What's New On PSG?

Franklin · Post by **Franklin** » 13 Sep 2015 6:11 am

I was really saddened when Buddy Emmons passed........

I believe all of "E"s experimentations and playing accomplishments in advancing the instrument, along with all the other iconic masters need a home for discussion.....I'm 61 now and I have witnessed so many great ideas, both musical and mechanical, that for whatever reasons are just being discovered today... Its good to see many of those earlier concepts resurface.....I hope you all find this topic important to discuss......I am not meaning to be condescending to anyone here that believes they, or someone they love to hear, is heading in a new direction for PSG, when I say this...Personally, I have not heard anything outside the box that doesn't connect back to the earliest years of mechanical and musical explorations. So I am asking those of you who know a good bit about what was explored back then, to add what you remember about those concepts in this thread. State who and what you witnessed and approximately when that was? Maybe we can come up with an accurate timeline of discovery for historical preservation. I want those that paved the way for my generation to get their due credit.

Here's the question:

Is there really any PSG firsts beyond personal expression (which is the choice of notes one chooses to play in any genre)? State first time approaches that are truly out of the box from what the iconic players played or explored?

I could only think of one........Robert Randolph.......Why?........ its because he is the first PSG player to front a band on national TV with any regularity always sitting behind the instrument, front and center. Robert utilized the sacred steel sound of the instrument to gain stardom. He has taken it all the way to home plate by consistently performing - getting frequent National TV exposure......His artist predecessors were Alvino Ray, Leon M., Santo and Johnny, and Pete Drake who all hit the main stage with mostly syndicated TV exposure. Barbara Mandrell, and Wayne Newton would play the instrument in rare TV appearances. Rusty Young also stepped up to the microphone to front Poco. All of these artists paved the way for RR and I'm confident others will follow his path.....RR has performed on nearly every major national musical TV show as a pedal steel guitarist...They introduced Hendrix along with his guitar playing and now RR is introduced the same way, as a Pedal Steel Guitarist.

......Buddy pioneered many mechanical concepts...These are just a few of the lessor talked about concepts...In the early 60's The mandolin concept on steel.....Sho-Bud made several guitars with unison plain strings like a twelve string guitar or mandolin. Picking it was hard but it was very hip sounding.....The pedal steel guitar capo....In the 60's the Emmons guitar offered a stereo guitar with two 5 string pickups on a ten string guitar....The sound would go from one amp to the next as he played depending on which set of strings he used...In the 70's Multiple pickups and on board switching controls was used by many players...."E" had the first one I saw....It was a 4 pickup guitar and he was exploring the concept for use in the studio to hide the "twang" of the traditional steel tones. Seeing Buddy's prompted me to have Dad build a dual pickup guitar for me...I owned several and still own the one I used with Dire Straits, the yellow and red front guitar. They all came with in and out of phase switching capabilities. The concept Johnny Cox and Bruce Z manufactured is probably the best concept for modern times....It was adding pickups that slide under the strings which were adaptable to any brand of guitar. They are unattached so they can be bypassed or removed when not needed - in between songs, or gigs......IMO a Great idea because you get everything without losing anything from your main axe.

As for the blues, rock, and atmospheric effects direction.....In the 60's Sneaky Pete, Rusty Young, Pete Drake, Buddy, Weldon, Hal Rugg, are just a few whom I saw play pop/rock music convincingly for the times....All used effects such as Wah Wah's, Delays, chorus, flanging, compressors, ring modulators and overdrives to camouflage the instruments twang......Freddy Roulette and the sacred steelers captured the essence of true blues playing and IMO David Lindley and Ry Cooder slammed it out of the park on sessions......They are my favorite lap steel blues players.....Although many are pursuing this approach and adapting their personal licks to the musical genres of today, the atmospheric and effected soloing concepts I here today were pioneered by Buddy and these other wonderful players.

Before I close, I should say the most interesting idea I witnessed was when Gene Fields put a guitar fretboard on his steel...I first saw it in the 70's. He could play it without a bar and it sounded like a guitarist who could play exactly what steelers do with pedals. Other mentions of first time concepts: Maurice Anderson in the late 60's -universal tuning and elbow levers and guitars with on board distortion..... In the 60's Vance Terry used a double rack of floor pedals, looking like a B3's bass pedals.,.....Weldon Myrick in the 60's played a palm pedal dobro.....Lloyd Green was a purist in tone yet his innovative approach to pedals expanded everyones knowledge of how pedals could be manipulated beyond playing the obvious...

I believe this with all my heart, Buddy was the most consistent in direction among the first pioneers. He was not the only one leading the charge, there were many whose contributions should never be forgotten. I hope starting this thread will lead some into discovering those old country guys actually pushed the envelop beyond the stuff we call "out of the box" today.

Many of their explorations are still unknown to the forum and could be utilized today.......We first have to share what we remember.

Mike Neer · Post by **Mike Neer** » 13 Sep 2015 6:36 am

Susan Alcorn's latest recording, Soledad, is worth a listen. I believe you will find many things that haven't been done before. Also, her recent recording with Ellery Eskelin puts her in uncharted improvisational territory for a pedal steel guitarist.

Susan has complete reverence for the steel guitar's history and loves Emmons just as much as anyone, but she has gone her own direction. Her level of expression on the instrument is astonishing.

Brett Lanier · Post by **Brett Lanier** » 13 Sep 2015 8:10 am

Here's a neat seminar interview where Buddy takes us through his effects, plays some things I had never heard before, and shares some great insight into playing, making mistakes, and coming up with new sounds.
https://soundcloud.com/brooklyncrowns/q ... er-6-25-82

To expand a little on Paul's thoughts; the way I see it is the generation of steel players that came up from the late 50's into the 70's was so inventive with the instrument and the music they were playing that it's hard to make a comparison to anything else. We should be very appreciative of the great things those guys did right off the bat, and Buddy was without a doubt the one setting the bar for everyone else during that time. We can re-apply what they pioneered or maybe just dabbled with for decades after and it will often be thought of as new or cutting edge, explorative.. by a majority of music appreciators. I think Alvino Rey's talk box is a good example of that. It sounded new to people when it was used by Pete Drake or Kraftwerk, but he had already pioneered and used that sound in his music in the early 40's!

Johan Jansen · Post by **Johan Jansen** » 13 Sep 2015 2:36 pm

Nice thread! I think that Jeff Skunk Baxter also did a nice thing with "East St. Louis Toodle-oo" in Steely Dan. Hard to nail that song , sound and approach..

chris ivey · Post by **chris ivey** » 13 Sep 2015 7:08 pm

paul, when you did nervous breakdown i thought that was a real door opener! not only was it scary how fast and clean it was, but it incorporated a more modern style of progression and phrasing that kicked everyone in the butt and brought a new level of playing to the forefront.

and of course, you and your dad bringing the pedabro out was uniquely innovative. it offered a new color to the tone palette.

Bob Hoffnar · Post by **Bob Hoffnar** » 13 Sep 2015 10:33 pm

Chas Smith has done some ground breaking work with some of the instruments he has built.

I have been working on a technique for a while using difference tones to create sub harmonics and rhythmic beating tones. It comes in pretty handy in some surprising contexts.

This is the piece I did a while ago when I was first exploring the idea. It is just solo pedalsteel with an overdrive pedal. No overdubs.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ya_Bg5-vNNs

I played it for Bud Carter and he knew what I was doing right away. He gave me some ideas about how to get the ghost low notes under control.

I did a concert last night with a ferocious band called the "Young Mothers" where I used the rhythmic thing pretty extensively.

Here is a website for them.

http://music.ingebrigtflaten.com/album/ ... never-done

I played on the tune "Mole" on the "a mothers work is never done" recording.

The recording is cool but live it gets really wild !

I am currently working on duets of drone based music with a classical bass player. We will do a concert and some recording withing a month or so.

I gotta put in my vote for Susan Alcorn. She is exploring some new and deep places. She has the chops, ear, courage and vision to for it.

Bob Hoffnar · Post by **Bob Hoffnar** » 13 Sep 2015 10:40 pm

Here is something I posted on another thread:

I think this video (Mark Knopfler concert) shows how Paul changed pedalsteel forever. Paul Franklin's style and way of musically dealing with Mark Knopfler's music became a standard way to fit the steelguitar into non country forms while keeping the most basic and unique aspects of our instrument fully intact. The approach Paul developed became a major part of the more current music coming out of Nashville. Without it I'm not sure the instrument would have retained much of any musical relevance in popular music beyond being a twangy cliche.

I wonder what Paul was thinking when he came up with it ?

I have heard other steel players like Reese Anderson do something similar but nothing close to what Paul Franklin developed.

Charlie McDonald · Post by **Charlie McDonald** » 14 Sep 2015 2:39 am

A fine and concise overview of pedal steel history, Mr. Franklin.
Bob's post reminds me of my freshman year review of the (to me) newly discovered On The Night concert video, thrilled at the use of PSG
in a large modern setting, altho I couldn't identify what brand of steel you were using....

That same decade, this post by Mr. Emmons appeared:

I may have to have the octave B's raising together on the third pedal for some things, I'm not sure yet, but pedal A will give me a 4 over 5 chord I've wanted for some time. The left knee cluster on the JCH will allow me to put the E to F# on a knee and leave the third pedal to experiment with. If that doesn't work, I'll go to the Day setup.

We don't know what he was doing in his offtime, although there's been some exposure, by Chris Templeton, of his use of synthesizers,
leading the way in 'out of the box thinking' that he pioneered, moving beyond himself at the same time that many were and are not able.
He continued to go beyond the parameters that he initiated that most pedal steelers have followed with blind dedication, often to a fault.

It seems there are parallel and conflicting values: that of preserving the instrument and its literature lest it be lost,
and the desire by many unknowns to go beyond it in the development of this newest of instruments (it's younger than the Theramin).
It occurs to me that most of the continued development will come from players who won't be getting the publicity and attention that
traditional players enjoy, and rightfully so. On the one hand, Gary Carter's work takes what has been done and elevates it to new heights.
Susan's and Bob's works come to mind, compositions that excite me but that will be glossed over by a generation that can't hear what's
happening. Russ Pahl's re-thinking of the steel layout is significant but doesn't pique the imagination of many who want 'more.'
Zane King has a copedent borrowing from Jimmy Day and Zane Beck in a way that brings him new results. The history of the instrument
can't be denied, but I seem to gain more inspiration from deviations from it, in the same way that I'm trying to figure out how to
incorporate Mr. Emmons last published ideas into a way to achieve something new, with relevance to me, if not to anyone else.

There may be many more, young rogue steelers not steeped in tradition, that may guide the development of the instrument.
The history needs to be recorded--it is, but not in one place--but information will always be lost as new information takes its place.

Billy Carr · Post by **Billy Carr** » 14 Sep 2015 2:56 am

Well, my opinions and thoughts are a little different than what folks might expect. First of all, I'm constantly thinking about different ways to play the same songs. I see that as one of the ways the big name players were able to find new licks and so on. In this effort, guys were making there presence known. Even during times of change each steelman was pretty much known by his first few licks he played on records. Phases come and go but not players styles. We all had to pull from somewhere to learn to play. My early influences were not pedal steel players. At age 13 or 14, I was listening to Jerry Byrd, Little Roy Wiggins, Don Helms and others from that era. I had just started learning PSG at age 14 but something happened on a Friday night at a concert in a little Mississippi town. I met John Hughey at a CT show. 1971 was the year and a five minute visit backstage after the show changed a 14 year old kid's outlook on the PSG. From then on, it was nothing but PSG. Five years of all night woodsheddin' and I was off to the races. Back on topic now, I see players like Jeff Surrat(sp?) building the ShowPro guitars, as part of the future of PSG. PSG needs new ideas and new products that players can take before the public and get feedback on. The Russ Pahl guitar is a prime example. This has the chance to open new avenues for new players that might not be country but instead, can come from R&R, Jazz, Blues or any other area. The coverage that the internet gives players is also a major plus for PSG players/builders/etc. I'd also like to see another female playing PSG and fronting a band like Sarah Jory. Steel players need to be recognized and given the chance to perform/play at concerts in the future. Amp and PSG endorsements need to be readily available for PSG players that travel everywhere and actually get a chance to play more than record fills. The future can be bright for PSG easily. Players like Franklin, Tommy White, Mike Johnson, the Texas players which are to many to name here and yes, RR, along with players on the east and west coast, as well. In addition to these guys, there's also a good sized group of PSG players all throughout the southeast and the northern regions. If people like promoters, booking agents and musical suppliers require groups to use PSG on tours, it could be a nice benefit for all involved. Promoting PSG is like any other business. Just my .02 here!

Bob Hoffnar · Post by **Bob Hoffnar** » 14 Sep 2015 5:24 am

As far as history goes Pete Drake did some amazing innovations. His fake organ work on Nashville Skyline and the invention (or at least use) of the Talk Box come to mind.

I would like to learn more about Sonny Garish and his use of new sounds on recordings in Nashville when traditional steel sounds fell out of favor.

David Mason · Post by **David Mason** » 14 Sep 2015 5:43 am

The harmonic network that Dave Easley draws on to build his solos is well beyond anything I've heard elsewhere. There are any number of guitarists and horn players who inhabit the "post-bop" jazz world, but Dave's the only steeler I know of.

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_ ... onal+steel

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 14 Sep 2015 6:23 am

I think Ralph Mooney changed his approach early in his career. In some of his earliest stuff, his playing exhibited some really profound ability and technique. Later, when he was playing with Owens and Haggard, he seemed to simplify his style, going more for the rippling single-string stuff. He could play in the more common Nashville stylings, but he chose, instead, to try a different approach, and develop his own unique style and sound.

Wally Taylor · Post by **Wally Taylor** » 14 Sep 2015 6:32 pm

Out of the box, you talking out of the box? The most out of the box and forward thinking steel player out there today, is Zane King. Pop, Rock, Country, Gospel, Blues, writes and performs his own material, plays multi instruments of strings and pedals, sings and does it all in the Zane manner that shows off his ability to go from mild manner country to screaming steel that will rip your ears off.
Innovation? No one can touch this guy!

Damir Besic · Post by **Damir Besic** » 14 Sep 2015 7:15 pm

I believe, to get a player who will play "out of the box" you need to give steel guitar to someone who never listened country music, and has no idea who is Buddy Emmons... he would have to come up with his own tuning, and style... another thing is guitar itself .. two necks are unnecessary , one neck with no pedals (knee levers can do all the work), and have a modern, contemporary designer, design the guitar... old rosewood mica wont cut it on modern stages...guitar has to be exciting looking, and played by a talented player who has absolutely no knowledge about our "regular" country style pedal steel... theeen you will get something totally new, and something that will look and sound cool enough to set it up on the stage with modern R&B, Hip Hop or Pop artist ... something that will make kids go "whoa, what is this?" ... when steel guitar starts showing up on MTV or other stations like that, then you know instrument has a future...unfortunately, that steel guitar may not look, or sound like anything we know..or like

Tom Gorr · Post by **Tom Gorr** » 14 Sep 2015 10:35 pm

I have had those same thoughts, Damir. It is an idealization but in a more enhanced and realistic way that person is...as mentioned by the OP... Robert Randolph....A Sacred Steel Tuning that was developed and perfected over a few generations in a non mainstream genre setting. ... and it all came together with a player who could front an act that is memorable and entertaining with very accessible music.

It would be difficult to reproduce that type of phenomena... I am sure bands will form to mimmick aspects of that success until it become mundane and old school to the next generation. Like industry and technology, music evolves sporadically and unpredictably. Like anything in history there are transformative figures that mark each step. The stars line up and shine down on certain people who were just more or less doing their thing.

Joachim Kettner · Post by **Joachim Kettner** » 15 Sep 2015 4:17 am

Melvin Duffy (JCH) with Robbie McIntosh plays in a pretty unusual style in my opinion:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LiiUnl0CKjU
Or better his one:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aegnFhGfmLQ

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 15 Sep 2015 4:18 am

...have a modern, contemporary designer, design the guitar... old rosewood mica wont cut it on modern stages...guitar has to be exciting looking...

You mean, like the average keyboard? Sorry, it's the players that excite the audiences - not their instruments. (IMHO, of course.)

Damir Besic · Post by **Damir Besic** » 15 Sep 2015 4:48 am

yes, you are correct, steel guitar players are very exciting to look at, sitting in one spot for 2 hours, behind a black guitar ... years ago I and a friend of mine took our bands video recording of the live performance to one of the well known Nashville promotors, he told us, when he is watching a tape of the live performance, if nobody moves for 3 minutes on the stage, he pulls out the tape, and throws it in the garbage can...regardless how good they sound....that should tell something about show business...

Dan Burnham · Post by **Dan Burnham** » 15 Sep 2015 5:08 am

Paul,

For me it was Julian Tharpe. Starting with the Take Your Pick Album which I believe was recorded in 1969 to his last Album which I believe was Jet Age. Why? Julian was playing patterns that I had never heard played on pedal steel before. He had the ability to play outside of the beat but make it fit. I had one of my Jazz Professors at UT Martin compare him to Miles Davis. Like you, he could take the E9 section and go outside of the "STANDARD" feels.

He was able to play what he was thinking, and sometimes that conformed and sometimes it didn't. Russ Hicks and I have concluded he was just on a different level and because of that he never got the recognition that was due him.

Julian could play any style, in fact Robert Randolph and Joe Wright both said he was a big influence in their playing.

In conclusion, I think Robert like Julian will never get the recognition like those in the past have received.

Wither people like it or not I believe IMHO Robert is the ambassador for the instrument we love. Who else is reaching the next generation?

Dan

Glenn Demichele · Post by **Glenn Demichele** » 15 Sep 2015 5:08 am

Good one Damir. We have enough effects and amps:the accessory we need is a motorized platform we can drive around the stage with a joystick. Better yet, Paul F could get another two pedals and a couple knee levers named after him...

Damir Besic · Post by **Damir Besic** » 15 Sep 2015 6:24 am

Glenn Demichele wrote:Good one Damir. We have enough effects and amps:the accessory we need is a motorized platform we can drive around the stage with a joystick. Better yet, Paul F could get another two pedals and a couple knee levers named after him...

that would probably help, it helped Garth to became a world wide mega star even with his average voice...right? I am all for a good tone, and classic steel guitar, but that is not what we are talking about here, we are talking about taking steel guitar to masses and to a next level, and how to make it popular in todays world, not about what we like or not like...you may not like Robert Randolph and his tone or playing, but how many major TV shows were you on with your steel guitar? how many young kids and teenagers got interested in steel guitar watching you play, or me for that matter...bottom line is, if steel guitar stays the way you and me like, it will disappear in 15-20 years from now, and that's pushing it...

Mike Neer · Post by **Mike Neer** » 15 Sep 2015 7:06 am

If someone is going to play out of the box, there should no expectation of taking it to the masses. In fact, someone with nothing to lose who doesn't have to succumb to everyone else's professional wishes and demands is the one most likely to have a vision to chase after. This should be encouraged.

If you want to play outside of the box, you have to live outside of the box.

Joachim Kettner · Post by **Joachim Kettner** » 15 Sep 2015 7:15 am

The thing with Robert Randolph, and I don't mean that as an offense, is that he plays a steel, but it sounds more like bottleneck in the style of the Allman Brothers.

Dustin Rhodes · Post by **Dustin Rhodes** » 15 Sep 2015 8:25 am

The thing that is really scary to me is that the big "newcomer" that draws so much drama around here put out their first album 13 years ago.

Wally Moyers · Post by **Wally Moyers** » 15 Sep 2015 8:36 am

Paul, great thread! In 1958 my Dad was playing on a weekly TV show with Bill Mack here in Lubbock, Texas. Waylon Jennings was their guitar player... My Dad was playing a double neck National and was looking for that pedal sound that he had heard on records.. He installed a pull on one string, connected to some linkage to it with a car gas pedal and had his first pedal steel... In those days information traveled slow compared to todays internet, that was both a good thing and bad thing.. The good thing is that instead of copying what someone else had done, players had to more or less re-invent ways of doing the same thing... Paul, you were the first I ever saw playing pedal steel with two pickups. You were playing at the Hall Of Fame, Thumbs was playing guitar that night... I remember loving the sound and enjoy seeing what Russ Pahl and Jeff at Show Pro are doing to further your concept... I know some players that hate to see new concepts but I think it is the only way the instrument can continue to grow... I am currently having one built and will be working with Sean Paden to interface mine with a Kemper Profiler. The Kemper can model any amp and It has many effects including Reverb, Delay, Chorus, Rotary/Leslie etc.. For me this is just a very expensive experiment . It's something I'v had on my mind for 30 years just never had a steel company willing to make it happen. Of Course, the instrument is just part of the equation..

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