The Steel Guitar Forum

I wonder why PSG manufactures don’t offer a C6 single neck guitar as a standard tuning. All you ever see are ads for E9 single neck guitars.

I would think that anyone with some musical knowledge might look at the possibility of moving to pedal steel and see that they come standard in the key of E. This alone might deter them pursuing the move any farther. If we offered a guitar upfront that was tuned in the key of C they might take a second look at it.

To me if I need to really know what is going on my E9 neck I transpose everything to the key of C, figure out the information I need and then transpose it back to the key of choice.

If the builders that offer entry level guitars could have a standard setup of C6 it might attract some who have shied away because of the E9th tuning. I realize that it would require at least five pedals and two knee levers and this could add to the cost, but it shouldn’t be prohibitive.

Let me hear your thoughts.
LeRoy

Harry Hess has a Fessenden S-10 C6. Jerry set it up for him so the 5 pedals are in the middle of the guitar like a double neck. Jerry will be glad to make more.

LeRoy, most beginnning steelers already know how to play guitar. They can relate to the E9 neck as if playing bar chords on a regular guitar neck. Also, most beginners want to get that country sound, which is easier to get with the E9 neck and pedals. But you're right, for learning what all the pedals and knees do, it helps to transpose the E9 copedent into C.

I think the term would be "common set-up" rather than "standard set-up" Way-way back when mfg's began building pedal steel guitars, which was back when I was still a young kid(ha-ha), they were refered to as custom built guitars and were mostly built only when ordered except companys like FENDER where the FENDER 1000 was a standard guitar that was made on an assembly line and all or nearly all were identical. But when you ordered a pedal steel you usually told the co. what you wanted the pedals to do if you knew anything about them, and if not you tried to find someone who knew a little more about them and coached you along. And then someone came up with new ideas for some changes that were different, and you either had your guitar worked on by the people who built it in the first place or you tried to change it yourself, and maybe messed it up and had to order a new one. but generally speaking pedal steel guitars were always and still are custom built and you can have any tuning and pedal set-up you want. And before long a huge industry was developed which will eventually be like the auto industry. A store on every corner in every city and town in the nation! HALLELUJAH! (whuea, I had to get my Hymnal out for that one!) "Big John" Bechtel Nashville, TN

I have seen a Bennet single neck C6 (in UK)

slightly off topic, but . . .
why transpose E9 to C???? Just to understand the relationships of the notes? (like C is the tonic, E is the third, etc.) Learning scale and chord construction based on numeric scale tones rather than note names could really pay off. That's the basis for the 'Nashville Number System' and is an excellent way to approach scales and chords. You never have to even think about transposing or what key you're in. Plus, most good musicians communicate with numbers much more than actual chord names.

Slightly more on topic, I played guitar for years before learning steel so E at the nut comes naturally to me. When I briefly played C6 I found I had to constantly think about the key/fret relationships. Maybe it's not true for everybody, but I find the E neck much easier to navigate and understand and the key of E to be much more comfortable as the open, 'home' position/key.

Just my opinion.

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<small>Larry Bell - email: larry@larrybell.org - gigs - Home Page
2000 Fessenden S-12 8x8, 1969 Emmons S-12 6x6, 1971 Dobro

I am comfortable on both C6 and E9. I just love them both, and after 54yrs. at it, I play just as bad on either one!! Love, "Big John"

uhh<FONT SIZE=1 COLOR="#8e236b"><p align=CENTER>[This message was edited by Bob Hoffnar on 24 August 2002 at 02:28 PM.]</p></FONT>

Larry is right. The number system is the way to go to understand scales and chords in any key. However, I started on piano as a kid. I can easily picture the C scale on a piano and instantly know where the black notes are. With the number system, I have to think about it to remember which numbers have accidentals between them.

By the way, I don't know when the number system got labelled the "Nashville system." I learned it in music theory on piano as a kid (but not as well as the C scale). It goes back forever in classical music.

With a little experience you can learn any neck. A lot of us know the G neck on a dobro. The thing I find difficult is to try to learn all of the different ways to look at the standard E9 and C6 necks on pedal steel. On E9 with the AB pedals down it becomes an A neck (root on the 6 string). With the A pedal and LKL you get a C# neck (root on the 10 string). Let off on the LKL and with just the A pedal you have a C# minor neck (root on 10 string). With the B and C pedals you have an F#m neck (root on the 7 string). On the C6 neck, you can consider the root on the bottom A (8th string) and you have an A neck with a nice A modal (no 3rds) chord every other string, and minor and blues scale notes between the A chord strings. Also, if you consider the 9th string the root you have an F neck on strings 9, 8 and 6. Any open strings that give you a chord give you a whole neck in the key of the root of that chord. You quickly reach a point of diminishing returns trying to think like this. But knowing a few of these "necks" can be useful.