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Topic: Taking the plunge into Pedalville. |
Ron Landis
From:
Arkansas, USA
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Posted 19 Aug 2014 5:15 pm |
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I got hooked on steels a few years ago. It started with a dobro, then I got a little six string lap steel. But that wasn't enough. Soon I found I needed more and then I started hitting the the harder stuff like D-8 Richenbackers and T-8 Fenders.
Lately some of my friends have been urging me to get a pedal steel so we can do some classic country. Frankly, I don't know where to start and if I really have the time to invest in such a demanding instrument. I'm 60 years young and figure it may take another 60 years to learn how to play the guitar with my knees and feet.
I guess it wouldn't be so daunting if I started with a simple arrangement and work into bigger guitars. Generally I can pick things up pretty quick, but I've always been afraid of the psg. It looks about as easy as flying a 747.
Someone talk me out of this. I really do enjoy playing lap steel. But I shore do like that big sound too.  |
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Don McGregor
From:
Memphis, Tennessee
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Posted 19 Aug 2014 5:41 pm
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My journey has pretty much paralleled yours. After a life time of guitar, I went deep into steel. Then, I took the pedal steel plunge. I am 64, and having a blast learning pedal steel. I still love my double 8 non-pedals, and currently building my second instrument, but pedal land is a whole 'nother adventure.
I was pleasantly surprised to find out my feet and knees actually are musical, and willing to work along with my hands and ears to coax sounds I like from this machine. It's fun. Do it. We need more steel in Arkansas. |
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Bob Blair
From:
Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
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Posted 19 Aug 2014 6:01 pm
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| Just get one - you'll probably love it and it won't be nearly as hard as you think to get going. Lots of options, but if you want simple get a single 10 E9 with 3 pedals and 4 or 5 knee levers. But even if you get sometime like a D-10, or an S-10 that is a bit more tricked out, no worries as the basic stuff will be all there. There are a lot of good guitars out there. And with your background you might get a kick out of having both the E9 and C6 right away. |
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Tom Gorr
From:
Three Hills, Alberta
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Posted 19 Aug 2014 8:56 pm
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| If you know how to pick, block, and slide between frets whilst staying on pitch, you're already through the thickest part of the weeds. |
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James Jacoby
From:
Ohio, USA
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Posted 19 Aug 2014 10:21 pm
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| Tom Gorr wrote: |
| If you know how to pick, block, and slide between frets whilst staying on pitch, you're already through the thickest part of the weeds. |
Boy, you're right about that! When I started out, I thought, the pedals, and levers would be the hardest to learn, but I soon found out, that the most difficult part was right on top! -Jake- |
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Ian Rae
From:
Redditch, England
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Posted 20 Aug 2014 12:29 am
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What Tom says. I'm 63 and I've been playing a year. Never played with finger picks before and wish I had. The pedals I find pretty obvious. You can get a lot of the sounds your friends long to hear with one foot on just two of them, and take it on from there.
_________________
Make sleeping dogs tell the truth!
Homebuilt keyless U12 7x5, Excel keyless U12 8x8, Williams keyless U12 7x8, Telonics rack and 15" cabs |
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Lane Gray
From:
Topeka, KS
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Posted 20 Aug 2014 3:10 am
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If you can play the lap steel and Dobro, it's not a huge jump to pedal steel.
I would NOT start with a stripped down guitar: if you think 4 knees would be daunting, tape everything but the E lowers up. As soon as you get the hang of one, and can wrap your head around the chord theory, you're ready for 5.
You're in the wrong room if you want people to talk you out of it.
_________________
2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects
Last edited by Lane Gray on 20 Aug 2014 7:00 am; edited 34 times in total |
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Ned McIntosh
From:
New South Wales, Australia
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Posted 20 Aug 2014 4:22 am
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The 747 is not that hard to fly. Once you know how.
Pedal-steel is not that hard to play. Once you know how.
You're on the forum, so you're officially off to a good start! Have fun, ask lots of questions, and enjoy. 
_________________
The steel guitar is a hard mistress. She will obsess you, bemuse and bewitch you. She will dash your hopes on what seems to be whim, only to tease you into renewing the relationship once more so she can do it to you all over again...and yet, if you somehow manage to touch her in that certain magic way, she will yield up a sound which has so much soul, raw emotion and heartfelt depth to it that she will pierce you to the very core of your being. |
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Ron Landis
From:
Arkansas, USA
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Posted 20 Aug 2014 4:53 am
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Wow, already you guys make me feel like this is a do-able thing. I started out 40+ years ago on the banjo so I can pick and block and my intonation is better than a lot of steelers I've heard.
So, there are a few of them for sale right here. I'm sort of thinking now that I should just go jump head first with a D-10. I think I would like two tunings since I'm pretty familiar with C6 already.
I don't get some of the terminology. Emmons set up... push pull... What would you all suggest as a starter for someone who doesn't want to spend a lot of time with the mechanical aspects of this this instrument? I don't mind spending the money on a good one. |
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Lane Gray
From:
Topeka, KS
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Posted 20 Aug 2014 6:07 am
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OK, I'll try to answer some of those
Push-pull: a changer technology from the mid-60s, only really made by three companies. They have a subtly different sound, that most steel players like.
When properly set up and left alone, they play really well. But if amateurs start wrenching on them, they can get bollixed up pretty badly. I would only recommend a novice buy one straight from a reputable rebuilder. They're also kinda pricy. Push-pull means that the finger that the string is on gets pulled to raise the pitch and that finger rests inside another finger that gets pushed towards the endplate to lower them. Modern guitars are all-pull, which uses a scissors-like arrangement to pull to lower.
Emmons setup vs Day: regardless of where they are on the guitar, the A pedal raises the Bs to C#, the B pedal raises the G#s to A and the the C pedal raises 4 and 5 à whole step. Jimmy Day and others have them mounted CBA when seen from the seat, while Buddy Emmons and others have them ABC. Neither is better than the other.
_________________
2 pedal steels, a lapStrat, and an 8-string Dobro (and 3 ukes)
More amps than guitars, and not many effects
Last edited by Lane Gray on 20 Aug 2014 6:23 am; edited 3 times in total |
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Tom Gorr
From:
Three Hills, Alberta
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Posted 20 Aug 2014 6:21 am
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| Ron Landis wrote: |
Wow, already you guys make me feel like this is a do-able thing. I started out 40+ years ago on the banjo so I can pick and block and my intonation is better than a lot of steelers I've heard.
So, there are a few of them for sale right here. I'm sort of thinking now that I should just go jump head first with a D-10. I think I would like two tunings since I'm pretty familiar with C6 already.
I don't get some of the terminology. Emmons set up... push pull... What would you all suggest as a starter for someone who doesn't want to spend a lot of time with the mechanical aspects of this this instrument? I don't mind spending the money on a good one. |
By the sound of it, you should buy the absolute best one you can afford.
The biggest difference I have found between the guitars i've played is the 'feel'...eg, the stiffness and travel length of the pedals and levers, also how the bar carries on the strings.
An understated aspect of feel is the shape and angle of the foot pedals, particularly if you join the better part of society that plays in barefeet and stocking in livingrooms (and barrooms, too). There's some manufacturers past and present that did an awful job on shaping their pedals, imo, and some that just nailed it. Of my guitars, my MSA is by far the most comfy on my feet...medium sized surface area with smooth edges and a nice contour. Not to mention it's a rock solid guitar in every respect.
Some guitars a person bonds with, others not so much, it's important to keep an open mind and try before you buy if you can.
Most (used) D 10's transact in the 2-3k range. There are outliers on either side. If you have 2500 and patience, a guitar will surface that you will be happy with.
Edit: added "used" when indicating price range.
Last edited by Tom Gorr on 20 Aug 2014 8:51 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Lane Gray
From:
Topeka, KS
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Ron Landis
From:
Arkansas, USA
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Posted 20 Aug 2014 2:41 pm
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Thanks guys. This info really helps a lot. I decided to take a trip to Nashville and visit the Steel Guitar shop so I can try out a few different ones. I'm going that way anyway and figured I could spend a day and get better informed and have a wider selection there. I stopped there on a Saturday back in March I think but the store was closed and Bobby had passed just a few weeks later.
I've got a pretty good budget to work with and may be selling some of my other guitars once I get settled on a good pedal steel. I've got way too many right now. 2 T8s 2 D8s, 2 D6 Fenders, and more 6 and 7 string laps than I can count. You can't swing a dead cat around here without hitting a guitar of some sort so it's time to thin the herd down to just the ones I play regularly. |
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John Billings
From:
Ohio, USA
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Posted 21 Aug 2014 12:17 pm
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| If you can already fingerpick, you have a huge leg-up advantage on other beginners! Do you play standard 6-string guitar too? If so, put a capo on the 4th fret, and finger a C chord, which will, of course be an E chord with the capo. Forget about the steel's first two strings for a minute. What are the notes on your capo guitar? G#EBG#. What are the the notes of strings 3,4,5 and 6 on the steel? G#EBG#. My instructor handed me a guitar and had me do that. Then he showed me that the 1st pedal raised the B to C#, and had me change my fingering on the 6-string to reflect that, and asked me what I had. C#m, the first relative minor in the key of E. Then he added the second pedal to the first, raising the G#s to As, and had me re-finger the guitar. "Whacha got?" he asked. 5th fret A chord on the 6- string. My brain took off from there. Relate the pedals and levers to stuff you already know! I was gigging in 4 weeks. Not playing fancy, but playing! |
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