The Steel Guitar Forum

Since I am just beginning my journey into C6 land, I'm wondering if there would be any disadvantage to dedicating pedal 4 to E9 (PF) change on D10 psg? Doesn't seem to be a lot of support for using pedal 4 on C6 anyway. Any suggestions would be appreciated.Thanks....Robert

P4 does seem to have fallen out of fashion. Some swear by it but it depends what style you play, I guess. I have it on one of my steels but I don't rely on it for anything.

Pedal 4 raising both A's combined with pf4 can result in a stiff pedal. P4 is the first pedal most replace. I have kept it but modified it slightly to allow more chordal possibilities. I lower string seven C to B and string 4 A to B together on p4. The action is much better on my Rains. This allows some nice contrary motion licks and can still be easily combined with pedal 5 for a D13 chord. The change really shines when digging into close Bill Evans type chord voicings. Before you remove p4 try moving your 8th string raise rod over and test drive it for a spell. That being said my D10 has eight pedals and eight levers. If my steel had less changes I would probably omit it for a more frequently used change. Happy hunting! The C6 is a beautiful creation.

Pedal 4 on C6 is one of those 'outside' pedals. I have mine raising both As to B (standard) but I'd have to say that I can go for a long time without using it. It's good, though, for fluid blues runs 'two below zero' on the top four strings.

Many years ago I recall asking Buddy what he had pedal 4 doing on his black LeGrande. It was at a sound-check and I was a bit surprised when he said 'I'm not sure...', then went to his guitar to check and see. It turns out that he was raising the As but that led me to assume that it was something he changed from time to time at a whim.

Mind you, I use pedal 8 even less than pedal 4!

I've got P4 working both necks on my Williams, but the E9 side is only two strings. A little stiff, but not bad.

Mine lowers the 5th and 6th on E9 as well as the two As on C6. Maybe a touch stodgy but works well enough.

Here's a couple of brief clips of Paul Franklin explaining his use of P4 on both necks taken from lessons in The Paul Franklin Method.

PF on E9 and C6


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Unsurprisingly, that video is unavailable.

Buddy doesn't include pedal 4 in his Basic C6 course. somewhere else he's quoted as saying no one was ever quite sure what to do with pedal 4. many players reserve it as the "experimental" pedal to try different things

I've been using it for years to raise my Es to F, something Buddy also did from time to time (though I believe he only raised his E on string 6). this is a change I can't live without and if you're only raising one string on C6, you could still use that pedal for E9 changes without making the action too stiff.

have fun!

Roger Rettig wrote:Unsurprisingly, that video is unavailable.

LOL. I accidentally clicked "Private" instead of "Show To Everyone But Roger".

My apologies, it's fixed now.

Thanks for posting all these P4 alternative ideas! I would like to hear more...

As Scott described, I have 6th string "E" raise to "F" on pedal 4. I like to be able to hear a major chord sometimes. I began with a reverse p6 on p4, but soon backed off the 2nd string lower. I'd like p4 to raise both "E"s for full major IV chord. Use it all the time.

Thanks to all for the thoughts/suggestions to my inquiry. Based on consensus of opinion I'm going to use pedal 4 on E9 neck (PF) change since I have that on my single neck E9 and am very fond of it. As Scott says Buddy Emmons Basic C6 course doesn't address use of pedal 4 and that is what I'm using to get started. Anyway, thanks again to all for the advise.
Best wishes,
R--

If you don't use it on the C6th neck -
I would suggest using pedal 4 to lower strings three and six a half step on the E9 neck, flatting the thirds for a minor.

i moved the high A pull to the G string and with pedal 6 you get the ab e9 change on strings 5 3 2.

On the ancient D10 I used to own I repurposed P4 to raise string 3 to C#, which was more useful. This change would normally be on a lever but next to P5 was good, I seem to remember.

John Spaulding wrote:Here's a couple of brief clips of Paul Franklin explaining his use of P4 on both necks taken from lessons in The Paul Franklin Method.

PF on E9 and C6


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I love that low register 7th string C lower change. I'll have to find a way to put that on.

Concerning the earlier P4, A to B, I found it redundant for my use. I never used the lower A raise, so I just have a dedicated lever that raises the high A to B with a Bb half stop. This makes for an interesting sound strummed too without the low A raise.

I have the "splat" pedal on 4 anyway, so wouldn't add anything else to that, but I do have the PF E9 change on pedal 8 along with a couple other C6 changes. I may elect to put Paul's low Bb on there...matter of fact I may re-think some of my changes on the C neck?...hmmm

additional info.....


https://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtop ... ight=pedal

My P4 is set up to lower the 4th string A to Ab. It's main uses for me are for having the striking interval of a 1/2 tone on open Fm chords, a la Bill Evans (strings 3,4,5, and 9), and for open D7#11 chords, like in A Train, Naima, On a Clear Day, or in any II or VI chord situation. There are also some other uses, more obscure.
- John