The Steel Guitar Forum

Hello everyone. I've been learning and practicing a bit more recently (still not enough ) and focusing on trying to learn whole instrumental steel songs, rather than the noodling in different chord positions that I usually like to do.

I love to learn a new song from TAB (check out Doug Beumier's "60 poular melodies" for E9th book - It's great!)
and focus on it until I can play it all the way through, but the problem comes when trying to remember the song the next day, or week. When I learn a few different songs, it all gets mixed up even further.

How does a steel player playing a dozen songs in a row at one of those steel conventions remember all the intricate parts so well? Can he improvise them all on the spot? Does he play all the songs every day for a year prior the steel show? Does he have a secretly hidden iPad Tablet attached to the back apron of his steel guitar that flashes animated TABs in real time along to the music?

I know different people have different abilities to remember, but there must be some tips players who know lots of songs can share on how they learn and remember them all. What's the maximum amount of songs you could play right now on the spot? Do you use any chord charts when playing live to help you remember parts? How long do you spend on each song? I find I get a bit tired of playing the same song too many times...but if I move on to a different one, I forget the first.

Do I have to play Danny Boy everyday if I want to remember how to play it a month from now?

This is the process I use to learn complete new PSG instrumental songs in TAB:

Step One - Listen to the song until it has really penetrated the heart and the rock hard noggin.

Step Two - Bring the song into Song Surgeon and cut it up into short loops based on each phrase.

Step Three - Highlight the TAB to match the loops.

Step Four - Begin memorizing the first loop by playing along at say, 50% speed until smooth at that speed.

Step Five - Move on to the next loop and repeat Step Four.

Step Six - Play through all loops up to the "Other Instrument" break or middle of the song and bring it up to 90% speed.

Step Seven - Bring in the BakTrak and play over that for the first half of the song.

Step Eight - Repeat Steps Four through Seven for the last half of the song.

Step Eight - Polish up all rough spots and play the heck out of it against the BakTrak for the next month.

Step Nine - Re-learn all the other songs I memorized before, but forgot how to play, while I was learning this song! Smile

A well known player told me once that to really get to the point where you can "watch yourself play the instrumental," he recommended that I play it 100 times...

The good news is that the "relearn all the other songs" step really helps, especially if you don't go back to the TAB. Instead, try to recall the song using the muscle memory you developed.

How does everybody else do it?

Jacek Jakubek wrote:How does a steel player playing a dozen songs in a row at one of those steel conventions remember all the intricate parts so well? Can he improvise them all on the spot? Does he play all the songs every day for a year prior the steel show? Does he have a secretly hidden iPad Tablet attached to the back apron of his steel guitar that flashes animated TABs in real time along to the music?

All of the above. For gigs I aim to internalise everything. For songs I'm less familiar with I have a tablet with charts on it. I don't hide it. Otherwise I rely on the experience I've gained so far to make something up if I have to.

I find writing out a chord chart helps immensely to commit the song to memory (both chords and number system). I rarely even need to reference the chart after writing it, the act of writing it alone is enough to commit it to memory. Then in six months or whatever when I haven’t played it for a while, a quick glance at the chart will bring it all back quickly.

As far as memorizing riffs, I think knowing which chords you’re outlining will make it easier to remember, though nothing beats playing it over and over and over to commit it to muscle memory.

50 years full time onstage (not steel) tells me don't worry too much about playing something different as long as the emotional impact of the song stays the same.

I've only played two or three steel shows. On those, familiar songs were on my list. I had played the songs many times so I pretty much had them down. As they were "standards" that almost everyone knows and has played there was no need for charts, just a list of songs and keys. "KISS" principle.

I find TAB can hinder me. If I learn complete song from TAB then I seem to need the TAB to play it. If I just learn by ear listening to the song and/or get a certain lick from TAB then I can take that and play the song without any TAB or chord or number chart.

This after playing in bands since 1959 and with Rhythm/Lead Guitar/Bass/Pedal Steel. When I started in country bands, no one used TAB or chord charts, everything mostly was by ear. Singers didn't have song word sheets, they learned the song to memory - in fact it was considered amateurish to sing with a lyric sheet. Old-timers will mostly agree with me. (One year of my Bass playing was in a New Orleans style Dixieland band, not country).

Colin is right about writing things down helping you to member them. It's a good exam revision technique but why does it work?

Like Jack, I find tab a bit limiting. For one thing it lacks basic elements like pitch and rhythm, so it only tells you how to play something you already know by ear.
In a live situation some scribbled chords are way more use.

Jacek,What works for me is a have a CD of all of my so vs a d play it in my car's CD player for weeks before the show,Hopefully There will be time for me to send some tunes to the folks who will be backing me up...I'm not a reader,A friend wrote some charts for me a while ago but it's almost time to get some especially charts that I can get together for the show"whenever that will be"I try to get a half hours worth of tunes including jokes.Above all have fun!

Most of them, like Paul Franklin, Lloyd Green, Tommy White and the like know the intervals and chord positions so well they just have instant recall. If your learning with tablature, you'll be way ahead of the game if you'll slow down and learn each phrase AND WHY YOUR PLAYING IT. Every phrase on that tab is related to an interval associated with the chords. So basically, learn the guitar instead of focusing on songs and you'll understand how those guys can play those songs the way they do.


BTW: Paul teaches intervals and diatonic harmonies. Then he uses the song you mentioned, Danny Boy and he challenged his students to use those concepts to make the song your own. If you understand that basic concept, you'll be able to play that song at any minute because you have the concepts used to play it stored in you mind.

Bouncing off of what James just said...
It may not be a memory issue at all. Maybe the songs you are trying to play are just too complicated for your current level of playing ability. You don’t start the football season with the Super Bowl. Learning a dozen simpler songs and playing them in different keys and registers might be a more worthy pursuit than struggling with Danny Boy in the same key over and over.

I was visiting a friend of mine who is an exceptional pedal steel player years ago and he was playing an old Ray Price song to some tracks and made a little mistake. Afterwards, he chuckled and said, "I forgot the words". Without realizing it he had taught me a very valuable lesson that day! Also, I find that the notes to the melody lines are found in the chord positions of the various chords that are being played. Remember the chord positions that you are using to play the melody of the song and that will serve as your road map to recall the melody.

Everyone is different, and learns at different rates. But there comes a point in everyone's learning when you have to stop relying on tab! Tab is a crutch, for while it allows you to learn things very accurately at the beginning, relying on it after the initial "learn" allows your brain to get lazy. After a year, or two...or three, you should be hearing and remembering those songs exactly in your head, and you should be able to play them from memory. Keeping in mind that the vast majority of songs we play are simple melodies, after some years of playing you should be able to play most of them.

After playing almost 60 years, I'm still a hacker at this. Partly because I've seldom had to rely on the money, and partly because there were many other things I enjoyed doing just as much. And personally, I've had to learn a lot of songs. But there are literally thousands of songs that I've heard that are stuck in my memory, but have never played. (Mostly, that stuff that was playing on the radio when I was a teenager.) Given the proper backing, I wouldn't hesitate to play them now; with little or no practice time.

It's gratifying when you reach the point of hearing something in your head, and being able to just play it. That should the the goal of all of us!

Fred, Bob and Donny are spot on. I wanted to add that Jim Palenscar carries a tablature program that Reece Anderson developed called Smart Tab. It takes a song (your choice from the list) and breaks it down intk sections. After a while, you'll realize those ",sections" are chord/scale positions. It details the "licks" and why they are executed and the chord association. It demonstrates various ways to play the same song based on the chord structure. It's a very good way to learn the guitar. I'm not knocking tab here at all, it has its place in the learning journey but please don't become dependent on it. Reece shared the smart tab for Crazy Arms with me many years ago. When I finally applied myself to STUDY the lesson, it was a serious eye opener. What I'm trying to stress is, if you enjoy tab, why not get everything there is available in it and learn more than just a song. Learn to be your own player.

Hi Jacek, I agree with Donny and a few others here. In my opinion, TAB is only useful if you can't figure out a particular piece yourself. Memorization is key. You should develop your ears by trying to figure out parts by listening deep to what's happening. Is that string being raised by a pedal/knee lever or is the bar moving? Listen to the timbre of the notes. Is it on strings 3 & 5 or on strings 4 & 6? Are there 2 notes contained in the chord or 3? Where it moves to next will sometimes tell you where a passage started. Is this process hard, tedious and slow? Of course it is! lol But, by doing this, you'll understand the instrument and music more and become a better player in the end, all while retaining the information. None of the players that play at the level that I love(Franklin, White, Johnson, Green) use TAB in real time while they play. They've learned and memorized positions and parts and how it works in music. As a teacher myself, I now teach strictly through video instruction. When I used TAB to teach, I had students who played for years that still struggled. Good luck in your quest.

I love to learn a new song from TAB (check out Doug Beumier's "60 poular melodies" for E9th book - It's great!)
and focus on it until I can play it all the way through, but the problem comes when trying to remember the song the next day, or week. When I learn a few different songs, it all gets mixed up even further

Here's how I look at it*:

If I can't remember it, then I don't really know it. I may have learned to play it all the way through, but I have not studied it, I have not internalized it, it is not committed to my muscle memory.

- All songs are chord progressions.
- All melodies are intervals, mainly chord tones and extensions.

Learn your way around chord progressions and memorize the location of all of the intervals on your instrument.

Learn to recognize what any note sounds like over any given chord type. That is the "source code".

All licks, melodies, harmonies, songs/arrangements are just examples of the author's choice of organizing that info. They can be as simple or complex as the author (or the interpreter) wants them to be.

Basic musical knowledge and understanding is fundamental. It does not change, it's not trendy, it knows no genre or style. Music is simple math with minimal variables that can be studied and understood in a couple of weeks or months, depending on your needs. If I need to understand more, I can study more.

Once you learn the language, you can start looking at songs as simply "organized sets of variables". With mindful study, you begin to recognize the techniques that composers use: patterns and cliches and "best practices". By putting the work in to get the mechanics and math mastered, you can spend the bulk of your practice time working on your interpretation and expression skills, not on memorizing what note/chord comes next.

To use an (imperfect) Language analogy: Intervals are letters, chords are words, progressions are sentences, songs are paragraphs, genres/styles are slang/grammar, your repertoire is a book.

As Hawkeye Pierce jokingly said on the TV show M*A*S*H: "I just read the dictionary...all the other books are in there."

Interested musicians can find many sources of this information online. This recent 30 minute Rick Beato video is one good option Simple Music Theory Concepts EVERYONE Should Know

*Just my observations on what works for me.

I read where Bobbe Seymour was asked to go on tour with a group that he had done studio work with. They wanted him to reproduce his studio work verbatim. He couldn't do it. He laid down what was wanted in the moment, and then moved on to the next project. The band hired a player who could duplicate Bobbe's licks verbatim. Even the greats don't play it exactly the same every time, and some actually prefer not too. What they do have is both the knowledge and experience to play what fits the moment. Learning licks and solos is good until you can't remember, or change keys, or you don't have the chart. If you know how to move around the guitar, know your tunes, play the melody, you can usually get pretty close.

I love to learn a new song from TAB ... ... I find I get a bit tired of playing the same song too many times...but if I move on to a different one, I forget the first

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I think repetition is key. Both in listening and playing. I'm sure everyone gets tired of practicing the same thing over and over until it's right and set into memory. But what is the alternative? I don't see one. I see learning new music as a fairly intense activity. Active learning, not passive.

I find tab mostly useful for figuring out a part that is not obvious when I need to get something together in a hurry. For me, playing through something purely via tab or any other tool a few times is nowhere near enough to let it sink into the long-term memory. If it's a classic type of tune, I try to find a version I really like and listen to it enough to drive everybody else in my house insane. I don't necessarily try to copy the playing, but instead try to get inside the feel of the song. But listening to a bunch of different versions can be very illuminating.

Does he have a secretly hidden iPad Tablet attached to the back apron of his steel guitar that flashes animated TABs in real time along to the music? ... Do you use any chord charts when playing live to help you remember parts?

For gigs, I do have an android tablet that I sometimes attach to the right-rear leg of a pedal steel if I have a lot of new material or if I'm working with someone whose material I'm not familiar with. No tab - if I had to rely on tab in a band situation, I'd be sunk. I generally just have an outline of the song structure. But if there are tunes I just don't know, I make a real condensed number chart for those ones.

But at some point in the evolution of learning a song or group of songs, I think it is essential to get "off the page".

It may very well be a lifelong journey. I wouldn't worry about it. Its perhaps different for everyone.

SEAT TIME and Repetition , as Dave says above.

For me its not songs, but rather which intro goes with which song , as so many are so similar.

If I'm having a moment sometimes I just flat out ask one of the other members to HUM me the intro. Jeff Newman used to tell us , if in doubt just play the tag line of the last vocal line . It may not be the exact correct Steel intro but it will be correct.

Seat time and repetition.

Thanks for you input guys. Some good tips here.

I notice many people say TAB is a bit of a crutch. That's probably true because when I learned a couple of songs from watching video instead of TAB, I could remember these songs better. Figuring out parts by yourself is probably very useful. But figuring out someone's steel parts is very tedious and difficult for me. Also, when learning from TAB, I learn positions and grips that I would not have thought of myself, and then can apply these new positions to my own playing.

I plan on learning a bunch of steel instrumentals, maybe 20-30 to have in my repertoire. The quickest way to do this is with TAB. Once a song is learned, I guess the next thing is to just play the heck out of it over, and over, however longs it takes, occasionally checking back with the TAB when necessary.

I can play Danny Boy everyday until I die because it's such a great tune. I'm going to have to learn songs I really like because if you don't like the song enough, you may not want to play it enough times to learn it well.

Donny Hinson wrote:It's gratifying when you reach the point of hearing something in your head, and being able to just play it. That should the the goal of all of us!

Agreed, This is the ultimate goal!