The Steel Guitar Forum

I've just acquired a National style 2 squareneck, serial 1493, so early 30's I guess.This is my first resonate of any kind and I am slowly getting acquainted with it.



It's strung and tuned open G low bass and once I am home with it I will re-string and tune to A high bass. In preparation for that I'm taking a close look at the tuners, noting one is slightly damaged and several buttons have taken on the colour of the case's lining. I don't think this instrument has been re-strung in a while and I'm wondering if it may be prudent to replace the tuners in case any break.

So two questions:

• Am I being overly cautious and should place more trust in 90 year old parts?
  
  Can one buy suitable replacements?

\paul

Stew-Mac has reproductions of those tuners.
https://www.stewmac.com/parts-and-hardw ... eur-de-lis

I bought a set a couple years ago for my style 1 because the buttons are really misshapen and I was worried that they might start to crumble. I never ended up installing the new tuners because the buttons are too white and new looking, but I kept them in case I ever need them. The old ones seem to work fine (they are old Waverlys), I just put a drop of oil on the gears when I change strings.



Yours don't look too bad. One of the posts looks a little bent but it might just be the photo. It looks like there's some gunk in the gears, so I'd just clean them up and I think they'll be fine. I'd only replace them as a last resort.

Enjoy your new guitar, I sure like mine!

Bert

Looks like a beauty! I’d love to hear it!

Your tuners look fine.I don’t think that you will have any issues with them.

I wouldn't fix it if it ain't broke but that fourth string tuner looks questionable. I'd buy a set of Stew-Mac's replacements and put it in the case.

Lovely guitar. It's hard to take a picture of an engraved guitar with all the background reflection, isn't it?

Most tuner buttons of that vintage are cellulose nitrate/camphor mix called ivoroid. Celloulose nitrate is the same stuff as single base smokeless powder and naval gun cotton. The real enemy there is heat. Keep 'em cool and they should last.

Robert B Murphy wrote:I wouldn't fix it if it ain't broke but that fourth string tuner looks questionable. I'd buy a set of Stew-Mac's replacements and put it in the case.

Which tuner do you consider to be the “fourth string tuner”? Are you speaking of what would be the “G” string on a standard tuned guitar (the bent tuner in the photo)? If so, it probably works fine and won’t be an issue. I’ve had too many vintage guitars to count with bent tuners. I never had any issues.

I would personally take the tuners apart and clean all of the grease and gunk out of them. People used to use grease or petroleum jelly to lubricate tuners. Unfortunately, both just trap dirt. I would clean the tuners. Then, I’d lubricate them with a little bit of Teflon. Something like Tri-Flow.

Ryan, you're right, I got turned around: third string tuner.

I too have many instruments from the era and have had a few failures usually from the wear between the worm and crown reducing the tooth to tooth contact area which has to bear the force the whole tooth once took. Cleaning and greaseless lubrication is a good idea but if the gear metal is gone, it's gone.

I think the shaft is a little bent but when it hit whatever it did it the post gave a little too. In the mean time it ain't broke.

This may be heresy but if I were going to replace a set on mine, I'd turn the tuners up. They don't look as cool but you can correct a pitch problem while you're playing.

That's a stone cold beauty! Congratulations, those tuners look totally useable to me and if a button happened to crumble, i would replace just that one and keep playing.

Well, I cleaned the tuners diligently and removed a lot of "gunk" from the grooves and elsewhere. Then I added a drop of oil to each tuner and they all work wonderfully. Although I did avoid using a plastic string winder to avoid stress on the buttons.

Because it was tuned G lo-bass for so long, I was cautious and put lighter than normal strings for A hi-bass (13-40) and the tone is noticeably much thinner! Therefore I shall be brave and change for a heavier set, 16-47 as Sebastian Müller uses.

Tonally, compared to my beat-up converted acoustic, the National is hi-fi! Including how it exposes my mistakes Just getting used to the volume it produces is a learning curve. But I am very pleased with it and seem to be ignoring my other babies!

Thanks for all your advice!

\ paul