The Steel Guitar Forum

I currently have an old Professional with a pretty worn changer mechanism. I'd love to have it refurbished at Marr's Music but can't really afford to invest an extra $1500. I'm thinking of purchasing a Pro III on line and selling my current guitar but I've never seen or played one. I'm looking for advice about the quality of the Pro III changer system and the guitar in general, assuming it's in good shape.

Thanks for any advice!
George

A Professional is a single raise/lower changer(actually a misnomer-more on that later), and a ProIII is a triple raise/double lower changer.
A ProIII's worth is directly related to it's vintage. If it's an earlier model (wide pedals/curved knees/gumby headstocks) it's probably a bit better than the later ones (narrow pedals/straight knee/no gumby), which more often than not were full of pot metal parts,some of which break off when you least expect it.
The Prof's changer, even though it only has single raise & lower channels, can still accept as many raises and lowers - including compensators - as you need, since they all would share the same rod. It's a marvel of simplicity, and works as well - when adjusted right- as any ProII or III does.
Sound wise, they're pretty similar, with the Pro III having more highs...usually. The difference is not so much due to the metal necks as it is due to the way the changer is mounted on the body. At least, that's the general rule when comparing ProII's and ProIII's...as well as SuperPro's with wood or metal necks.
As for the Pro III - there's one on eBay now.
Is that it?
Of course, that's just my opinion...Some folks think the late model ProIII's were some of the best Buds that were made.
Hope that helps a little.<font size="1" color="#8e236b"><p align="center">[This message was edited by Skip Edwards on 15 December 2005 at 08:39 PM.]</p></FONT>

Bobbe Seymour has said the Pro IIIs are one of the better Sho-Bud's, because they still had some of the old Bud charm, but had modern all-pull mechanics. The alloy parts are not very durable, but are only a serious problem if the guitar has been played to death (or will be played to death). I recently got a Pro III, but it is not my main axe, so I'm not worried about the parts wearing out. This Pro III has TrueTone pickups, just like my Zum. With these identical pickups, the Pro III plays and sounds almost as good as Zum, which is saying a lot. I think the Zum has a little more sustain. But it is a very subtle difference. If the Pro III were my main guitar, I'd get John Coop's precision engineered steel changer. It is said to improve the tone and the playing, and is certainly more durable. Provided it hasn't been worn out, a Pro III is a good guitar.

but do keep in mind, as you mentioned WORN CHANGER..

there are no NEW Pro III's...

It's possible you may swap one Steel with a worn changer for another...

When I owned and played my PRO III, I had to swap at least two fingers due to worn rivets..

Tone wise, the Professional will have a leg up...I personally rate the Professional #1, Pro II # 2 and then the PRO III # 3...

When I did own a D10 Professional, It was obvious to me that it was the BEST sounding Steel of all I have had...

Would I buy another PRO III ? yes of course..

good luck
t

make sure you try it out before you buy. you might get the piece 'o crap that i owned. it was so muddy and for some strange reason it broke g#s one after the other. worst steel i ever owned! my fourth sho-bud, and my last.

What about COOP's super fingers?
That would take care of your changer woes far cheaper than a full refurbish or a new steel....

------------------
www.bigsmokey.com

Thanks for the input, guys. I hadn't heard of John Coop's changer. If there is a more economical way to update my current Professional than the Marrs refurbish I'm all ears. Tell me more... how do I contact him?

Thanks again,
George

John Coop is a Forum member and he can be reached at cshobud1@wmconnect.com
Do a Forum search for him...under Pedal Steel, I'd guess...and you should come up with a bunch of stuff. And I think it'll be mostly folks praising the fine work he does on Sho-Buds. Changers, knee levers, complete rebuilds, all that good stuff.

I imagine he can make your Prof play better than you ever thought it could.

<font size="1" color="#8e236b"><p align="center">[This message was edited by Skip Edwards on 16 December 2005 at 08:04 PM.]</p></FONT>

The biggest effect on tone, and biggest bang for the buck, will be to replace the stock changer with Coop's changer. Refurbishing the rest of the alloy undercarriage with Coop's steel parts will improve durability.

Or you can leave it stock, save 15 lbs and keep the original value up.

These Pro IIIs are some of Sho-Buds greatest guitars.

Any parts replaced on these guitars should be replaced with high quality stock looking aluminum parts. And then, don't fix what isn't broken.

John does some nice machining, but use your own head here, don't over do it.
The use of steel where it isn't necessary is a foolish move.

If it wasn't, I'd replace every old weak aluminum part on my airplane with good old heavy steel parts, then park it in the hangar and look at it, cuz it wouldn't ever fly again.

Bobbe<font size="1" color="#8e236b"><p align="center">[This message was edited by BobbeSeymour on 21 December 2005 at 06:56 PM.]</p></FONT>

I would also like to add that there is a tone change by going to steel fingers. If you can get used to the sound, then do it, but just remember, you will have made a big change that is altering the originality of your guitar in tone, and value. This is to the purest anyway, and there are more purests in the Sho-Bud world everyday.

Knee lever part number "731" is a change I go along with.

For many years now, I have been doing a small mod on the stock Sho-Bud fingers that is inexpensive and will make the stock finger last forever, and WILL NOT alter the tone, or the originality of the guitar.

Please don't butcher all these great Sho-Buds guys, they don't need or deserve this fate.

Bobbe

I appreciate your input, Bobbe... I didn't purchase the Pro III that was on Ebay last week although it was probably a decent deal. According the the owner it was very low miles and came with a Nashville 400. I didn't see the final bid but it was at ~$1700 last time I looked.

I've decided to hang onto my Professional for now. I love the old thing and don't want to part with it, and I really can't justify owning 2 guitars. So now I need to figure out what work to do/have done on it. I think the changer fingers are basically OK after looking it over closely, but the original bell cranks (or whatever they are called) are really worn, particularly the ones on the E9 neck. I've contacted John Coop but haven't gotten a reply on his parts yet. Do you have any alternative suggestions?

Thanks again,
George

The Prof doesn't have bell cranks, it's got what's usually called a "rack" or a "basket" which pulls the brass collars that are attached to the rods. To my knowledge they don't really wear out much. Your gtr probably just needs a good lube job and some adjusting. If your rods are worn John Coop makes some quality pull rods for the old Buds that have a hex on the end and are made from a better grade of metal than the originals were. There's a topic or two about them somewhere on the Forum.

IMO you're making the right decision to fix up your Prof. They sound great and when adjusted right they play really well. I've got a 6139 (single neck Prof) that I bought in '72 and I'll never get rid of it.