The Steel Guitar Forum

Hi all,

I'm primarily a guitarist and mandolin player. I bought a Magnatone lap steel guitar a few years ago when I became obsessed with Hawaiian and Hawaiian-influenced music. I still love that style, but I never quite put in the level of music theory work on the instrument as I have with something like standard-tuning guitar, so my lap steel has "lapsed" a bit if you will. I play various electric guitars and a roundneck resonator in open tunings with a slide, so there are certain aspects of steel technique that I have an overlap with (others, not so much).

At any rate, a friend offered me a gig opportunity with a country band, and the idea was floated of me sitting in with them for a couple tunes on lap steel. It's a pretty casual affair, but I'd still like to make a good impression. So I'm wondering -- if I work hard -- if it's possible for me to cop some (basic) pedal steel country sounds out of my lap steel.

Does this seem doable, to a degree at least? Or am I kidding myself and should just take the plunge on a console/pedal steel and give up all social engagements for the next...decade or so?

I'm certainly not opposed to pursuing pedal steel at some point, but there's no chance of me buying and developing any sort of usable skills in time for a gig in a few months. So in the meantime, with a volume pedal, a lot of listening to recordings, and a serious study of where to find choice doublestops, could a lap steel get me something at least adjacent to a country sound? Any insight would be most appreciated!

That’s exactly how I got started on pedals. I was invited to play lap, it really worked out for everyone, I played lap until I wanted more and got a pedal. I felt that lots of slants into straight bars gave the most pedal like sound. Especially forward slants to and from straight bars sounded good to me. I did a lot of roots and 3rds.

I don't see any problem with it. I get a lot of music from 6 string C6 CEGACE. Look at some slants and maybe even behind the bar string pulls/bends. I've heard some interesting stuff using that method.

I don't see any problem with it. I get a lot of music from 6 string C6 CEGACE. Look at some slants and maybe even behind the bar string pulls/bends. I've heard some interesting stuff using that method.

If you want a pedal steel guitar sound it takes a pedal steel to get that sound.

Yes, it is possible to some degree but in all honestly it takes a great deal of skill to get there convincingly. However, trial by fire is often the best way of finding out!

You could get something like those Duesenberg hand pedals to get those pedal steel type sounds. Number of youtube videos from forum members showing how to get pedal steel sounds for a 6 string lap steel with benders.

Here is Mike 'Slo-Mo' Brenner' giving a tutorial https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZD3vkVTIF0Y

Years ago I tried the Bigsby palm pedal somewhat like the Duesenberg. I found it less than satisfactory. I then decided if I were ever to attempt that again I would use something like the MSA pull system. I am not sure either system is available today.

C6th non/pedal steel worked well for Hank Williams and many others...... and you can’t get more country than that.

Tony Glassman wrote:C6th non/pedal steel worked well for Hank Williams and many others...... and you can’t get more country than that.

Yeah. I’d focus your efforts on getting authentic C6 lap steel sounds from your C6 lap steel rather than on making it sound like something else. It can and should fit in great with a country band. I did it for years, only recently finally making the switch to PSG.

Watch and study everything you can from Don Helms, JB and the other country lap Steelers. There’s a lifetime’s worth of country music available in those 6 (or 8 ) strings.

There is very little pedal steel on modern country records as we all know and even less C6 steel guitar. That's one reason there are so many single neck guitars out there.

Thanks for weighing in, everyone. A lot of great advice here. I think Andy is right about focusing on getting authentic C6 lap steel sounds rather than trying to make my lap steel sound like an instrument it's not. So I suppose a rephrasing of my original post's question would be "can I play C6 lap steel in a country band without sounding out of place, and if so, how?" or "can I use C6 lap steel to occupy a similar sonic space in a country band that a pedal steel would normally take up" rather than trying to cop specific pedal steel licks/tricks/sounds.

"can I play C6 lap steel in a country band without sounding out of place, and if so, how?"

Bar slants will help. Here's a video of a Country tune I played on C6 lap steel almost 10 years ago ---> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GO2Tf8KLJ14

A lot of signature E9 pedal steel sounds are not available on C6 though, like those pretty scale patterns on strings 1, 2, 3, 4 (on pedal steel).

I would explore volume pedal usage to add sustain and let you “bloom” the notes a bit. Simple two note harmonized lines sliding into and out of slants being will work well to mimic the “cry” of pedal steel but it won’t sound right unless it’s got some volume pedal to add sustain. I think great volume pedal technique is responsible for a lot more of the pedal steel sound than people give it credit. Lots of threads on volume pedal technique that could apply to lap steel.

Play the melody, forget licks and copying techniques .

Add harmonies when possible.

One problem I have encountered with C6th is sounding Western Swingish or Hawaiian even when deliberately avoiding the 6th tones of the tuning. I guess this is due to sympathetic vibration. I wound up tuning my 6ths up one semi-tone to a dominant 7th to avoid the over ring. One can always tune back down when the 6th sound is needed. I later got a double neck guitar, problem solved.

Tom Keller wrote:One problem I have encountered with C6th is sounding Western Swingish or Hawaiian even when deliberately avoiding the 6th tones of the tuning. I guess this is due to sympathetic vibration. I wound up tuning my 6ths up one semi-tone to a dominant 7th to avoid the over ring. One can always tune back down when the 6th sound is needed. I later got a double neck guitar, problem solved.

Haha yes, I've encountered this as well! I think you're right about it stemming from sympathetic vibration. I'll have to try out your retuning suggestion.

Doug Beaumier wrote: Bar slants will help. Here's a video of a Country tune I played on C6 lap steel almost 10 years ago ---> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GO2Tf8KLJ14

Great video, Doug! I got a lot of ideas watching that.

I agree with what others have said about not trying to copy the pedal guitar. Treat it as an instrument in its own right same as fiddle, dobro, banjo etc.

Rob, what kind of country does this band play? Are we talking older country or newer country?

Great video, Doug! I got a lot of ideas watching that.

Thanks Rob! I'm glad you liked it.

Doug Beaumier wrote:

Great video, Doug! I got a lot of ideas watching that.

Thanks Rob! I'm glad you liked it.

I think I figured out that cool intro you did...now if I could just play that last backward/forward slant without it sounding like a dying cat, I'll be happy.

That looks right, although it's been a long time, so I'd have to sit down with the lap steel and go over it again. That slant is sometimes called an X-slant. As I remember, this slant is a V7 chord to a I chord. Not full chords, just two notes from each chord.

Speaking of Country on C6, check out my lap steel speedpicking tab and audio on my blog ---> http://playsteelguitar.com/c6-lap-steel ... edpicking/ There is a pdf of the tablature.

I'll just leave this here. Watch the master and learn. If you're not inspired then you probably don't even know country music.

https://youtu.be/OfkSI5bpbzY