The Steel Guitar Forum

I had a new player come to my house today to get some help learning to play steel. He has years of experience playing guitar but the steel is totally new to him. We went through setting up the guitar and tuning. I thought I would get him started on blocking so I gave him the usual three note palm blocking exercise. He sat down and played in flawlessly using pick blocking which he is comfortable with from playing the guitar. I was somewhat reluctant to show him the palm blocking method after this.
My own experience is very similar. I started out teaching myself steel years ago without the benefit of any instruction and due to my guitar background I pickblocked naturally. When I finally made contact with other steel players they told me I should be palm blocking. I had never even heard of blocking period. I went and unlearned my pickblocking method and moved on to what everyone else was doing. When Paul Franklin came along I realized I might have made an error. I have tried to go back to pickblocking over the years but the best I can do is pick block with two fingers not three.
So what would you guys advise this new player?

I wish I had learned pick blocking from the start. I block with the palm and the little finger and can see the advantages of pick blocking. It's like anything else, what works for you I guess.

If he has the physical moves for pick blocking already, the last thing you want to do, in my view, is mess with that. Paul Franklin is but one example of a top pro who pick blocks. Joe Wright advocates teaching pick blocking to beginners, and that makes a lot of sense to me now that I have shifted to being predominantly a pick blocker. If you feel that he needs help that you, as a palm blocker (and a real good one at that) can't give him you might want to get him to have a look at Joe's "Wright Hand" video.

<SMALL>"So what would you guys advise this new player?" </SMALL>

I'd make him aware of the different types of blocking, including left hand blocking, advise him to try to learn them all.

He'll select what works best for him, but no one technique is correct in all situations.
I believe you should have all tools available and use what's best for each situation.

Having been a 6-stringer first, Pick Blocking is quite natural to me. My study of Joe Wright's material is also a reason for this choice.

Joey,

Amen and amen and amen!

Pick blocking is wonderful. And as mentioned PF is the absolute king at this. NO one can touch his touch .

But palm blocking has its place to. WHO on earth could ever argue with the touch and tone of a Jerry Bryd. He never pick blocked in his life!

So learn both while you are young. It is impossible when old. I can guarantee you that!

God bless you in whatever you do,

carl

Bruce get him a copy of my video "The Mechanical Advantage" with the section on thr ring finger under style and then he will have two blocking styles he can choose to use, plus the palm style you can teach him. He will be the hit of the party.

Larry Behm

When I get a new kid student that can naturally do something well I do my best not to screw him up with my preconceptions.

Bob

A little off the subject but, Bruce, it is great to see that there are new players in the area. Hopefully, it won't be long before I am not the only steel player showing up on jam night at the bars. I never get to see or hear other players these days. Sure would be nice to hear a few pickers who know what they are doing instead of my untrained version of faking it.

I palm blocked for years, and in 1998 I took a Joe Wright class, I started to learn pick blocking, getting to use it in limited cases. I recentl took another class from Joe and am practicing it again, and I'm almost able to do my rolls with pick blocking. Hopefully be the time I'm steeling live again I'll have it and palm blocking down.

I would try to learn both. I had a teacher when I first started who could only palm block. He was very limited in his playing. His right hand technique was very limited. I was also a natural pick blocker. I use both styles today but lean far more towards pick blocking especially on the high speed stuff. You won't get there just palm blocking.

I would tell him how he was picking/blocking is just fine. Then I'd tell him that there are other ways to block and that he should maybe wait a while to take on the "other" way.
I feel that student needs some comfort level with playing steel and some musical output to keep their intrest level up before they try to fine tune "how" they do things.
If your student is comfortable with pick-blocking on steel from his 6 stg playing, I would let him go with the flow of what his brain already knows how to make his fingers do when he plays music.
I would do the same thing for a new player that just naturally palm blocked.
I'd tell him to let pick-blocking wait a while. IMHO
JE:-)>

I'll tell you what I actually told him. I explained my predicament as outlined in this thread. I then reluctantly went through a step by step description of how to do palm blocking. I also showed him how you can actually lift the bar as a method of blocking to play fast songs like Orange Blossom Special. With his natural ability I am sure he will achieve, like all of us, what works for him.
From this point I recomended he get a copy of Winnie Winston's bible,Pedal Steel Guitar and I will try to help him iron out the details.
Surprisingly enough he then wanted me to explain vibrato bar control and when he played it appeared that he had spent some time getting a handle on this.
You know when you see someone is this eager, somehow all of this becomes fun again!!!!

MYTH: Palm blockers can't play fast
Listen to Buddy Emmons, Doug Jernigan, Mike Smith, and many other players who primarily palm block. IT IS NOT A LIMITATION UNLESS YOU LET IT BE. There is one fact about palm blocking that must be dealt with, however. The further you let your right hand stray from the strings, the longer it will take to get it back in position to block. I see beginners pick a note and their hand flies up like it's lighter than air; then they can't figure out why their hand is out of position to play the next note or block the one they just played. It's simply economy of motion. Don't use it as an excuse: WORK ON IT. You can bet the players mentioned above did.

Take a lesson from Joe Wright. I was playing a show in Michigan with him last year and noticed that he was just sitting in the green room practicing palm blocking. Even though he is one of the cleanest pick blockers on the planet, Joe recognized that there are subtle nuances that the various blocking techniques bring to the table. Try to play a Jimmie Crawford style 'half-mute' by pick blocking.

Think of a carpenter with a tool belt. If you may need to turn a GREAT BIG SCREW with a screwdriver and you only have that little dinky one in your tool belt, you're not gonna be a very effective carpenter. On the steel, most of these tools CAN'T BE BOUGHT. There isn't a contraption or an electronic gizmo that will block your notes for you

Just my slant.

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<small>Larry Bell - email: larry@larrybell.org - gigs - Home Page
2000 Fessenden S-12 8x8, 1969 Emmons S-12 6x6, 1971 Emmons D-10 9x9, 1971 Dobro

It would be nice to have an extra tool in my toolbox. I wish I could master pick blocking but I'm a palm/ring finger blocker. When my hand is in correct my picking position, the notes are all blocked by default; in other words, incorporated into the picking motion, I lift my hand ever-so-slightly to release the note and let it ring, after which my hand falls the minimal distance required to re-silence the note.

Also, with single note playing in which the bar is being moved, I often block the just-played note with either the ring finger or thumb of the left hand, with the rear end of the bar raised just slightly. This is an old Hawaiian technique that John Ely showed me years ago.

Tommy White is a palm blocker primarily and I challenge anyone to say he's hampered with speed picking!

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Herb's Steel Guitar Pages
Texas Steel Guitar Association

Actually, guys like Jernigan and Herby Wallace will tell you that they do both types of blocking.

Frank,
Which do you think they'd consider their primary blocking technique? If you told them they could only use one or the other, which would they choose?

I'd wager both would say palm and that pick blocking is more a matter of convenience with certain string combos and situations. Same is true of Emmons. You could almost call the 'third fingertip' technique he, Mike Cass, Herb Steiner, and others use pick blocking, even though there's no pick on that finger. It may be a similar concept -- actually it's kind of a hybrid of the two.

And those who mentioned the left thumb and ring finger behind the bar -- that's a very useful technique that makes a lot of right hand blocking unnecessary. Bottom line is to do what works best FOR YOU, in my opinion.

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<small>Larry Bell - email: larry@larrybell.org - gigs - Home Page
2000 Fessenden S-12 8x8, 1969 Emmons S-12 6x6, 1971 Emmons D-10 9x9, 1971 Dobro

<SMALL>MYTH: Palm blockers can't play fast</SMALL>

Just a thought about the Forum. As great as it is as a vehicle for spreading good, useful information about the steel, it also, in uninformed hands can be used to spread useless, inaccurate ideas. This "myth" is an example of something that only exists because of a few ill-informed players stating it in the Forum, and others equally naive soaking it up, and restating it. Oh well, the cost of freedom. Wouldn't have it any other way, but at times it can be frustrating.

Albert Svenddal plays the "far" out of a PSG and he palm blocks all the way. He is incredibly fast and clean. His OBS will put tingles on your spine.

carl

As usual, Mr. Lampert said a mouthfull in fewer words than I'm capable of .
(warning: lecture ahead)
The only silver bullet is HARD WORK. Perhaps it's just human nature, but steel players seem to fall for a couple of traps WAAAY TOO OFTEN.
examples:
1. "Buy this (insert whatever fx device, amp, guitar, pickup, volume pedal, video, tab course, etc.) -- it will improve your sound 500%"
2. "If you use the same equipment as (insert hero's name -- Hughey, Emmons, etc.) you will sound like them -- or at least as good as them"
3. "If you really want to progress you will learn how to (read tab, pick block, understand music theory, take lessons from a great player, etc.)"

The reality (to me, anyway):
1. BALONEY!
2. A good steel guitar player can make beautiful music from a 2x4 with strings and a pickup and a cheap amp. The reason they can do that is hard work.
3. Technique and process are only the blueprint. All that goes out the door when the product is finished. A listener couldn't care less HOW that beautiful sound was made, but if you make beautiful music that speaks to them, they will come back for more. A teacher is good to get you on the right track, but they won't LEARN you, they can only SHOW you or (if they're good and lucky) TEACH you.

In my experience, what really determines progress playing steel guitar is hard work, smart work, and careful listening. THERE IS NO SHORTCUT by buying courses that end up on your shelf or equipment that really didn't do what you thought it would (it rarely does) or a guitar that is really not much better than the one you had.

Pick blocking is not a panacea. It is only one of many techniques. It, in and of itself, does not help you play faster. It is an excellent way to play in a legato fashion (all notes begin where the last one ended). It stinks for playing staccatto (e.g., the Crawford example). Use all tools to the best of your ability and spend the time to learn how and when to use which one.
That's all I got to say about that.

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<small>Larry Bell - email: larry@larrybell.org - gigs - Home Page
2000 Fessenden S-12 8x8, 1969 Emmons S-12 6x6, 1971 Emmons D-10 9x9, 1971 Dobro<FONT SIZE=1 COLOR="#8e236b"><p align=CENTER>[This message was edited by Larry Bell on 22 May 2002 at 08:31 AM.]</p></FONT>

Personally I think a player should know how to palm block, both with the ring finger and without, and pick block. They both have their places. I use all of the different techniques during a night of playing.

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My best,
Ernie

The Official Buddy Emmons Website
www.buddyemmons.com

I'm going to print and frame the last two paragraphs of what Larry just wrote....to the door entering my teaching room(eventhough I don't teach in my sisters house after my divorce; but eventually I'll have my own place again ...)....what Larry said and has said in every post is "Golden"....
Jeff has a great analigy on things in such a logical and common since way....it can't go without being noticed.....maybe we all should check our words at the door.
I absolutely agree with Larry(gosh on everything I've read by him)....learn as much as you can on every technique and use them in effective areas as you need them.
Ricky

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<FONT size=2><SMALL>"So what would you guys advise this new player?" </SMALL>
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<FONT size=2><SMALL>"I'd make him aware of the different types of blocking, including left hand
blocking, advise him to try to learn them all.


He'll select what works best for him, but no one technique is correct in all
situations.
I believe you should have all tools available and use what's best
for each situation.</P></SMALL>
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DITTO Joey!

2pT



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TheEarlyDays.com

and appearing regularly...
Jimmy Crawford/Russ Hicks... and Buddy Emmons on Bass! aLotOfSpace.com


<FONT SIZE=1 COLOR="#8e236b"><p align=CENTER>[This message was edited by Terry Wendt on 23 May 2002 at 05:41 PM.]</p></FONT>