subject that you could write a doctoral thesis on! I will keep it short.

Today's country artist seem to me to be VERY "surface" in their presentation of country music. The classic country artists sound a lot more real and sincere to me.

The production today is just so "gawdy" it is really stupid/unnessary. Fiddles playing rock guitar licks, drums roaring in the mix with triggered/sampled snare sounds just like rap, female vocalists singing the same trite octave jumps like their pop counterparts and nothing worse that hearing white girls singing this "plastic" soul stuff that the black soul/R@B girls do effortlessly. The male vocalist really have a tough row to hoe. No way they can vault over the vocal sounds of classic country artist like George Jones, Hank Williams, Conway, and the list goes on and on. These new guys sound like parodies of singers doing parodies of country singers.

Bad thing about all this if you are a classic country enthusiast----classic country will NEVER come back. The people who played it are gone, the artist who sang/lived it are gone,the engineers and equipment they recorded it on is gone, the audience who loved it and supported it is gone, the general atmosphere of society that would appreciate something so simple and yet so emotionally deep is gone----it's all gone.

"Modern" country is little more than the rubble of the rock music industry congregating in Nashville and producing the same garbage they did in LA after they were blasted out of the top 40 by rap several years ago.

Down from soap box.

Bill I don't know too much about the old artist being gone.Hag sounded pretty darn good last night on Letterman in his abreviated spot.George Jones had one of the New England Fair's (The Big E) biggest weekend crowds for his shows Last week...I am informed there was no room to walk around the fair and parking got as high as 10 bucks a mile away. Doesn't sound like an unwanted music too me.

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CJC

<SMALL>There would be nothing wrong with the so called modern Country if it in fact was a Country product</SMALL>

That's the point. It's a rock/pop product with country instruments.

Quote from RJP:
I grew listening to '70s rock and I know today's rock is nothing like what I listened to (and actually is part of the reason I switched to country).

I think that is what is wrong with Modern Country. It appeals to the people who used to be into 70's and 80's Rock because it IS like 70's and 80's Rock.
So tell me, I grew up on REAL country music, now that Country ain't Country, where am I supposed to go to hear the music I love?

This cr@p they call Country nowadays pi$$es me off!
BTW, I'm not some old cronie that still lives in the past and can't accept changes. I'm 33 years old and most of the music I love was written and performed before I was born.



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Dave Alfstad
Indianola, Iowa

<SMALL>I think that is what is wrong with Modern Country. It appeals to the people who used to be into 70's and 80's Rock because it IS like 70's and 80's Rock.</SMALL>

I can certainly tell the difference between today's country music and rock from the 70's and 80's. So can my wife.

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The Unofficial Photographer of The Wilkinsons

What bothers me the most about much of the music played on the "Modern Country," "(Hot) New Country," etc., radio stations is the "lowest common denominator" syndrome. Real hardcore country music, with lots of fiddle and pedal steel, themes of unrequited or lost love, drinking, etc. and "hicky" singing, does not appeal to a lot of people. So, in order to appeal to a wider audience, producers either replace PSG and fiddle with keyboards and string arrangements or mix them way in the background. They also tend to de-emphasize all the instruments - just fills or maybe a turnaround, rarely a full verse solo. There's "something for everyone" - a little taste of country, some rock, some "easy listening," etc. If you're driving across country, radio-station hopping and you hear that stuff, you don't know whether you've got a "country" station, an "adult contemporary" station or what. It's the same thing NBC did with the Olympics, emphasizing the "human stories" at the expense of the actual competition.

The producers are trying to maximize their sales, and you can't blame them for that. But I really hate that music, so I NEVER listen to country radio, except an AM station around here that calls itself "Classic Country" or s.t. like that and does play some of the older stuff.

However, the kind of country that I like is still out there. Some of the HNC artists put one or two cuts on their albums that really sound like country music. I have spent hundreds of dollars on tapes and CDs that I listen to, record off one or two cuts and give away. Once in a while I find an artist, like Ed Burleson, who does mostly "my kind of country." Nowadays, you can listen to cuts from albums via the Web at Amazon, CDNow, etc., so you can get some idea of what you're going to get.

I think one of the great things about this forum is that we can share info about what's out there and help each other find music that we like.
Cheers,
Alan Shank

I'm with Jack here. The "new stuff" is closer to pop-rock than it is to country.<FONT SIZE=1 COLOR="#8e236b"><p align=CENTER>[This message was edited by Donny Hinson on 15 October 2000 at 08:41 AM.]</p></FONT>

I've enjoyed what's been written so far. Let me add another twist to the debate. Is today's country better or worse than the Urban Cowboy era of country?

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Ron Plichta, former headbanger and PSG player in training.

MSA Classic S-10
Fender '62 Reissue Stratocaster
Fender Telecaster
Paul Reed Smith CE24 Maple Top
Rivera R100

<SMALL>Artists like Lone Star, Shania, and LeAnn Rimes play good music, it's just that it's NOT really "Country</SMALL>

Actually, I always felt Shania Twain got a bad rap. A lot of her first CD had very strong country influences, songs like "Any Man Of Mine", and "Whose Bed Have Your Boots Been Under" have country-rock and shuffle beats with some interesting arrangement flourishes. When was the last time Martina McBride or Reba McIntire sang anything resembling a country styling. But they get a free pass, and Shania is criticized. Oh well.

Alan Shank, with whom I spent many happy hours playing bluegrass music back in the 1960's, and trust me knows what country music is, nailed it for me with his post. Thanks Al!



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Herb's Steel Guitar Homesite

<SMALL>Let me add another twist to the debate. Is today's country better or worse than the Urban Cowboy era of country?</SMALL>

I won't say better or worse. I'd say that the stuff by Johnny Lee and Mickey Gilley sounds more country than some of the music out there today (eg, Alecia Elliot). But other music (eg, Brad Paisley) is more country than them.

Overall? I'd have to think about it. I'd probably say there's more pop influence today than there was back then.

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The Unofficial Photographer of The Wilkinsons

When comparing the "NCS" with "Traditional Country," the one defining element missing is heart/soul. Most of the NCS stars are just pretty faces (men included) with a fair voice (there are exceptions of course) that are overly produced with marketing prospects other than country in mind. I don't think anyone that is musically involved is narrow minded enough to think that music doesn't change, but please give us credit for enough intelligence to recognize the real thing from the overproduced, plastic, generic stuff that has been, and still is being shoved down our throats. I have been there, done that, and have the bad health to prove it.

And now Ladies and Gentleman, on with the show....

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kd...and the beat goes on...

Donny, I thought the "S" in NCS meant something else.

<SMALL>Can you Imagine a Barroom band trying to do some of the things out now? </SMALL>

Well Joe, just replace that d@mn steel guitar with a synthesizer or two. Oh, wait. That's already happening.



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Carter D10 8p/10k
Richard Sinkler BS, www.sinkler.com

Alan, Kenny, and David...all good posts. Same for Jim Bob, Jack, and Bill. These guys realize, and express what many of us feel.

<FONT SIZE=1 COLOR="#8e236b"><p align=CENTER>[This message was edited by Donny Hinson on 15 October 2000 at 08:44 AM.]</p></FONT>

I think I like both-but the problem here that annoys people, and rightfully so, is that the older stuff they like is getting shoved out of the way, and it's just not on the air much anymore. The Classic Country stations play a token amount, but I don't hear much of what I'd call real country on those stations either. And here's where Country and Rock differ-

Rock is MUCH more deferential to it's roots. All it's young stars still know who Chuck Berry and Bill Haley and Fats Domino and Bo Diddley are. They have their records and know all their riffs. Still use 'em. The legends receive HEAVY exposure at awards shows. And there are tons of Classic Rock stations that play the REAL thing, all the time. LOTS of 50's stuff still hittin' the airwaves. New R & B singers constantly talk about early motown and the Spector sound.

Country's roots are being held on to by a pretty small crowd. And the Classic Country stations are playing mostly 70's stuff-Urban Cowboy-and calling THAT Old School, which it ain't. I still maintain there's more steel in the the NCS tunes than there is on the so called Classic tunes.(they were in love with the Yamaha) You very rarely hear any 50's country on the classic stations, and the legends are almost NEVER featured at the awards shows, except when they get a lifetime acheivement award-Country's kind way of asking you to please croak.

Seems like the crowd that's got a reputation for not respecting their elders could teach their elders a thing or two about respecting your elders! At least musically.

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Fulawka D-10 9&5
Better Late than Never!
www.johnbarnold.com/pedalsteel

Very good post, JB. Very good.

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Herb's Steel Guitar Homesite

I like it too.

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ Enough said.