mic pre's / converters

Brett Lanier · Post by **Brett Lanier** » 16 Dec 2015 11:14 am

I'm thinking about upgrading my home studio recording rig. I've been using a Presonus Firepod that's been on loan to me. For those of you who have experience using the high end stuff what would you recommend? I'd like to get something that can hold up to the quality of the pro studio gear for sending tracks, and something that I won't want to just replace in a year or so. Two channels is really all I'm looking for.

The API A2D looks very appealing, but I could see going with a simpler/cheaper thing like an Apogee Duet or Apollo Twin and then think about adding external preamps later. Thoughts?

Jack Stoner · Post by **Jack Stoner** » 16 Dec 2015 1:50 pm

I'm using a Roland Octa-Capture USB connected as my main recording interface unit. The Octa-Capture has 8 mic/instrument preamps (inputs(. I have a smaller Steinberg UR44 as a backup unit (4 mic/instrument inputs). The UR44 is also USB connected.

I use to have a Focusrite Saffire Pro 40, which is a Firewire connected unit. It worked well but 11ms was the best Latency I could get (reliable). The Octa-Capture is 4ms and the UR44 is 6ms.

I considered higher end devices but they all required buying mic preamp channel strips. I have a dual channel tube preamp that I use with mic's when needed. Otherwise just the built in preamps in the Octa-Capture or UR44.

Bob Hoffnar · Post by **Bob Hoffnar** » 17 Dec 2015 1:37 pm

Look at the RME stuff. I'm very happy with my UCX.

Les Cargill · Post by **Les Cargill** » 17 Dec 2015 7:25 pm

I have not looked this year. 2013 was the year I had to upgrade. I went with a Focusrite Scarlett 18i20.

I can get up the 16 tracks with an 8-channel Lightpipe box like Jack's Octopre or a Behringer ADA8000.

The preamps on the Scarlett do not change sound as you add gain like some Mackie mixers do.

Jack mentioned latency - I can set it for 2 msec latency, which REAPER reports as 4.6-6.9 msec roundtrip latency. This a decidedly unfancy computer- dual core i5 from 2011.

I am sure other offerings are as good or better.

I can use REAPER as a live/cue mixer and track with another DAW. This is nice - I don't have to find space for a mixer.

Brett Lanier · Post by **Brett Lanier** » 19 Dec 2015 6:23 pm

Thanks for the suggestions guys. Bob, the RME unit looks great. However, I'm leaning towards a Metric Halo ULN-2.

Bob Hoffnar · Post by **Bob Hoffnar** » 20 Dec 2015 9:16 pm

The metric halo stuff is great. Everybody that I know that uses metric halo gear totally loves them.

I went with the RME unit because I wanted to have more analog inputs available. I'm now running hardware compressors/processors and the extra inputs and outputs make it possible to use them with aux sends within pro tools. I like my hardware stuff more than plug ins.

Brett Lanier · Post by **Brett Lanier** » 21 Dec 2015 6:22 pm

Yeah, having all of those extra inputs make the RME tempting. There is something on the Metric Halo sight about the ULN2 that I don't understand...

"8 channels all new ADAT I/O with switchable TOSLINK support"

edit - I've learned that this means I can plug in 8 more preamps via ADAT for a total of 10 channels. Cool!

Phillip Broste · Post by **Phillip Broste** » 24 Dec 2015 12:41 pm

I can second Bob on RME stuff. I have had a fireface 800 for years and I love it. I expect I will pick another one up used someday to double my inputs, but the resale price continues to be high,even though the unit is no longer made. I think that speaks volumes for the quality of the product!

Bob Hoffnar · Post by **Bob Hoffnar** » 27 Dec 2015 10:28 am

What units are available and how much does it cost to utilize toslink support ?
RME has those digital ports also. But I don't think it's cheap to use them.

Brett Lanier · Post by **Brett Lanier** » 27 Dec 2015 11:58 am

This unit seems like a modern bare bones solution to adding 8 more channels by way of a TOSLINK cable. http://us.focusrite.com/mic-pres/octopre-mkii/images
I assume you use the "word clock in" to sync it more precisely to your interface. I think you can spend quite a bit on high end optic cables but I don't know how necessary that is.

Seems like if you had 6 outboard preamps plus an 8 channel unit like the focusrite (connected via toslink) you'd get 16 channels. With the Metric Halo I'd have 2 + 8 for a total of 10.

I'm sure either interface would be great for what I want to do, I'm just gravitating towards the Metric Halo since it has independent controls on the two preamps and there are many reviews out there saying their preamps have an edge on the RME's. Also, I've worked with them before and I already know I like the sound. But if I were interested in putting together a collection of preamps in a lunchbox I could see how the RME would be better.

Here's a quote I found on gearslutz that helps clear some of this up a little.

"Just for terminology, ADAT (often called ADAT lightpipe) is the name of the 8ch data transfer protocol. The name came from Alesis DAT format. S/PDIF is the name of the protocol for 2ch stereo transfer, and the name came from Sony / Phillips Digital Interface Format. TOSLINK is the type of optical cable, and the name came from Toshiba Link. TOSLINK can carry ADAT signals or S/PDIF signals. Coaxial cables (with RCA plugs on both ends) is often used to carry S/PDIF signals. These things are just snapshot of the terminology, but you would encounter lots of actual use is very much confusing and often mis-used, like 'TOSLINK data'."

Bob Hoffnar · Post by **Bob Hoffnar** » 29 Dec 2015 6:46 am

I just deleted my post because I am not sure about something and I think I got it wrong.

Does the ADAT input need digital converters to ad tracks ? In other words does the RME and Metric stuff need to have the sounds converted from A to D in order to work ?

I know I'm not being clear but I'm not sure how to say it.

Dale Rottacker · Post by **Dale Rottacker** » 29 Dec 2015 10:59 am

Brett, if you like the PreSonus stuff as I do, and want to stick with it,
I use the FireStudio Project... a 10x10 Interface... I really like mine...
Iâ€™m no 100% sure you can still get it, but PreSonus continues to
come out with some pretty good gear, if you go to their website, or
this one at Sweetwater...

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/ ... atchtype=p

Brett Lanier · Post by **Brett Lanier** » 30 Dec 2015 11:28 am

Bob, I get what you're saying. I've been wondering the same thing myself. From everything I've read though it seems like you don't need to add additional converters. Or at least no one has made mention of it.

Here are a couple quote's I pulled from the Metric Halo forum, both written by MH tech support guys.. " The ULN-2 is limited to 12 physical input channels (2 analog, 2 AES/SPDIF, and 8 ADAT)"

"To use external pres with the Record Panel you would have to connect them via the ULN-2's digital inputs. On a Legacy ULN-2 you could use either the AES or SPDIF inputs, on a 2d Expanded box you could use AES or SPDIF and ADAT."

I know they don't fully answer our question, but they also don't make any mention of needing an additional A/D converter for those extra channels.

Bob Hoffnar · Post by **Bob Hoffnar** » 5 Jan 2016 8:32 am

Brett,
I think you will need to buy another expansion unit from metric that does include A/D converters to use the ADAT input for additional tracks. If you go with a berringer or some other A/D expansion unit it will not sound like the Metric Halo.

The guys that make these things are very aware of market and pricing.