The Steel Guitar Forum

I have an interesting little problem with string 8 on my Carter. When I raise the string to F, it comes back a little sharp. Not enough to hear that much, but can be seen on a tuner. And when I lower it, it comes back in tune. Usually, lowering a string could cause it to come back sharp. That doesn't happen on my guitar. The guitar is lubed and there are no binding problems. No string balls in the changer. I am going to examine the brass pin that the rod goes around.

Would the return spring affect the raise from coming back to pitch? I don't want to go cutting loops off the spring if I don't have to.

Also, my 3rd string. When I tune up at the start of the gig, it will either be real flat or real sharp when hitting the B pedal. One time it will be flat, the next it will be sharp. Once the change is in tune, it stays there for the whole gig. Also going to check the brass pull pin on that one too. If the pin is about to wear through, it will cause tuning issues on the pull. This has been the case twice on my guitar already.

Richard,
I have noticed this on the fourth string of my Carter. (Returning sharp). When I mentioned this to Al Brisco at "Steel Guitars Of Canada", he said it was "just the nature of the beast" and nothing could be done to fix it. I have learned to compensate and it really doesn't' bother me now.
Maybe someone else has some thoughts.

Richard, after a raise, if you lightly touch the string in the keyhead area does the pitch lower slightly and end up true?

If so, this is often caused by rollers -- but you said you lubed the roller. Sometimes they get a flat spot worn in the groove and don't want to turn, so try rotating it a quarter turn.

Another related problem is that the rollers don't turn as well if the string is put on the tuning post such that it cuts at an angle after crossing the roller. For example, you might run into this if you put an excessive number of wraps on the 8th string's tuning post so that it is coming off the extreme bottom of the post (the end nearest the tuning machine). Try using fewer wraps on the post and it should make the string line up straighter across the roller. Other guitars may be different, but I think one and a half to two warps works well for the 8th string on a Carter.

I doubt this would work because it will increase the angle, but if all else fails you can experiment by wrapping the 8th string starting from the bottom so that the string exits the post at the top end (away from the machine head). A lot people do this on their 5th and 6th strings to keep them lined up as straight as possible over the rollers, but maybe your 8th string could benefit from this as well if there's binding on one side of that roller but not the other.

Richard if you don't have worn out dog bones make sure that your changer has lots of lubrication.
I had that problem on mine and it turned out to be both
Pullers and lack of enough lube on the changer

This only affects my 8th string. Have never had a problem with the 4th string. This started happening about a month ago after changing strings. So, I replaced the string with another, and it does the same thing. The brand and gauges I use are the same.

The strings travel pretty much in a straight line from roller to tuning key. The only ones that don't are strings 5 & 6, and not by much.

My changer is well lubricated.

Every time I change a string, I physically roll the roller and sometimes even lube it (in between normal lube times twice a year).

Well, now it is the opposite. When raising the string to F, it comes back in tune and the lower comes back flat. Tried pushing on the string behind the roller with no luck.

I think I will loosen the string and lube and re-position the roller.

Richard...I had that on my 5th string. After a raise it returned sharp, then using another pedal to raise the same string, it cured it...Mine's a Universal. All it turned out to be was the little brass thingy that the pull rod hooks onto. On close inspection it was a little worn.It wasn't 100% round. Had a spare one fixed in place, problem sorted...And there was I wondering if it was something "BIG" like the Changer that had to be fixed. Carters are "low" maintenance but I guess I thought they were "NO" maintenance. I now lube all those brass bits, and no more problems. I have a few spare ones. I got that guitar in the year 2001 I believe, and that's the only problem I've had...and I do "mash" the pedals and knee levers,I'm quite a heavy handed player. The mechanics are top notch. Any steel as you know can have problems. My Sho-Bud universal had one of the teardrop levers just snap off once, and considering it wasn't one of the "Pot metal" Sho-Buds it took me by suprise. Guess Steels are like cars...you get a good one and a pal who has the same model says his is a big NO NO

Micky "scars" Byrne U.K.

I've had 2 of the dog bones break in two on me. Both times on stage. I'll have to check it out. Today I was changing the 6th string raise to a different bell crank hole and while doing it, I notice the 3rd string start to pull the lower finger and the spring would snap it back into position. I replaced it with the spring from the half stop finger. Fixed it right up. Have the same problem on string 6 too. I ordered some parts and some springs from Al Brisco. I didn't have any other fingers that did not have changes on, so I couldn't swap the springs.

And, did you know that if you unscrew the screw on the spring, it flies clear across the room. I learned the hard way.

Richard...it flew across the room?? I remember years ago I had a S-10 Emmons P/P ...I'm no steel mechanic but I was messing about underneath, and I undid some screw trying to be clever, and a few bits flew out. Luck was on my side, by a fluke I managed to get it together for the gig. This was in Germany...I was loaned the Emmons from the steel guitar shop, till my ZB arrived from Phoenix.
I forgot to tell you one of the Carter "Dumbells" broke on me too...at a concert. Lucky it was the last number and we had a break before the next band did their set. We took the Carter into our dressing room and found one of those metal type coat hangers. A little bit of bending etc and we managed to get a small piece in a horse shoe shape, enough to hook on the pull rod. It worked well for the rest of the evening on our next set, and I was able to repair it properly the next day at home.I guess by lubing those "dumbells" fairly often will help those problems. I just use a drop of sewing machine oil

Micky "scars" Byrne U.K.

The first one that broke was on my 5th string raise. About 15 minutes before we were done. Of course, there is not much you can do without that raise. Of course they want to do Together Again. I just played chords on my C6 neck. Stupid me, I could have played the song using the C pedal in place of the A pedal. The 2nd one broke in the middle of the first set of two we played. I can't remember if it was the 3rd or 6th string. So I had to play the rest of set 1 and set 2 without that change. Again, stupid me. I carry spare dog bones, and our break was 30 minutes. I could have repaired it during the break and been able to play the 2nd set like it was supposed to be played.

Richard...mine that broke was the 3rd string pull...we all .. (The band), saw it fly across the stage floor. As I said it was the last number before a break. Took me a few second to realise it was from my steel till I tried to raise the 3rd. Poor you,it's hard work looseing the 5th string pull. On the subject of things going wrong on the last song of a set...slightly going off this thread, I blew the Black Widow in my Vegas 400 I had at the time. I managed to borrow an amp for the last set. Next day I had to call Peavey U.K. to send a new basket ASAP

Micky "scars" Byrne U.K.

Wow. It takes a lot to blow out a Black Widow. I ordered some of the brass barrels that have the set screw to tighten on the rod from Al Brisco, like they use on the knee levers. I am going to put them on all the pulls on pedals A,B and C. I read somewhere here or in a PM that you can use these in place of the dog bones.