The Steel Guitar Forum

I really like what Lee is doing, and he is working from the shoulders of other great players. How do I get instruction on what the heck Lee is doing?

I am not a great player, but I can play in tune and play out some. I'm not too bad, but I really don't understand the technique that Lee is using. I don't "read" music, but I understand chords and some theory behind why they work together.

One time I tried to convince him to make an instructional video. He declined. I don't blame him!

So how do I get in the loop with the 40's-50's West Coast playing? I want a Jeff Newman style video, but with Lee Jeffriess...help!

Hi Rick
Could you name one or two examples of Lee's playing that demonstrate the style you want to learn?...Jerry

I also greatly admire Lee's playing. This can be heard at the website of his band, the West Coast Ramblers, link below. I wonder if his sound can be played on non pedal, as he plays a Wright pedal.

Jim

http://www.westcoastramblers.com/

While I'm not sure of this, I'd bet on it: Lee does not use the pedals much. He is playing the same tuning from his earlier days (E13 and A6) only 1/2 step up (F13 and Bb6).

His work with Big Sandy is my main interest. Stuff off of Jumping From 6 to 6 and Swingin' West albums.

Different Girl, Weary Blues From Waitin', Let Me In There Baby, Music To Her Ears, Too Late To Be True.

Heck any of it!

Rick, I'm a big fan of Lee's playing too. How familiar are you with C6 lap steel tuning? It may not be exactly what he uses but it's based on the same core elements of the tuning. Plus, there's a tone of instruction material already.

Also if haven't already found Vance Terry material to listen to you might look that up. I've read he's a hero/influence on Lee.

Have you read my interview with Lee on my blog?

http://www.mikeneer.com/lapsteelin/2011 ... jeffriess/

Lee is an encyclopedia of music, especially steel guitar stuff. He'd be the first to tell you to check out Speedy West--I'd be the second.

Vance was indeed a big influence on Lee as was Speedy West. Vance said that in studying with Herb Remington, it was very helpful that Herb taught him to play harmonized scales. To unlock some of Lee's ideas you might start with practicing harmonized scales in thirds, sixths, 3-note, 4-note chords - that order. John Ely offers Skype lessons online and is really excellent at breaking this down.

Adding in Lee's sense of swing, time and great taste - well, that's a might harder.
I remember seeing Big Sandy live in the early 90s and toes were already tapping but when Lee's solo kicked in, the audience's leg's were involuntarily stomping. His swinging feel had visibly upped the ante.

I remain interested in the question of how much of Lee's sound depends on pedals. Any thoughts on this? I think Lee may address this in Mike's interview but I wonder what others hear and think.

Jim

Thanks for the above tips and thoughts. I was at a 2-day conference with no reasonable way to get online.

I have read that interview, Mike.

I did consider C6. But what I am really asking for is instructional material in the style of Lee Jeffriess, or something that gets to the heart of his style. Any suggestions?

Andy Volk wrote:
Adding in Lee's sense of swing, time and great taste - well, that's a might harder.

absolutely!
back when merle haggard was utilizing more of a swing band format, no matter how good the song was, it always got better when tiny moore stepped up for his mandolin solo. the feel was infectious.

Rick Abbott wrote:Thanks for the above tips and thoughts. I was at a 2-day conference with no reasonable way to get online.

I have read that interview, Mike.

I did consider C6. But what I am really asking for is instructional material in the style of Lee Jeffriess, or something that gets to the heart of his style. Any suggestions?

Someone can freely disagree with me but I'm thinking that at the heart of this style of playing is the foundation of C6 tuning approach. (Just apply the root principals to the variation tunings.) Not sure you can have a "Jefferies style" without that core knowledge. Ya know?

I'm with you on this direction of playing. It's my interest too. I do think of him as a voice within a larger choir including Vance, Speedy, Joaquin, Herb, etc.

Im with Mike and Nate about the C6 tuning, Im steel just learning but I play in a couple of bands and Im amazing how you can do anything with this tuning and its the core of swing and electric hawaiian music. Once you master this tuning you will understand all the other tunings and can choose one, I personaly choose C13 with the high G, very good for swing and probably very good for Lee style. I would not think about pedal until you master non pedal and I would take lesson with John Ely, he is agreat guy an an amazing teacher, he can teach anything you want.

Gentlemen, I'm sincerely flattered by the adulation, but instructional material from me would be pretty minimal !
I would sincerely recommend that you listen to everyone and everything (within reason).In answer to the questions posed, Jim, I do use pedals, but I wouldn't say I was dependent on them ! I also realize that they can become generic sounding. I honestly believe you are better off if you ''cut your teeth'' without pedals. I would also say I believe that the 13th tuning is more important ! I think having a 6 and 13 tuning, is a lot of music. I agree with Billy Tonnesen's suggestion of thinking of the two tunings ''as one'' and having the tunings a 5th apart helps that, A6/E13 Bb6/F13 C6/G13 etc, There in a common register, I like that there very related and different at the same time.
Lee

Lee,

I half-heartedly tried to see if you'd post some kind of video--3 or 4 years back. My reason was that you seem to have a real gift for 40's-50's West Coast, and there aren't many folks keeping this style going.

Thanks for chiming in. I really appreciate your playing.

I just discovered the Billy Jack Wills thing. Thank you!

BTW, in the mid 1990's did you play a Rickenbacker 208?

Lee, post some examples of how the different turnings are so similar, maybe in tab, and you would also have the start of your instruction book or DVD.
I would certainly enjoy it!

Rick, in the mid 90's I mostly played my 1950 Bigsby T8.
I did, however sub it for a year with a Rickenbacker T8.
Garry, even better, try and find your 6th tuning repertoire on your 13th tuning.Keep doing it until you don't have to think about it (a lick at a time, baby steps) that to me yields the relationships. Its also a little easier to do with the Boggs tuning, strings 1-4 EC#G#F#, A6, EC#AF#.As you can see pretty minimal difference !

Nate Hofer wrote:

Rick Abbott wrote:Thanks for the above tips and thoughts. I was at a 2-day conference with no reasonable way to get online.

I have read that interview, Mike.

I did consider C6. But what I am really asking for is instructional material in the style of Lee Jeffriess, or something that gets to the heart of his style. Any suggestions?

Someone can freely disagree with me but I'm thinking that at the heart of this style of playing is the foundation of C6 tuning approach. (Just apply the root principals to the variation tunings.) Not sure you can have a "Jefferies style" without that core knowledge. Ya know?

I'm with you on this direction of playing. It's my interest too. I do think of him as a voice within a larger choir including Vance, Speedy, Joaquin, Herb, etc.

So, what I'm really getting at is this:

I've been looking around and see a few songs that have tab and backing tracks. What I want is to know if there are any instructional materials that could very visually show me some of Vance, Speedy, Joaquin or Herb's style of playing. If the answer is "no" then, that's the amswer. But if there IS this instruction out there, where do I find it? I understand the "learn scales and harmonizing" thing, I want to SEE something about the actual technique, see being the key. I can listen all day, but I don't live near a teacher and want to see some of this stuff. Tuning is not style or technique?

And of course, thank you for this conversation, it is very appreciated!

Here are a few from me--I made these quite a while ago, so cut me some slack

Slippery Elm: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ccd6k4hM3qg

Flippin' The Lid: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a4w_vzaQO4g&

Steelin' Moonlight: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q8b-oq3CtJw

I will start by saying:

Mike Neer, I apologize for not thanking you for going to the trouble of posting those videos for me. Thank you for doing so!

Been a long time since I posted my original questions. After all this time I have come back to where I was. I wanted to play swing-type music and was not really able to understand what players like Lee were doing. The E13 tuning was entirely beyond me. I've played a lot of music since then, on other tunings.

Yesterday, just yesterday, I listened to some cuts from Brisbane Bop, with Vance Terry. It was a religious experience, basically. Sure, I should have listened to it years and years ago, but I didn't. Now I see why Lee Jeffriess, and everyone else, thinks so highly of him.

Nate Hofer made the statement that without a foundation in C6 there was not much to stand on (my paraphrase), and he was right! I have spent some time with C6 and a wonky version of E13, as well as G6.

All along I avoided McAuliffe E13, or its variants, up till last week. All this time I have tried to have "that sound," while doing everything except use that tuning. I was intimidated by it. Now, I'm not intimidated, I'm humbled. I have learned to spell chords and understand a tiny bit of theory. I can hear when it's what I want, or not. At the time of my original post I was just not willing to do the work, to listen to the advise given or to learn the songs that Lee Jeffriess spent years working out for himself. I suppose we all have to come to this well and drag the bucket up ourselves if we want a drink. Thankfully our steel playing friends and mentors can point us in good directions and offer help, which is what y'all do for any who ask. I really appreciate, now more than ever, the posts you made. Thanks.

Learning the melodies and chord changes to classic Western Swing and Jazz standards looks like the only way forward. And, I've been doing that. Onward and upward!

Lee doing a video is still a good idea, though! Haha

Rick,

Do you have the Cindy Cashdollar 2 dvd Western Swing instructionals? If not, that could help.

I do have it and it does help. I bought Cindy's videos several years ago and they did get me off the ground. At the time of my original post I just didn't know enough to realize the players I admire got their chops by seat time and a burning desire to play. Pretty immature thinking on my part.

Eddie Rivers did a few western swing instructional videos for "Western Swing Rules". They give some really useful tips. Wish I would have had them when I started playing western swing steel guitar in the early 90s but I had to go through the blind process of listening and learning, sink or swim. Here is one of the volumes:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rARCcW3I0K4&t=58s