Is this Bb11 the 1 or the 5?

[Andrew Frost]

This is not an urgent matter....

I am enjoying the current shoal of discussions about the sus11 chords...
I always call the V11 suspension sound, the "LA 5" chord because I heard that years ago and it just stuck.

Here's a great example of that classic voicing, right at the top of the verses/intro, over and over, Bb11 to Bb...

Ace, "How Long (Has This Been Going On)?"

I love this tune and play it a lot on gigs. I've always conceptualized the opening chords as being the key centre, ie, Bb.
But if you factor in the chorus, ( Cm7, Gm7, Fm7), The whole song lands square on Eb major, even though Eb is never played.

Its one of those tunes that if you call the correct key, it will likely do more damage than good.
Not unlike "Dreams" by Fleetwood Mac, which is in C, but C is never played.

Anyway, this is neither here nor there, per se.
I just get a kick out of this stuff, and am out of commission with covid at present so am analyzing the musical minutae of things more than usual perhaps.

https://youtu.be/Vo_GMMLULXw

[Ian Rae]

It's in 3 flats for sure and yes, Eb never actually appears.

The Bb11 is a subdominant Ab over a Bb pedal, so it functions as a IV chord, so when the chorus comes along after all those IVs and Vs we're fully expecting Eb. What we get is a transition via G major into the relative minor of C.

To me, this song is in C minor.

[Andrew Frost]

Yes Ian, good summary. Cm indeed. I think that Bb resolution to Cm is what the kids are calling a deceptive cadence these days.
The G7/B passing chord might prevent such labeling though. I honestly don't know.
It sure works though.

[Ian Rae]

The proper term for a Bb followed not by Eb but by Cm is "interrupted cadence". That doesn't apply here because of the intervening G chord which irons out the bump.