The Steel Guitar Forum

Learning to play steel guitar back in the early 1950's was indeed, a challenge.

Because of my rapidly growing record collection of the days most popular vocalists, I was able to discover and learn the distinctive styles including signature phrases of each of these artists.

In those days, the steel men DID NOT sound just like everyone else in the industry. Virtually each guy was playing a guitar of his preference thro' an amp he could afford as well as a unique TUNING that set his music apart from everyone else's.

Steel Guitar 101 was a great learning asset to some of us old timers. There were no 'courses' that featured hit songs of the day and tended to cause all of us to sound just the same........ Oahu sheet music was finally to arrive on the scene and it indeed was a refreshing development.

Hillbilly licks were relegated to hillbilly songs while Hawaiian music featured ONLY that style of steel playing. Smooth steel playing was the order of the day for Foley and Arnold's 'folk music' tunes.

Nothing is more ridiculous sounding to me this day and age than hearing some steel player playing pedal licks from Jeff Newmans' speed picking course in a sweet Hawaiian tune. Just my view from over here.

I tend to avoid surfing the sometimes turbulent waters of Montee Beach, but: I gotta dump a huge ditto on his last point:

Nothing is more ridiculous sounding to me this day and age than hearing some steel player playing pedal licks from Jeff Newmans' speed picking course in a sweet Hawaiian tune.

Rapidfire banjo rolls while A n' B-ing notes in-and-out of unison pulls IS how to peak a country pedal steel solo, and that's just dandy, that's what those notes are there for, and I like to hear that. But an awful lot of pedal steel blues solos start out just fine, at least somewhat thematic, maybe laying out the upcoming notes (which often entails a certain position), weaving a spell... and then BANG! the hypersonic turbo-drive kicks in. And in the context of a mood-type blues, it comes off like calliope clown music (guitarists are just as guilty here of course). Some people "get it" - Dan Tyack, Mr. Emmons, Easley, our own b0b; just SLOW DOWN already, just play half of all those notes. The good half....

The old cliche' comes to mind... I wish I could play that Fast. And if I could... I wouldn't!

Doug,
My friend, Jerry Brightman, can play faster than anyone I've ever heard. But it's always very musical, and appropriate. Same for my friend, Neil Zaza, on six string. He can abdo-lutely blaze! But it's always perfect for the music!
Taste and knowledge can make a big difference. Fast is not always bad!

I was told by Joe Day ( Jimmy Day's oldest brother ) not long ago that after this person and Jimmy were standing by each other when the steel man that was playing just ate up his steel part so fast it was like lightening, the person asked Jimmy -- " can you play that fast "? Jimmy's answer was" why would you want to " ??

The last time I saw Jimmy Day in St. Louis, a "young gun" approached him in the group of us listening to some of his "war stories". His question was: why don't you play anything fast? Jimmy turned to him and said: "I don't need to do I"? With tail between his legs, face white as a sheet, he left!
That short statement pretty well summed it up! Hopefully, one day, this young person will have learned to appreciate style and taste from one of the "Masters"!

Everyone loves to jump on this bandwagon - speed = lack of taste

That seems absurd. Playing long, sustained, vibrato laden lines sounds corny in the wrong place, perfect in the right place. The same is true with speed - burning fast lines in the wrong place sound silly, but in the right place are a perfect expression of the players imagination.

Just because you don't have the ability to play fast, or read music, or play over music with complex harmony, or play lovely Hawaiian music, or slant the bar, or whatever thing it is you have haven't studied or cared about, it doesn't make that technique inherently wrong or "tasteless", no matter what Jimmy Day said.

My opinion, of course.

Music is a form of expression, and for some it is very personal. While there are "accepted standards", I guess, for certain traditional styles, I see no reason why competent players can't use these tunes as vehicles for their own expression. It's been done in jazz and I see no reason why it can't be done with any other music form. Have you ever heard Sonny Rollins' version of Sweet Leilani? How about the many jazz versions of Hawaiian War Chant?

I enjoy playing fast. If I felt it was appropriate to what I was trying to say, I would have no qualms about it. If we aim only please other steel guitarists, what does that bode for the future of the instrument?

I know I'm in a minority when it comes to these views here, but I look forward to seeing where else the instrument is headed. There's already enough of the other stuff that's been done.

Doug Beaumier wrote:The old cliche' comes to mind... I wish I could play that Fast. And if I could... I wouldn't!

FYI: I posted this above as a joke. I guess some forum members thought I was serious. I love all steel playing, fast, slow, shuffles, waltzes, blues, rock, exotic tunes, etc. I've played a lot of fast instrumentals on steel, hundreds of times on bandstands, including many steel shows. Of course I understand that there is a time to speedpick and a time to play smooth and easy.

I think Ray's point in this thread is that a lot of steel players sound alike today... like clones of each other. As Ray said, they sound like they're playing exercises from a Jeff Newman book, and play cliche' A&B pedal licks in all songs, all styles of music, even Hawaiian. He's also saying that the great steel players of yesteryear had their own UNIQUE sound. I agree with that. When I hear Curly, Lloyd, Byrd, the Big E, Speedy, Alvino, Santo, Kayton... I can tell who is playing within about 5 seconds! Nowadays, who knows?

People cared about steel guitar back then, and players were probably encouraged to step out and be inventive. It's not the same atmosphere today.

Being a steel player trying to work on my own voice, I have to be honest and say that I don't listen to other steel players anymore, except for one or two, but it's not because I don't care. You are right, I am not able to pick out individual players easily anymore, but only because I'm not familiar with their styles.

About 30 years ago Paul Franklin said that he didn't listen to other steel guitarists much. At that time he was listening more to horn players and other musicians because he wanted to expand his playing and not sound like all the other steel players. I thought that was interesting because at that time I was working hard trying to sound like all the other steel players!

Because Paul had all the chops he needed, but he was not going to find the musical language he was looking for from steel players, who are way behind the curve in that respect.

What Christopher said.

To some extent, it's the double edged sword of available education. We find the same problem in the jazz world - on the one hand, your average player's chops and understanding of the music is far above the average guy in the past, but on the other hand, there is a much greater tendency to all sound pretty much alike. The vast difference between Charlie Parker and the other players of his day is a pretty good example of how things have changed.

Overall, I think it's better this way - very supportive of greater ability sooner in a player's musical life, personally. I hope that the instructors teach the importance of a personal style, and that, in soaking up knowledge, the students strive to find their own take on whatever music they play. I don't know many steel guitar instructors personally, but I do know that Maurice Anderson's approach was very much about helping the student find an individual voice, along with learning the basic concepts of steel guitar.

All of this reminds me of a song. "To Each His Own".

Christopher (and just about anyone else), many players of ALL instruments listen to the high-speed players and strive to copy those chops, and I'd say that's actually a GOOD thing, as it develops technical merit quicker.
BUT, in seeking to copy Crawford/Rugg/Parker/DiMeola/Gatton/Reno (listen to Don's double-time banjo work: I can't even LISTEN that fast), many newer players neglect that the cats they emulate SAY something with those virtuosic outbursts.
Listen, for example, to Melinda's beautifully played "Hallelujah". The outbursts therein do not strike me as showboating, but thrown in because the cats she draws from play bits like that, but the piece could benefit from some more understatement, which I am SURE will come in time. I agree with Bob Carlucci's assessment of her as a good musician who will assuredly become an excellent one. The key is knowing WHEN to explode and when yo hold back.
Chops are great: judgment is better

Side note: Tom was one of the seriously high-energy bass players in bluegrass throughout the 60s, and he says one of the most important lessons in his musicianship came when Bill Emerson fired him after repeatedly asking him to just play 1-5-1-5 when the high energy wasn't needed.

Christopher (and just about anyone else), many players of ALL instruments listen to the high-speed players and strive to copy those chops, and I'd say that's actually a GOOD thing, as it develops technical merit quicker.
BUT, in seeking to copy Crawford/Rugg/Parker/DiMeola/Gatton/Reno (listen to Don's double-time banjo work: I can't even LISTEN that fast), many newer players neglect that the cats they emulate SAY something with those virtuosic outbursts.
Listen, for example, to Melinda's beautifully played "Hallelujah". (Found here: http://youtu.be/nDJ4toUavBg if you like)The outbursts therein do not strike me as showboating, but thrown in because the cats she draws from play bits like that, but the piece could benefit from some more understatement, which I am SURE will come in time. I agree with Bob Carlucci's assessment of her as a good musician who will assuredly become an excellent one. The key is knowing WHEN to explode and when yo hold back.
Chops are great: judgment is better

Side note: Tom was one of the seriously high-energy bass players in bluegrass throughout the 60s, and he says one of the most important lessons in his musicianship came when Bill Emerson fired him after repeatedly asking him to just play 1-5-1-5 when the high energy wasn't needed.

Everything Mike Neer said.

BTW: those who say Day didn't play fast haven't been paying attention. Check out his C Jam Blues.

just SLOW DOWN already, just play half of all those notes.

Well, I feel I have the opposite problem. I'm stuck at MM 70 for sixteenth notes since a VERY long time.

Every tick higher and control diminishes exponentially (from a relative peak, of course).

How do I break the speed barrier?

1: What do you mean by "very long time"?
2: I've found that thinking about HOW to play slows down thinking WHAT to play.
Assuming you're working from either memorized passages or tab or somethinging else, try taking one of those passages you've been stuck on, and playing it along with a faster song and just see if it works better that way.
I REALLY believe that, unless there's a neurological or other organic problem slowing down the fingers, that the speed limiting factor is thinking about what to play, rather than getting the notes from brain to fingers.

Ulrich Sinn wrote:

just SLOW DOWN already, just play half of all those notes.

Well, I feel I have the opposite problem. I'm stuck at MM 70 for sixteenth notes since a VERY long time.

Every tick higher and control diminishes exponentially (from a relative peak, of course).

How do I break the speed barrier?

This is difficult to explain and there will be others who disagree, but the way I have begun approaching it is like this: instead of letting my fingers operate individually and from the metacarpals down (basically the entire finger), I shorten the movement of my fingers by locking them at the proximal joint (the second joint up from the tips) and find I have more control and better power. It is easier for me to play varying sequences, such as 1-2-3, 1-3-2, 3-2-1, 3-1-2, etc.

Most of this came from experimenting, but reading Kochevitsky's book about the development of piano technique and the role of the central nervous system in it all really motivated me. I find that I can use techniques that I was never able to before, such as sweeping or even, to a small degree, rest strokes.

Of course, having the content to play is a huge part of it, and improvisation adds a dimension of difficulty and uncertainty as to what is coming next, so it really is a matter of trying to be as focused as possible, playing what your brain and your ears are telling you to play.

I'm pick blocking, I'm playing mostly non-pedal.

I find left hand control as difficult as the right hand.
I battle very much with whole step movement - probably as much as with the right hand -, especially with direction changes.

It feels like there has to be a trick to "snap" the bar back and forth so it does not become a wash of sloppy glissandi between whole tones.

Trick being of course a poor choice of words.

Banjo rolls on a dobro are not really a problem (free stroke). I can do that at tempo that is satisfying enough for me...

Ulrich, I guess these are some of the things that make us all unique players. We all have our own ways of dealing with those challenges.

There are some times I want to have the slippery sound of Freddie Roulette, but other times when it's not the desired sound, and because of the difficulty of a line, I might have trouble getting it crisp and clean.

During those times is when I really work hard to come up with a solution to change something, rather than just repeating it over and over hoping for improvement. I guess my message is to all steel players: yes, there is a standard way of playing regarding technique, but sometimes we have to go even further in order to say what we mean.

Improving right hand speed can come from being surer of bar placement.
If you want to get faster at that, I'd try practicing ballads with a blindfold. Trust your hands to find your frets, with some guidance from the ears.
I still think the biggest decelerant is having to think about how to play.