New Zirconia Bars

Joey Ace · From: Hamilton, Ontario, Canada

With all the intrest in these, and the worldwide scope of this forum, is it possible we can get some made again?

I have many bars and love my BJS, but I'd put money down on getting a Zirconia.

Is there a way we can find the minimum order to commision a limited run?

ed packard · From: Show Low AZ

Joey; The Zirc bars raw material costs more than BJ sells his bars for, ..add the labor and equipment cost, let alone the marketing costs and it becomes a difficult item to justify. We could justify the first lot based upon having time on our hands, access to the equipment, and spending $10,000 on just raw material costs for a minimum lot order.

The sales went great as when someone sees and hears Bill Stafford they want what he is using, ..if it had just been me with one, or a flyer/catalog item it would have flopped. Same thing goes re instruments, tunings, amps, etc, ..until a "super picker" is seen with one it does not fly whether it is good or not.

If enough folk are interested in a second run (at least 200 bars) we can run the $s required to get them made, but I/we have no intention of getting into the mess that one instrument maker did back when re pre pay. They will probably cost more than before because the labor cost would have to be included this time, ..last time we were having fun, this time would be work. The shop time (equipment use etc.)would also have to be factored in this time. These are not metal, so metal working equipment does not cut it.

Joey Ace · From: Hamilton, Ontario, Canada

Thanks for the reply, Ed.

My math, based on your Raw Materials estimate, indicates $50 a bar, not counting tooling, labor, etc. So if you had an order for 200, I suspect they'd sell for around $150.(Please correct me if I'm wrong.) That's double the price of a BJS.

I'd buy one, so we only need 199 more interested pickers.

I believe marketing costs should be avoided. I wonder if the Internet could generate enough interested parties to make this a reality. Probably not, but stranger things have happened.

I just might buy two, and hope sell the extra on Ebay for a profit when they are no longer available.

Now we only need 198 more orders.

Jim Vogan · From: Ohio City, Ohio 45874

I'd like to have one also.

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Jim Vogan Emmons Sd10
G.D. Walker Stereo Steel Combo
Bakelite Ric
Hilton volume pedal

Jerry Roller · From: Van Buren, Arkansas USA

Count me in for two 10 strings bars.
Jerry Roller

Terry Edwards · From: Florida... livin' on spongecake...

I am not familiar with these bars. Sounds like something from a star trek movie (Zirconium dilithium crystals for the warp drive!) Anyway, do these bars make you sound better? How? Do they come with licks?!

Terry

Joey Ace · From: Hamilton, Ontario, Canada

I doubt if they would sound better than a BJS, Terry.

So how many should we put you down for?

Marco Schouten · From: Amsterdam, The Netherlands

I'd buy one too.

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Steelin' Greetings
Marco Schouten
Sho-Bud Pro III Custom; Sho-Bud LLG

Rick Garrett · From: Tyler, Texas

I'll take one for a 10 string guitar. Put my name down and where do I send the money?

Rick Garrett

Mike Perlowin · From: Los Angeles CA

The Jim Dunlop company in Benecia Ca makes tone bars (good ones too) among other things. This company strives for real quality in their products. I have 5 of their effects pedals, and am very happy with all of them.

These people have enough capital to make Zirconia bars if they thought there was a large enough demand.

Perhaps we should all write to them requesting that they lease the rights from Bill and Ed and start making them.

[This message was edited by Mike Perlowin on 07 November 2002 at 11:44 AM.]

Allan Thompson · From: Scotland.

I`ll take at least four.

Terry Wendt · From: Nashville, TN, USA

I want one for a 13 string.

7/8" x 3 3/4" should do

Gary Walker · From: Morro Bay, CA

I have a birthstone 12 string bar and a Dunlop 12. Chuck Wright made me a great 12 string bar in '68 and it still looks like a new one and it's stainless. I use it more than the other two.

Kenny Foy · From: Lynnville, KY, USA

If it can be made a 12 string bar.

Peter · Posted 9 Nov 2002 8:17 am

I'll take two 10 string bars and a 12 string bar.

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Peter den Hartogh-Fender Artist S10-Remington U12-Hilton Volume Pedal-Gibson BR4 lapsteel-Guya "Stringmaster" Copy-MusicMan112RP-Peavy Rage158- - My Animation College in South Africa

Peter · Posted 9 Nov 2002 8:20 am

Maybe we can pay upfront through the Forum?

kbdrost · From: Prospect Heights, IL

I'll take one

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Ken Drost

Bobby Lee · From: Cloverdale, California, USA

I wouldn't say that they sound better than a BJS. They have every bit as much sustain, though, and are smoother than anything I've ever played. They aren't as bright sounding as steel bars. I use my BJS for country, and zirconia for everything else.

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Bobby Lee - email: quasar@b0b.com - gigs - CDs
Sierra Session 12 (E9), Williams 400X (Emaj9, D6), Sierra Olympic 12 (F Diatonic), Sierra Laptop 8 (D13), Fender Stringmaster (E13, A6), Roland Handsonic

Bill Llewellyn · From: San Jose, CA

I've borrowed zirconia bars on a couple occasions at steel jams and loved them. They are lighter than steel bars and that makes it easier to get around on the neck. And they are incredibly smooth. I'd buy one if I could find one.

Bob Cox · From: Buckeye State

I don,t know what it is about those dam things ,but the moment you pic one up you have better bar control.I like the steel bar tone but the zircon action an ease.

Eric West · From: Portland, Oregon, USA, R.I.P.

Alright. Alright..

I'm looking for a new bar.

The Two that I've had for 25 years are getting a little dented.

I got them from a Fellow Student of BCs in Maryland. He was in a Branch of the Military, and sold them for 25$ According to him they were made of a "Classified Alloy". Probably some Roswell Stuff. They're 7/8" x 3 1/2" I beveled the end of one.

They're amazing. If you drop them, they'll dent. They're so inert, I heve never seen a string mark on them. I went to chuck them in a lathe, to take the boogers out a few years back, and I couldn't find any grade of emery or croakus cloth that would touch them. It took 6 hours with some kind of diamond dusted cloth to get it done.

Anybody remember those?

Anyhow, I'm hesitant to just get a "stainless" one, and I might be a little dense, But I'm not seeing the molecular physics end of freezing steel to "align" the molecules.

If they were indeed "aligned", wouldn't that make them magnetic??

Any how. These Super Secret Stainless/Moly alloy bars have been the best ever, and I'd like to know just what kind of alloys people are using nowadays.

Gotta Run. I think there are some NSA Agents at my door....

Thanks..

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EJL63FLH
'78 Pro III Sho-Bud
'63FLH 90"Stroker
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Why Can't you Dumb yourself Smart?"-Me
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Rick Barber · From: Morgan Hill, Calif. USA

I was wondering if any owners of zirc bars have seen any signs of wear (on the bars that is) .

Rick Barber

James Brown · From: Mt Uniacke, Nova Scotia, Canada

Where can I purchase some of this material?

Rick Aiello · From: Berryville, VA USA

quote:

But I'm not seeing the molecular physics end of freezing steel to "align" the molecules.

If they were indeed "aligned", wouldn't that make them magnetic??

Cryogenics, or deep freezing is done to make sure there is no retained Austenite during quenching.

When steel is at the hardening temperature, there is a solid solution of Carbon and Iron, known as Austenite.

The amount of Martensite (the real hard stuff) formed at quenching is a function of the lowest temperature encountered. At any given temperature of quenching there is a certain amount of Martensite and the balance is untransformed Austenite.

This untransformed austenite is very brittle and can cause loss of strength or hardness, dimensional instability, or cracking.

Quenches are usually done to room temperature. Most medium carbon steels and low alloy steels undergo transformation to 100 % Martensite at room temperature.

However, high carbon and high alloy steels have retained Austenite at room temperature. To eliminate retained Austenite, the temperature has to be lowered.

In Cryogenic treatment the material is subject to deep freeze temperatures of as low as -185°C (-301°F), but usually -75°C (-103°F) is sufficient. The Austenite is unstable at this temperature, and the whole structures becomes Martensite.

This is the reason to use Cryogenic treatment.

This process has nothing to do with magnetism ... which basically is the result of small "charged" regions ... called domains ... aligning themselves in a given direction .... when exposed to a magnetic field.

You asked

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"If the SHOES fit ... you must EQUIP..."

Mike Perlowin · From: Los Angeles CA

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