The Steel Guitar Forum

Just surfing You Tube and picked up on a steeler demoing add on box of sorts. I am not giving opinion on the plus or minus effects of the box. I am addressing one statement made about the box adding to sustain. Years ago at Scotty's convention one brand of steel was calling their latest pickup Super Sustain. As I walked along I came upon Ron Lashley and asked him what he thought of another brand Super Sustain Pick up. Ron told me something that I never forgot, namely any steel when picked will only sustain as it's long as it will with or without an amp. Adding any gadget will not make the instrument strings decay any faster or slower. Adding a tape or something or something would sound longer only because the original sound is reproduced.

Tommy...your playing always makes me smile!
You are so right.

Yerbud,

JW

The Ebow and the new TC Electronic Aeon give you unlimited sustain. I remember seeing a YouTube video of lap steel than had a similar sustaining coil for each string. If you could dial back the strength of something like that to allow a slow decay, you'd have a longer sustaining steel guitar that didn't sound weird. In theory.

Running the amp at a high volume and controlling the sustain with the volume pedal is something that some players haven't learned. That said, for us, the action of reducing decay or "sustaining" sounds is generally built on four things (in no particular order) - the guitar itself, the hands and bar, the amplifier, and the volume pedal. And with moderate capability in these areas, I see no problem in sustaining notes or chords easily for several seconds, to maybe even ten to twenty seconds in some situations.

I mean, really now...how much "sustain" do you need?

I mean, really now...how much "sustain" do you need?

Indeed.

Adding vibrato after picking the string will add sustain.

Donny Hinson wrote:Running the amp at a high volume and controlling the sustain with the volume pedal is something that some players haven't learned. That said, for us, the action of reducing decay or "sustaining" sounds is generally built on four things (in no particular order) - the guitar itself, the hands and bar, the amplifier, and the volume pedal. And with moderate capability in these areas, I see no problem in sustaining notes or chords easily for several seconds, to maybe even ten to twenty seconds in some situations.

I mean, really now...how much "sustain" do you need?

Donny has been preaching this for years.

It's good to be reminded every now and then.

Friend of mine told me he played a show one night with his old Gibson flat top, the next day he opened the case and the guitar was going HMMMMMMMMM.....now that's sustain!!!

Whatever gadgetry or technique can be used to cause the string to continue vibrating is what adds sustain. A volume pedal creates an illusion of sustain, albeit a slightly less artificial sounding one than say, a compressor.

Georg, respectfully, I am not sure I understand what kind of feedback you are talking about. A pickup either feeds the signal back and forth or it doesn’t, correct? I just assume this causes the string to continue to vibrate, but maybe it is a purely electronic phenomena?

Speaking of sustain gadgets... yet another tap-dance option.
https://www.musiciansfriend.com/amplifi ... ects-pedal

Paul Arntson wrote:Speaking of sustain gadgets... yet another tap-dance option.
https://www.musiciansfriend.com/amplifi ... ects-pedal

I kinda like that one. There is a similar thing built into the Boss GT-10, but I don’t think it does chords. I liked the demo video with the Wavy Gravy look-alike too

Thanks, Georg. I think I understand some of that
So it is still dependent on fairly high volume, and can reliably sustain the fundamental pitch of a ringing note, rather than produce the random harmonic squeal and howl of the “guitar in the speaker cone” thing.

...or you could try looking here:

http://www.sustainiac.com/

Back in the 70's or 80's, I met Carco Clave (known as Carlos Claveria to me) at Cowtown in San Jose. He was playing a push/pull, and had built a little pedestal that he put his guitar on, and used a tall stool placed behind the guitar to sit on. If I remember right, he told me he had a JBL mounted in the pedestal pointing up to the bottom of the guitar to help with sustain. And, it kept him high enough to discourage people from asking him for requests.

Peter Harris wrote:...or you could try looking here:

http://www.sustainiac.com/

This is an excellent source of information on the subject, and a very interesting looking guitar product. I wonder if it would work on pedal steel? Thanks for posting, Peter.

https://youtu.be/g7-5io1muSQ

I think Nigel has it figured out.

Funniest movie ever. Have you ever listened to the version with the voiceover where they stay in character? Priceless.

Magnetic pull from the pickup can affect the amount of sustain a guitar has.
There are manufacturers that brag about this helping sustain by the nature of their magnetic field.
Strats are notorious for the warble of 3 single-coil magnets have on intonation.

The difference would be subtle.

I recently changed a steel from a Truetone to a BL 710(2) and noticed a slight improvement in sustain. The fundamental seems happier. It could be something to do with the magnetic fields.

John

John Goux wrote:Magnetic pull from the pickup can affect the amount of sustain a guitar has.
There are manufacturers that brag about this helping sustain by the nature of their magnetic field.
Strats are notorious for the warble of 3 single-coil magnets have on intonation.

The magnetic pull, if it's excessive, could reduce the amount of sustain. But there's no way that pickups could enhance it. Normally, this magnetic dampening doesn't bother steel guitars much because their pickups are close to the bridge. The "warble" heard on some multi-pickup guitars is caused by slight phase differences in the pickup signals which induces a type of inter-modulation distortion.

IMHO, Lashley's comments about sustain are somewhat self-serving, and must be taken with a grain of salt. You can't argue that increasing the signal from a pickup by increasing volume as the signal decays doesn't add to the amount of audibly observed sustain. That's just basic physics.

Donny Hinson wrote:You can't argue that increasing the signal from a pickup by increasing volume as the signal decays doesn't add to the amount of audibly observed sustain. That's just basic physics.

Physics is also behind a plucked string’s inability to perpetually vibrate. Although it is a valid and valuable technique, a volume swell merely increases the electrical signal of a decaying note, and it sounds like it. Adding vibrato while adding volume prolongs string vibration somewhat and makes the note sound more alive, but that has a shelf life too. I don’t see anything lamentable about that. We are not playing organs or violins. Ways to keep the string vibrating longer, and not just increase the volume of a decaying note, have already been mentioned.

Then again, a moderately set high gain amplifier can make an electric guitar string sing forever - at least the notes where the harmonics line up in a constructive fashion. Though it is an advantage for the electric guitar to have its body more or less parallel to the plane of the wave coming out of the amplifier.